Healthcare Reform

RedDenver said:
So you're discounting the study because you want more fine grained details, but you're perfectly fine with your own personal belief in something without any supporting evidence, let alone the fine grained details you're asking for in the other case? I get being skeptical of the conclusions of the study but having the opposite conclusions based on little to nothing seems... hypocritical is too strong... maybe unbalanced? illogical? You get what I'm trying to say, I think.
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No I don’t get what your saying because what I said was “I believe” and absolutely said it was anecdotal and not studied.  That’s just my opinion that someone can agree with or disagree with and I don’t represent it as some scientific apples to apples comparison. I never made a claim based on irrelevant data points like the people in your study you showed are trying to do.  See the difference.   The old adage about statistics seems like it very well may apply to them.  

 
BigRedBuster said:
Understand. In large part, unfortunately, that’s all we have. 
 

It just reminded me of a political talking point I constantly heard when I was a Fox News/Rush junky. 
 

Everything is great in ‘merica. We would never want to do anything like those Euros. 
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I feel like there are definitely things that could improve our system without having to totally trash it and overhaul it.  
 

I also don’t believe the outcomes based rankings are nearly what is being portrayed because I don’t ever see people normalize the data so it’s consistent between countries.  
 

 
Archy1221 said:
No I don’t get what your saying because what I said was “I believe” and absolutely said it was anecdotal and not studied.  That’s just my opinion that someone can agree with or disagree with and I don’t represent it as some scientific apples to apples comparison. I never made a claim based on irrelevant data points like the people in your study you showed are trying to do.  See the difference.   The old adage about statistics seems like it very well may apply to them.  
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I didn't see your anecdotal post until after my post. I'd think the study data would be more convincing than your internal belief or anecdotal data. But I get what you're saying - study data not strong or convincing enough to change your prior belief.

 
BigRedBuster said:
Understand. In large part, unfortunately, that’s all we have. 
 

It just reminded me of a political talking point I constantly heard when I was a Fox News/Rush junky. 
 

Everything is great in ‘merica. We would never want to do anything like those Euros. 
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Oh wow, were you really?!  I never got into Rush, and still avoid most of the shows on Fox News.  The 5 is sometimes entertaining.  But I will watch fox when a president goes live (Bush/Obama/Trump/Biden). 

A guy on my construction crew had infowars always playing (few years ago).  I listened here and there (but hated Alex Jones).  Haven't heard it since.

Sorry for the interruption on healthcare reform.  I will exit stage B now.

 
RedDenver said:
But I get what you're saying - study data not strong or convincing enough to change your prior belief.
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This and probably add to support the studies conclusion. 
 

I would love to see a more apples to apples comparison and see if my mind would change based on that type of data between our system and a nationalized healthcare system.  

 
I think it's a great option ... depending on what sort of medication you take and what for.  It would only be an option for patients whose medicine has a generic equivalent.  

The FDA only requires that a generic drug show bioequivalence to the brand, there is no data required showing efficacy, safety etc.  And I believe it only has to be like 89-99% bioequivalence typically based on blood level measures.  If you have allergies and the drug you take is 89% as efficatious as the branded drug you'd probably be ok, and if you weren't it would simply be some break through allergy symptoms.  Similarly with something like Viagra - you'd probably deal ok with a generic option that was pretty close to perfect.   But for those who take cardiovascular medication, or lung meds, seizure medication, oncology etc any amount of variability in efficacy or increase in side effects could mean a life or death situation.   

So great option for the right patients imo.  The info above is why I also have issue with insurance companies requiring generic use if there's an option in a particular drug class.  Not everything is equal, and not every drug works for everyone even if they have the same mechanism of action and some folks can't and shouldn't have to risk that.  

 
I don't know if I ever posted anything about this, but right after Christmas 2020, my wife and I were in a really back rollover accident on the interstate in Iowa. We ended up getting a $42,000 bill from her insurance because her ICU treatments weren't "cleared with her insurance provider ahead of time." She ended up having 27 staples in her scalp and multiple pins in her elbow to repair the broken bones. Not to mention some of her shoulder muscles are gone. After almost 2 full years of f#&%ing around with the hospital and the insurance company, we got an update today that we'll only have to pay her Co-pay of $750! 

We're thrilled with the end result but the fact that we had to screw around with this s#!t is absolutely ridiculous 

 
GSG said:
I don't know if I ever posted anything about this, but right after Christmas 2020, my wife and I were in a really back rollover accident on the interstate in Iowa. We ended up getting a $42,000 bill from her insurance because her ICU treatments weren't "cleared with her insurance provider ahead of time." She ended up having 27 staples in her scalp and multiple pins in her elbow to repair the broken bones. Not to mention some of her shoulder muscles are gone. After almost 2 full years of f#&%ing around with the hospital and the insurance company, we got an update today that we'll only have to pay her Co-pay of $750! 

We're thrilled with the end result but the fact that we had to screw around with this s#!t is absolutely ridiculous 
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Wow...sorry to hear about the accident.  Glad you both are still alive.  And, glad you got the bill figured out.  However, it's asinine that it takes so long to get something like this worked out.

 
BigRedBuster said:
Wow...sorry to hear about the accident.  Glad you both are still alive.  And, glad you got the bill figured out.  However, it's asinine that it takes so long to get something like this worked out.
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Thanks man! 

It was a lot of BS. They kept trying to treat it like it was all elective procedures. I'm just glad it's all settled. 

 
BigRedBuster said:
However, it's asinine that it takes so long to get something like this worked out.
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And it’s not just the insurers taking so long. My wife dislocated/fractured her elbow and needed surgery. It maxed out her max out of pocket for the year.  4 to 5 months after the surgery we were still getting new bills. The insurer started to disallow the charges for the surgeon’s office, questioning if certain people assisted etc. So the provider started sending us the bills. Ironically they were in network providers. I had to call the surgeons office and the insurer to tell them both that they needed to figure it out cuz we weren’t paying anything, already hit our max so it was between them. Healthcare and insurance is an absolute CF.

 
Archy1221 said:
Ummmmm no.  Remember the whole Kavanaugh is a rapist bulls#!t?  Remember the whole Kavanaugh worked on the I ton impeachment so he will be extreme right judge?

Remember the whole Handsmade Tail during the ACB nomination?    Much more than process bulls#!t pulled out by the media and left
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Archy1221 said:
Good.  Would you agree then it wasn’t just outrage over the selection process but also made up bulls#!t allegations by the left along with them being pissed about the timeline. 
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Well this aged like milk.

 
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