Executing the Scheme

[cg_8]

TBH, this sort of reminds me of the start of 2013. LB's were inexperienced. With out LB's being in and out of injuries and our most experienced ones (Banderas and Rose-Ivey being juniors), we have needed a hodgepodge of LB's that have been mostly made up of Sophomores and Freshmen. Dedrick is a Freshman, and Newby is a sophomore.

In 2013, we didn't find the right positions for LB's until later. Santos started the season at MIKE. Banderas started at MIKE, too. After that it was Rose-Ivey, who then finished the season. I mean, Gerry started as a "hybrid" LB, nickelback. Anyone remember that? I think we have a similar issue, and that issue is inexperience.

In 2013, we allowed 600 yards to Wyoming. This year I am seeing some similar issues (allowing crack blocks to be effective, not matching correctly and just plain not quick on recognition that comes with better experience, there is no room for error against QB's who have run their system for 2-3 years already, as was the case with Brad Smith of Wyoming in 2013, and QB from Southern Miss this year).

This won't win some over, as I have barely scratched the surface (I could spend many pages explaining other things like our effectiveness when our interior DL's line up in 0 technique and 4 technique), but it's what I am seeing. This is also a new scheme for these guys. Some of these guys have to learn their own best way to approach this. There's no other way to learn that than during the games. We're watching their learning experiences, and as anyone who learns new things, there will be struggles. There's more to talk about other than the LB's, I know this, I am just merely using this as an example of stuff we have seen before and how growth actually did occur, as I think it did for our LB's in 2013.

The interesting thing to me is this. The offense is waaaaayy further along that I could have imagined. The fact that the game has clicked for those guys on offense should cause applause. I mean, personally, I always saw some of the good in Tommy, but to some other guys, this year is like night and day. That's promising. The fact we saw a FB trap this weekend was great. It showed how versatile we can be. I honestly didn't think we could be so versatile in the run game. Personally, I think our run game would be more effective if Newby was better at running the ball. It's good that he's versatile, but I think he leaves too many yards on the field...

Does anyone else think if we hired a big name guy like Tressel, that similar struggles would have been brushed off? I have a feeling that had that occurred, we would have been more forgiving. Or maybe I'm just crazy... Either way, it's early in the season, we have all new schemes, and we should allow the players to grow into their roles that puts the team in the best position.

 

[Nebhawk]

7 years Bo was here was the first 7 years he had ever been a head coach of a major program. Rile's has 10 months or so at NU, but several years of playing big boy ball including some NFL experience. He also played at Bama, when Bama was, well Bama of the 70's, while Bo played for Earle Bruce, who was Earle Bruce fired coach who couldn't beat Michigan, of OSU.

In a few seasons, if not already next year, you will see the upgrade in talent, scheme, and execution. Heck, when DPE comes back you will see a major upgrade on the field for the offense. Defense will gain some needed muscle when Gangiush comes back.

BYU and Miami are better than Iowa, Minnesota, Purdue, Illini, Rutgers, and possibly Northwestern.

DPE will help a lot. Gangiush will help out a lot, and since the Big 10 isn't pass happy, the last thing to worry about is pass defense.

 

[RedRex]

7 years Bo was here was the first 7 years he had ever been a head coach of a major program. Rile's has 10 months or so at NU, but several years of playing big boy ball including some NFL experience. He also played at Bama, when Bama was, well Bama of the 70's, while Bo played for Earle Bruce, who was Earle Bruce fired coach who couldn't beat Michigan, of OSU.

In a few seasons, if not already next year, you will see the upgrade in talent, scheme, and execution. Heck, when DPE comes back you will see a major upgrade on the field for the offense. Defense will gain some needed muscle when Gangiush comes back.

BYU and Miami are better than Iowa, Minnesota, Purdue, Illini, Rutgers, and possibly Northwestern.

DPE will help a lot. Gangiush will help out a lot, and since the Big 10 isn't pass happy, the last thing to worry about is pass defense.

Yeah, none of those coaches will watch game tape from our first four games... We're golden.

 

[Enhance]

Does anyone else think if we hired a big name guy like Tressel, that similar struggles would have been brushed off? I have a feeling that had that occurred, we would have been more forgiving. Or maybe I'm just crazy... Either way, it's early in the season, we have all new schemes, and we should allow the players to grow into their roles that puts the team in the best position.

If a guy like Tressel, Saban, Carroll, Miles or any other coach who was at one time considered 'elite' coached here I think the fans would be a hell of a lot more forgiving. Riley has never been considered an elite coach and his resume, though extensive, has bright spots and dark spots. It's easy for anyone looking for an outlet to focus in on the flaws and use them as justification for potential failure.

It seems much more logical to give the guy a chance and let him try to figure things out, but I digress...

 

[Redux]

Oh my god, why is the best argument "It's only 4 games, they will get better just because!".

No, you get better by adjusting the scheme and helping the players. The players have to push harder to get better, the coaches have to make the right decisions to put the players in the best position to properly execute.

After 4 games, we have learned that any team can put up 300 yards plus passing against us. Can we quit pretending it isn't an issue?

Who cares the Big Ten isn't a pass happy league??? We bring this weak defense in against most Big ten squads, they have a season high passing day. And if we want to compete post season, it will be against non conference foes. So that kinda makes that idea moot.

 

[Redux]

"But Tommy this,Tommy that! Tommy can win us games!"

Yeah, but I would rather Tommy be able to put the game away in the 4th and relax the last couple series with a comfy lead. This whole aking Tommy to win the game late business is going to wear on the kid. Great as he has been this year, we need more from the rest of the team.

I'm not even excited about Saturdays game. That pains me to say, it really does. I hate being negative. I hate coming here and complaining about sh#t. I would rather talk about how goodnour run D has been, or how the receivers have really stepped up, or how Drew Brown has gotten better etc.

Bu there is a very glaring issue we have to get fixed before we can even begin to think about having a strong conference record this year.

 

[commando]

Oh my god, why is the best argument "It's only 4 games, they will get better just because!".

No, you get better by adjusting the scheme and helping the players. The players have to push harder to get better, the coaches have to make the right decisions to put the players in the best position to properly execute.

After 4 games, we have learned that any team can put up 300 yards plus passing against us. Can we quit pretending it isn't an issue?

Who cares the Big Ten isn't a pass happy league??? We bring this weak defense in against most Big ten squads, they have a season high passing day. And if we want to compete post season, it will be against non conference foes. So that kinda makes that idea moot.

so we can assume that they never will get better because they haven't yet in their first 4 games?

 

[bbhusker]

We also led the conference in giving up passing plays of 20+ yards last year. Food for thought....

 

[desertshox]

7 years Bo was here was the first 7 years he had ever been a head coach of a major program. Rile's has 10 months or so at NU, but several years of playing big boy ball including some NFL experience. He also played at Bama, when Bama was, well Bama of the 70's, while Bo played for Earle Bruce, who was Earle Bruce fired coach who couldn't beat Michigan, of OSU.

In a few seasons, if not already next year, you will see the upgrade in talent, scheme, and execution. Heck, when DPE comes back you will see a major upgrade on the field for the offense. Defense will gain some needed muscle when Gangiush comes back.

BYU and Miami are better than Iowa, Minnesota, Purdue, Illini, Rutgers, and possibly Northwestern.

DPE will help a lot. Gangiush will help out a lot, and since the Big 10 isn't pass happy, the last thing to worry about is pass defense.

Yeah, none of those coaches will watch game tape from our first four games... We're golden.

is that a knock on the coaching prowess of miami's head coach?

 

[JJ Husker]

Oh my god, why is the best argument "It's only 4 games, they will get better just because!".

No, you get better by adjusting the scheme and helping the players. The players have to push harder to get better, the coaches have to make the right decisions to put the players in the best position to properly execute.

After 4 games, we have learned that any team can put up 300 yards plus passing against us. Can we quit pretending it isn't an issue?

Who cares the Big Ten isn't a pass happy league??? We bring this weak defense in against most Big ten squads, they have a season high passing day. And if we want to compete post season, it will be against non conference foes. So that kinda makes that idea moot.

Inpatient children. Maybe if you stomped your feet and shed a few tears they would magically play better, sooner.
Do you really not understand the value of time in a new system? It's not "just because", time is required to allow the players to learn, practice, recognize, repetition, etc. Of course more than 4 games or 10 months will help. Time will also be required to get rid of the guys that aren't best for these new systems and to get new guys who are. This ain't Google or a text message that happens virtually immediately. It. Takes. Time.

And who is saying there aren't problems with our pass defense? Of course there are problems. Everyone sees them. No pass rush or pressure on the qb. We've got corners being asked to play on an island and so far they have not been able to do it. Some of it is scheme and some of it is talent. Time is required to tweak scheme issues and a lot more time will be required to change talent levels. Is this scheme not basically what MSU uses? So, you tell me what the more likely culprit of the problem is. It's been 10 months and 4 frikken games, that's it. This instant gratification society can be a real problem when people can't realize some things take time.

 

[NUinID]

Oh my god, why is the best argument "It's only 4 games, they will get better just because!".

No, you get better by adjusting the scheme and helping the players. The players have to push harder to get better, the coaches have to make the right decisions to put the players in the best position to properly execute.

After 4 games, we have learned that any team can put up 300 yards plus passing against us. Can we quit pretending it isn't an issue?

Who cares the Big Ten isn't a pass happy league??? We bring this weak defense in against most Big ten squads, they have a season high passing day. And if we want to compete post season, it will be against non conference foes. So that kinda makes that idea moot.

Wow, this is a one man pity party. There is no quick fix to the pass defense, there just isn't. We knew going in that more yards were going to be given in the pass game than in the past. We knew this because of the style of defense that was going to be played.

This defense takes lock down corners, right now we don't have this. Check out MSU's passing numbers so far this year, they are ranked around 100. How can that be, you say they are so dominate, Dantonio is the man, well they are missing 2 lock down corners also.

This defense in the pass game needs experienced linebackers that know what to do. Well we haven't started the same set of linebackers in any of the first four games. Our 2 most experienced backers have played in 2 games each and only in part of one game together. Saturday against S. Miss Nebraska started a true freshman, a red shirt sophomore with less career starts than the true freshman, and a walk on sophomore that no one had heard of until this season. The first guy in off the bench was a red shirt freshman who played safety last year. Lets let all that sink in right now.

This defense requires a good pass rush from the edge. Well, the best pass rusher from the edge is a red shirt freshman that played TE last year. The next best pass rusher from the end is hurt right now.

Now with all that being said, they need to start playing better. I think it will start this weekend. I look to see them hold Lunt to less than 300 passing. That will be improvement. They will make steady improvement.

You have to have faith.

 

[DomiNUs]

What's the difference? The amount of time? There is no other difference in that statement that I can make out. Does this mean that MR gets seven years before we can recognize that the players aren't executing the scheme efficiently or effectively?

So, in your opinion, there's no difference between someone being a head coach at a university for 7 years and one being a head coach at a university for about 10 months?

Do you also bake cookies and take them out of the oven after 1 minute, or do you wait and see what they become?

We saw what one coach had become. We're still waiting to see what the other is capable of.

Besides the amount of time each coach has had at the helm, there is no difference. That is what the OP was getting at, I think. I never said anything about what I thought the difference between them was. I am still trying to figure out exactly what we are supposed to be talking about here.

BTW, depending on the type of cookies you are baking determines the amount of time they stay in the oven. Unless of course, they are no-bake cookies, which require no time to wait and see what they become.

 

[Redux]

I remember when Bo was hired. He could do no wrong either. Mike Riley is seasoned enough to know that if something isn't working, you have to fix it. I just want to see that happen. Call it a pity party, I don't really care. I just want to see our program succeed and perform better.

How many more games of 300+ yards passing do we surrender before the charm wears off and we can go "Hey, this isn't just a slow fix, something is wrong"?

Illinois is kind of a mess right now. We should win this game handily. We are a much more talented team, we have a better coaching staff and we may honestly have more fans in attendance. I still don't think we cruise to an easy win. If we do, great! I'm just not expecting it.

You guys sit here and be pissy for me questioning it all ya want. You both glossed over the fact I mentioned next year could be special, thats kinda what having faith means isn't it? I just don't see this year ending well at this point until some fixes happen.

 

[Redux]

Oh my god, why is the best argument "It's only 4 games, they will get better just because!".

No, you get better by adjusting the scheme and helping the players. The players have to push harder to get better, the coaches have to make the right decisions to put the players in the best position to properly execute.

After 4 games, we have learned that any team can put up 300 yards plus passing against us. Can we quit pretending it isn't an issue?

Who cares the Big Ten isn't a pass happy league??? We bring this weak defense in against most Big ten squads, they have a season high passing day. And if we want to compete post season, it will be against non conference foes. So that kinda makes that idea moot.

Inpatient children. Maybe if you stomped your feet and shed a few tears they would magically play better, sooner.Do you really not understand the value of time in a new system? It's not "just because", time is required to allow the players to learn, practice, recognize, repetition, etc. Of course more than 4 games or 10 months will help. Time will also be required to get rid of the guys that aren't best for these new systems and to get new guys who are. This ain't Google or a text message that happens virtually immediately. It. Takes. Time.

And who is saying there aren't problems with our pass defense? Of course there are problems. Everyone sees them. No pass rush or pressure on the qb. We've got corners being asked to play on an island and so far they have not been able to do it. Some of it is scheme and some of it is talent. Time is required to tweak scheme issues and a lot more time will be required to change talent levels. Is this scheme not basically what MSU uses? So, you tell me what the more likely culprit of the problem is. It's been 10 months and 4 frikken games, that's it. This instant gratification society can be a real problem when people can't realize some things take time.

So we see problems, we just aren't allowed to address them on a public forum. If we do, we are an angry child. Got it.

 

[SuperBigFan69]

The difference between Riley and Bo? When Riley says they aren't executing, he says that's on the coaching staff for not teaching the players better.

Totally agree...but if it is on the coaches and they have been doing it for a billion years...isn't that a huge problem?

With that said...I see Riley winning the west this year!