Dream Formation (2008)

[SOCALHUSKER]

Evident? By what standards? If you show 40 times contrasting Nebraska and Clemson's positional groups...

- OL compared to their OL,

- DL compared to their DL,

- LB's to LB's,

- RB's to RB's,

- TE's to TE's,

- DB's to DB's, etc

I'll wager there's not any measurable difference.

And, if Clemson was supposedly "so much faster" ... :laughpound ... on defense than Nebraska was...then it would stand to reason that the Husker WR's wouldn't have been able to get open against such "superior" speed now would they?

And if Clemson was soooo much faster on offense than Nebraska was on defense the Huskers would've given up 30+ points and lost right?

Go back and watch the game and see Nebraska's "slow" offense outgain, out-pass, out-rush, out-first down and out-score such a "superior" speedy defense.

Furthermore, if Nebraska's offense wouldn't have gift wrapped 21 points for "the superior speed" Clemson then way too slow Nebraska would've blown the Tigers out. I'm sorry that reality and facts don't coincide with your erroneous opinion.

I think it's ridiculously hilarious that you guys are bleating the whole "Clemson was soooo much faster than Nebraska" and your only evidence is that blatherings of the idiots who called the game. Well geez Harv, them there announcers say Clemson is faster so it must be true!

:laughpound

:clap :clap :clap Nice!!!!!! :clap :clap :clap

 

[sdhusker82]

Evident? By what standards? If you show 40 times contrasting Nebraska and Clemson's positional groups...

- OL compared to their OL,

- DL compared to their DL,

- LB's to LB's,

- RB's to RB's,

- TE's to TE's,

- DB's to DB's, etc

I'll wager there's not any measurable difference.

And, if Clemson was supposedly "so much faster" ... :laughpound ... on defense than Nebraska was...then it would stand to reason that the Husker WR's wouldn't have been able to get open against such "superior" speed now would they?

And if Clemson was soooo much faster on offense than Nebraska was on defense the Huskers would've given up 30+ points and lost right?

Go back and watch the game and see Nebraska's "slow" offense outgain, out-pass, out-rush, out-first down and out-score such a "superior" speedy defense.

Furthermore, if Nebraska's offense wouldn't have gift wrapped 21 points for "the superior speed" Clemson then way too slow Nebraska would've blown the Tigers out. I'm sorry that reality and facts don't coincide with your erroneous opinion.

I think it's ridiculously hilarious that you guys are bleating the whole "Clemson was soooo much faster than Nebraska" and your only evidence is that blatherings of the idiots who called the game. Well geez Harv, them there announcers say Clemson is faster so it must be true!

:laughpound

:clap :clap :clap Nice!!!!!! :clap :clap :clap

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say Jen got a little mad...

 

[Red Storm Brewing]

Speed on the field is reaction to the play, burst off the line, and pursuit to the ball. Speed is also shown on special teams, where Clemson wasn't the only team to make us look very slow.

As for the 40 comparisons I believe Kelly, Ford, Spiller, and few others were members of the Clemson track team and Ford and Spiller were very accomplished sprinters.

Other than the various wrinkles teams put in for a bowl game as most do it was the same Clemson team that they saw all year. Davis or Spiller right/left/ both in the backfield at the same time. Yes there may have been some small wrinkles but other than the Coordinator the rest of the offensive staff was intact, so the principles were basically the same.

BTW that O Coordinator, Vic Koenning, ended up at Krap State. And I say will be the successor to old man Snyder in 3-5 years.

Jen, you've made some valid points and yes it probably will be a case of agreeing to disagree, however our team speed, specifically on the defensive side(a point that I probably should have stressed from the outset) is not where it needs to be to resemble not just the title teams of the past but a lot of the defenses that we remember in past seasons. And as unit as a whole was probably slower than Clemson.

Like I said I believe it will hopefully get there.

 

[caveman99]

Speed on the field is reaction to the play, burst off the line, and pursuit to the ball. Speed is also shown on special teams, where Clemson wasn't the only team to make us look very slow.

As for the 40 comparisons I believe Kelly, Ford, Spiller, and few others were members of the Clemson track team and Ford and Spiller were very accomplished sprinters.

Other than the various wrinkles teams put in for a bowl game as most do it was the same Clemson team that they saw all year. Davis or Spiller right/left/ both in the backfield at the same time. Yes there may have been some small wrinkles but other than the Coordinator the rest of the offensive staff was intact, so the principles were basically the same.

BTW that O Coordinator, Vic Koenning, ended up at Krap State. And I say will be the successor to old man Snyder in 3-5 years.

Jen, you've made some valid points and yes it probably will be a case of agreeing to disagree, however our team speed, specifically on the defensive side(a point that I probably should have stressed from the outset) is not where it needs to be to resemble not just the title teams of the past but a lot of the defenses that we remember in past seasons. And as unit as a whole was probably slower than Clemson.

Like I said I believe it will hopefully get there.

Pretty sure Vic Koenning is a D-Coordinator.

 

[drmathprog]

I think they keep score for a reason. <_<

That said, it would certainly make for a shorter game if it consisted of 25 2-player 40-yard foot-races. Award 1 point for each race won. LT vs. LT, QB vs. QB, punter vs. punter, kicker vs. kicker for the first 24 points, and then head coach vs. head coach as a tie breaker.

That would solve the "team speed" question once and for all! :facepalm:

 

[drmathprog]

And yes, VT had greater team speed than NU.

 

[Red Storm Brewing]

Speed on the field is reaction to the play, burst off the line, and pursuit to the ball. Speed is also shown on special teams, where Clemson wasn't the only team to make us look very slow.

As for the 40 comparisons I believe Kelly, Ford, Spiller, and few others were members of the Clemson track team and Ford and Spiller were very accomplished sprinters.

Other than the various wrinkles teams put in for a bowl game as most do it was the same Clemson team that they saw all year. Davis or Spiller right/left/ both in the backfield at the same time. Yes there may have been some small wrinkles but other than the Coordinator the rest of the offensive staff was intact, so the principles were basically the same.

BTW that O Coordinator, Vic Koenning, ended up at Krap State. And I say will be the successor to old man Snyder in 3-5 years.

Jen, you've made some valid points and yes it probably will be a case of agreeing to disagree, however our team speed, specifically on the defensive side(a point that I probably should have stressed from the outset) is not where it needs to be to resemble not just the title teams of the past but a lot of the defenses that we remember in past seasons. And as unit as a whole was probably slower than Clemson.

Like I said I believe it will hopefully get there.

Pretty sure Vic Koenning is a D-Coordinator.

That's what I had thought too, but when the linger of doubt was in my head I grabbed one of those brilliant college football preview mags from last year and went with what they had him listed as at Clemson. I figured they couldn't be wrong ever, I mean this publication did have Georgia as the best team in the country so it is foolproof right?

 

[caveman99]

Speed on the field is reaction to the play, burst off the line, and pursuit to the ball. Speed is also shown on special teams, where Clemson wasn't the only team to make us look very slow.

As for the 40 comparisons I believe Kelly, Ford, Spiller, and few others were members of the Clemson track team and Ford and Spiller were very accomplished sprinters.

Other than the various wrinkles teams put in for a bowl game as most do it was the same Clemson team that they saw all year. Davis or Spiller right/left/ both in the backfield at the same time. Yes there may have been some small wrinkles but other than the Coordinator the rest of the offensive staff was intact, so the principles were basically the same.

BTW that O Coordinator, Vic Koenning, ended up at Krap State. And I say will be the successor to old man Snyder in 3-5 years.

Jen, you've made some valid points and yes it probably will be a case of agreeing to disagree, however our team speed, specifically on the defensive side(a point that I probably should have stressed from the outset) is not where it needs to be to resemble not just the title teams of the past but a lot of the defenses that we remember in past seasons. And as unit as a whole was probably slower than Clemson.

Like I said I believe it will hopefully get there.

Pretty sure Vic Koenning is a D-Coordinator.

That's what I had thought too, but when the linger of doubt was in my head I grabbed one of those brilliant college football preview mags from last year and went with what they had him listed as at Clemson. I figured they couldn't be wrong ever, I mean this publication did have Georgia as the best team in the country so it is foolproof right?

Well that publication obviously has issues, he is definately a D-Coordinator

-From the K-State Football Site

Kansas State Athletic Site

Vic KoenningFootball

Assistant Head Coach/Co-Defensive Coordinator

 

[SECHusker]

QB in shotgun lined up next to RB. 1 WR on the line and 1 off. TE and HB flanking the line.

Projected Starters for this formation

OL: Smith (LT), Williams (LG), Hickman ©, DJ Jones (RG), M. Jones (RT)

WR: Chris Brooks (if he can block he needs to get on the field because he has knack for circus catches), Antonio Bell (presses vertical extremely well, if he can be consistent he needs to be on the field)

HB: Kyler Reed (a mismatch against any LB)

TE: McNeil

QB: Lee

RB: Helu

**Paul has a knack of missing blocks, including the one in the gator bowl that caused the fumble for a TD, Holt does not play with enough aggressiveness for a big guy.

**Reed needs to be on the field for every play (we could use him like UF's Hernandez). I would much rather see our TEs and Reed vs. anyone's LB than our wide receivers vs. somenoe's db. I also think they could be more consistent blockers to spring helu.

 

[sdhusker82]

to get as many threats on the field as possible i want to see a package that has McNeil, Q, Helu, and Mendoza, and whatever WR would fit the play type best (i.e. a good blocker, a burner, or a verticle threat).

This years Wr corps seems to bring a lot of different abilities too so i could also see us going to an empty backfield and having 5 receivers and spreading the ball around, this would also allow Lee or Green to take off and run ( i do it with vince young on Madden all the time, its gotta work right?)

 

[HuskerJen]

And yes, VT had greater team speed than NU.

:facepalm:

This bullsh** argument...again? Really?

Let's cut to the chase...show me 10, 20 and 40 times between NU and VT.

Show me times in the shuttle, cone and other agility drills where Va Tech is measurably faster.

NU's OL vs VT's OL

NU's LB's vs VT's LB's

etc....

 

[huskertim]

Clemson had open receivers running behind defenders, namely West, all day and I recall Ford running alone for a TD before half Jen. Our front four along with Harper's stellar performance helped our secondary out the whole game. Also watch every option play or run that was designed to go outside that was tried, it never happened. One of those slow defenders seemed to have better pitch relation with Ganz on the play he took back to the house. The overkilled, on previous threads, bubble screen play was blown up that KO'd Helu was pure quickness. And Swift is my homeboy, but it wasn't his burners that caught that TD, it was a perfectly placed ball in very good coverage. The Castille runs were designed to cut right up into the interior of the defense(which for non football armchair QB's is the best way to attack a quick defense).

I am a firm believer that Bo will get his skill set players into this defense but it is absolutely laughable if you think that the lack of team speed last year wasn't evident in games we loss.

BTW: scouts had West at 4.34 on the 40 while they have 4.60 for Branden Ford's 40.......I'm just sayin.

 

[huskertim]

The team speed arguement is so subjective. Why did Josh Bullocks go from being a pretty good safety in 02 to the NCAA interception leader in 03, did he get faster? Why is it that Fadian Washington (one of the fastest 40 times in the league) isn't a perrenial pro-bowler?

Maybe football speed isn't best measured in gym shorts. Sure a 4.2 guy has better closing speed on a 4.6 guy, but if he loses .5 seconds decideing how to react, he's toast. Bottom line, knowledge, practice and posistion will always trump running speed in football unless the difference is very big.

As to dream formation, I can't get behind Quad or Quin sets as we simply don't have reliable targets at WR and they aren't geared to utilize the Quin Qb option like TF did in the Fiesta 95 (I'll bet UF fan remembers that one).

I'd like to see us use our TEs to create mismatches, especially McNeal.

Useing limited shift motion to expose coverage and locking defensive personnel into 4-3 or 4-4 sets that they will be unaccustomed to in the pass happy B12. Also,I would love to see Duckie in at H back on occassion just to scare the hell out of those poor little D-backs

 

[huskertim]

How come we never lined up with Lucky in the slot and both helu and q in the back field next to ganz? i just think of the endless list of plays we could have run with all 3 of our rbs on the field.

thoughts?

Actually they did line Lucky in the slot some last year, but I would've liked to see more of it. As to why not Helu and Q in the same backfield, 2 reasons;

1) The biggest advantage to having depth is fresh legs and you don't get that when both are on the field.

2) Neither was particullarly good at blitz pick up (Helu especially) and I'm pretty sure the coaching staff didn't want to order a body bag for Joey G. This point gets overlooked alot but it's pretty hugh. Why do you suppose a guy like Cory Ross stuck with the Ravens for so long even though he never got snaps (yep, you guessed it, blocking).

 

[huzkerbob]

NU is more likely to play 5 TEs this year than 5 WRs. We have the bodies at WR, just not a ton of experience yet.

I am a little surprised by the extreme optimism fans are showing for Mendoza. I know he looked good in the spring, but I don't think that makes him a lock for a starting position. I see him more as a situational guy, a lot of bubble screens and quick slants from the slot. I would like to see him returning kicks because his speed is indisputable. But with all the other weapons NU has on offense, I just don't see him getting more than a half dozen touches a game.

I'm not saying he won't see the field, just that he won't be

(yeah, I know who he plays for) on day one.