How good can we be with TM under center next year?

[bshirt]

The "variable" you forgot to mention is Miller going out. It was a great comeback, the best in NU history. Kudo's to the staff and kids. I never dismissed the comeback. I simply do not believe that with a player as dynamic as Miller still in the game we lose.

Cally's O did get shredded by great D's. NO doubt, But I still do not think we are offensive juggernaut that can score at will. USC anyone? Wisky? You can point to drops, fumbles etc......but those are variables. I choose to point out the negatives I see and you point out the positives.

I stand by my comments about Lee. Someone mentioned OSU (Okie) unsure how we can say we lose that game with him in. I say against OU, a healthy Lee would have gotten the W and against A&M as well. It was in comments about a "game manager" and a good D. After the Bowl game against Arizona, I think we saw a little more of what Lee could do. Second year in the system, senior etc.... Still unsure if he was ever injured in 2010? Again, my opinion. JUst like everything else on this board, opinions. I also wonder how many wins we would have had if not for Henery and his leg?

I do not think I have really bashed Martinez. I said that "he will not lose us a game, or he is not a game changer, he is getting better, the staff doesn't play to his strengths, can't jule, can't run true option etc...........I have also said that he has the potential to be very good (need improvements again all around him) I have also said that this team has numerous issues that I do not think will be fixed in year. It will take a while. We are young on both sides of the ball, we are or did start several walk-ons.

Again, in my opinion, for a myriad of answers, we are good for 3-4 losses again next year. Is Martinez an issue, absolutely, BUT so is not having a kid having taken a meaningful live snap as center in approx 3 yrs, the loss of David, Fonzie, WR's dropping passes, a new DL coach (I will save my opinion), an unproven OC, talent issues (see comments from Raymond), lack of depth and development (development meaning not playing, BUT IMPROVING) etc..... I am just not a big Martinez fan. Do I support him as a Husker? Sure. As the QB, who handles the ball on every play, he is an easy target. Remember folks feelings of Frost, J Lo etc.... Just like countless other Huskers I did not "like", but still support(ed) as they are Huskers. Doesn't mean that I will not add my opinion, positive or negative, but will still cheer for them on Saturdays.

If he becomes the next TF or EC, I will eat crow, but I just do not see it happening unless there are numerous improvements across the board. He holds numerous NU records, but for approximately 2 yrs now he has been the O or at least a focal point. We throw more now. we do not have the playmekers across the board that former Husker greats had. Stats tell a story, but only part.

Yeah, I hear ya and you've got some good insights. I just think Tmart is a much more positive asset to our leaking ship than your take. That's fine.

The upside my friend is that next year we'll "finally" start getting some serious talent in the trenches. Also, start developing a little depth. That's a very, very good thing coming around the bend. Now, if we can just learn to catch the ball.......

 

[bshirt]

I think we all need to settle down and see this team for what it really is. We're a jeckyl and hyde team. When the lightswitch is on, the OL opens holes, the receivers make receptions, and the defense makes good stops. When the lightswitch goes off, the OL makes one blunder after the other, receivers drop passes, the defense is out of position, etc. We can and do gain yards on good/great defenses. However, we can also look incompetent to extremely poor defenses. Our defense can stop good/great offenses. Yet, they can also make very mediocre offenses and QB's look outstanding. Our first couple games of the 2011 season, we made a couple of QB's look like Heisman contenders. I don't necessarily think this is a player problem especially just one player. What everyone on the coaching staff and team needs to figure out in the offseason is how and why the lightswitch goes off. I would agree that we don't have the talent to compete week in and week out with teams like LSU and Alabama. However, I don't agree that we don't have enough talent to compete with the likes of Boise State, KState, Virginia Tech, etc. There's absolutely zero reason we can't fight for a top 10 ranking.

I think this post nails it on the head. We can beat almost anybody. Or lose to almost anybody.

Our Oline can gell vs Michigan st, Ohio St, etc or get totally stuffed vs freakin NW. Our wrs can drop passes with the greatest of ease vs anybody. Our defense can shut down almost anybody or get overwhelmed by Fresno St, Michigan, NW, etc. Fully agree the light switch is the key. "Maybe" a big part of the light switch problem is talent and depth on the trenches? If so, we should start to slowly resolve that problem this year.

Also fully agree that top10 is a realistic goal we can hack.

This happens to a lot of teams. You'll see em play great one week then have a down week against a marginal team. The one common denominator you usually see is that they've been outcoached. Wanna figure out why the light was off against Fresno St? Beacuse Hill outcoached Pelini the better part of that game? Michigan? Because Mattison/Hoke outcoached Beck. NW? Because Ftiz can outcoach Pelini 3 out of 4 games.

Someone (maybe the Herald) needs to go through the staffs of our oponents next year. Look at the experience (not just of the HC but of the assistants). I think you'll see really quickly which games might not have the lights on. It's unfortunately...but we WILL get outcoached (as a staff) 4-5 times next season. We won't lose all, and we might lose some where we're not outcoached...but how many times through the 70's, 80's, 90's, etc...did we go into a game knowing we were going to be outcoached? Rarely. Happens all the time now.

Well, knapplc already posted what I was thinking but I would add it's a very, very, very big asset for our coaches in many ways when our big uglies start to consistently win more of the trench warfare battles. That we don't have to play walk-ons everywhere on the Oline anymore will really help them boatloads, imo. Some production from our DEs would be a huge help as well.

My guess is that we'll get "outcoached" far less frequently when we have more talent and then gradually get some depth for line play.

But who knows? We'll see.....

 

[robsker]

May as well chime in.

Just how good TM will be is uncertain... and maybe not that overly connected to what limits NU. First, on the offensive side of the ball --- our OL is likely below 4-5 teams in the conference. Our WR's are no better than 5th or 6th in the conference. Our RB's are near the top. Our Game plan is hard to measure --- but lack of focus, penalties, dropped passes and turnovers all limit this offense. Now... sure TM is pretty limited (or has been) in terms of what he can do. If he overcomes his timidity and is no longer hesitant running the ball and improves overall a bit --- that will help. But the OL, the Wr's. The penalties, drops, fumbles, lack of passion/focus (if those things continue) will severely limit this offense. So... TM is only one of many things that need improvement.

Defensively we have issues too.

Overall, Michigan, Ohio State and Wisconsin will, overall, be beyond (perhaps well beyond) what NU will be able to contend with. MSU and NU may be pretty close... though they have some momentum we do not. So... TM and his performance, whatever that might be.... will not move us in the pecking order much... if at all. The Huskers again will --- at the national level --- not be in any NC conversations, or in any conversations regarding BiG championship... or likely in the conversation re: the Legends Division title (Michigan will be prohibitive favorites). The only real attainable thing for NU next year is the potential to finish the season ranked --- I think they have a reasonable shot --- and just about as reasonable a shot not to make it.

Will TM's play maybe swing us into the top 25 at seasons end --- or move us just outside the top 25? maybe. But probably more the deciding factor will be the teams general focus, the teams turnover margin and the performance of the OL. TM will not be the biggest determining factor by any means.

 

[HuskerShark]

May as well chime in.

Just how good TM will be is uncertain... and maybe not that overly connected to what limits NU. First, on the offensive side of the ball --- our OL is likely below 4-5 teams in the conference. Our WR's are no better than 5th or 6th in the conference. Our RB's are near the top. Our Game plan is hard to measure --- but lack of focus, penalties, dropped passes and turnovers all limit this offense. Now... sure TM is pretty limited (or has been) in terms of what he can do. If he overcomes his timidity and is no longer hesitant running the ball and improves overall a bit --- that will help. But the OL, the Wr's. The penalties, drops, fumbles, lack of passion/focus (if those things continue) will severely limit this offense. So... TM is only one of many things that need improvement.

Defensively we have issues too.

Overall, Michigan, Ohio State and Wisconsin will, overall, be beyond (perhaps well beyond) what NU will be able to contend with. MSU and NU may be pretty close... though they have some momentum we do not. So... TM and his performance, whatever that might be.... will not move us in the pecking order much... if at all. The Huskers again will --- at the national level --- not be in any NC conversations, or in any conversations regarding BiG championship... or likely in the conversation re: the Legends Division title (Michigan will be prohibitive favorites). The only real attainable thing for NU next year is the potential to finish the season ranked --- I think they have a reasonable shot --- and just about as reasonable a shot not to make it.

Will TM's play maybe swing us into the top 25 at seasons end --- or move us just outside the top 25? maybe. But probably more the deciding factor will be the teams general focus, the teams turnover margin and the performance of the OL. TM will not be the biggest determining factor by any means.

With those low expectations, it makes it easy for the team to have a successful season.

 

[robsker]

May as well chime in.

Just how good TM will be is uncertain... and maybe not that overly connected to what limits NU. First, on the offensive side of the ball --- our OL is likely below 4-5 teams in the conference. Our WR's are no better than 5th or 6th in the conference. Our RB's are near the top. Our Game plan is hard to measure --- but lack of focus, penalties, dropped passes and turnovers all limit this offense. Now... sure TM is pretty limited (or has been) in terms of what he can do. If he overcomes his timidity and is no longer hesitant running the ball and improves overall a bit --- that will help. But the OL, the Wr's. The penalties, drops, fumbles, lack of passion/focus (if those things continue) will severely limit this offense. So... TM is only one of many things that need improvement.

Defensively we have issues too.

Overall, Michigan, Ohio State and Wisconsin will, overall, be beyond (perhaps well beyond) what NU will be able to contend with. MSU and NU may be pretty close... though they have some momentum we do not. So... TM and his performance, whatever that might be.... will not move us in the pecking order much... if at all. The Huskers again will --- at the national level --- not be in any NC conversations, or in any conversations regarding BiG championship... or likely in the conversation re: the Legends Division title (Michigan will be prohibitive favorites). The only real attainable thing for NU next year is the potential to finish the season ranked --- I think they have a reasonable shot --- and just about as reasonable a shot not to make it.

Will TM's play maybe swing us into the top 25 at seasons end --- or move us just outside the top 25? maybe. But probably more the deciding factor will be the teams general focus, the teams turnover margin and the performance of the OL. TM will not be the biggest determining factor by any means.

With those low expectations, it makes it easy for the team to have a successful season.

Well.... we'll see!

These were my expectations for the past tow years as well --- and, each of the past two years there NU was at season's end --- not in the NC, conference, or division championship picture --- and just eking out a top 25 ranking at the conclusion of the season (and this year, it was really really close). So... what I am saying... basically... is that NU is very likely going to be upper-middle of the conference --- again --- # 4 or #5 in the conference and the main real question is will NU end up ranked (the very issue that was the case these last two years.)

Will NU do better than what is described above? Maybe... but I seriously doubt it. Certainly nothing objective suggests things for NU will change positionally --- NU has been, and will continue to be a upper-mid level (#4/#5 in the conference type team ... hoping to finished in the top 25. perception is everything --- only died in the wool Husker fans see our program as being more than what is described in this and my last post --- others, elsewhere --- those who have no stake in the matter and simply assess what is there will describe NU pretty much as being a fringe top 25 program... maybe there... maybe not.

And... it will be far from easy for NU to do much better than described.

 

[HuskerShark]

May as well chime in.

Just how good TM will be is uncertain... and maybe not that overly connected to what limits NU. First, on the offensive side of the ball --- our OL is likely below 4-5 teams in the conference. Our WR's are no better than 5th or 6th in the conference. Our RB's are near the top. Our Game plan is hard to measure --- but lack of focus, penalties, dropped passes and turnovers all limit this offense. Now... sure TM is pretty limited (or has been) in terms of what he can do. If he overcomes his timidity and is no longer hesitant running the ball and improves overall a bit --- that will help. But the OL, the Wr's. The penalties, drops, fumbles, lack of passion/focus (if those things continue) will severely limit this offense. So... TM is only one of many things that need improvement.

Defensively we have issues too.

Overall, Michigan, Ohio State and Wisconsin will, overall, be beyond (perhaps well beyond) what NU will be able to contend with. MSU and NU may be pretty close... though they have some momentum we do not. So... TM and his performance, whatever that might be.... will not move us in the pecking order much... if at all. The Huskers again will --- at the national level --- not be in any NC conversations, or in any conversations regarding BiG championship... or likely in the conversation re: the Legends Division title (Michigan will be prohibitive favorites). The only real attainable thing for NU next year is the potential to finish the season ranked --- I think they have a reasonable shot --- and just about as reasonable a shot not to make it.

Will TM's play maybe swing us into the top 25 at seasons end --- or move us just outside the top 25? maybe. But probably more the deciding factor will be the teams general focus, the teams turnover margin and the performance of the OL. TM will not be the biggest determining factor by any means.

With those low expectations, it makes it easy for the team to have a successful season.

Well.... we'll see!

These were my expectations for the past tow years as well --- and, each of the past two years there NU was at season's end --- not in the NC, conference, or division championship picture

For what it's worth, last year Nebraska won the Big12 North division and should have beaten Oklahoma in the CCG and won the conference title. If we would have won, we could have played UConn in a BCS bowl and most likely ended the year on a high note, likely in the top 10. Instead, we pissed the 2nd half of the CCG down our leg and layed an egg vs a team that we never should have been matched up against in the bowl game.

In fact, had we played well against Texas or aTm, we would have been undefeated, pushing for a bid in the national championship. It all comes down to that one word that so many fans hate so much: EXECUTION. Bo knows what he is talking about, and one of these days, we will see a Husker football team that executes and wins every game on the schedule. It's a difficult thing to do, but I am still a Boliever, and I think that is where this team is headed with Bo sooner than later.

 

[MLB 51]

I think it was said that we would have drew Stanford. Somethig to do with bowl tie-ins.

 

[robsker]

May as well chime in.

Just how good TM will be is uncertain... and maybe not that overly connected to what limits NU. First, on the offensive side of the ball --- our OL is likely below 4-5 teams in the conference. Our WR's are no better than 5th or 6th in the conference. Our RB's are near the top. Our Game plan is hard to measure --- but lack of focus, penalties, dropped passes and turnovers all limit this offense. Now... sure TM is pretty limited (or has been) in terms of what he can do. If he overcomes his timidity and is no longer hesitant running the ball and improves overall a bit --- that will help. But the OL, the Wr's. The penalties, drops, fumbles, lack of passion/focus (if those things continue) will severely limit this offense. So... TM is only one of many things that need improvement.

Defensively we have issues too.

Overall, Michigan, Ohio State and Wisconsin will, overall, be beyond (perhaps well beyond) what NU will be able to contend with. MSU and NU may be pretty close... though they have some momentum we do not. So... TM and his performance, whatever that might be.... will not move us in the pecking order much... if at all. The Huskers again will --- at the national level --- not be in any NC conversations, or in any conversations regarding BiG championship... or likely in the conversation re: the Legends Division title (Michigan will be prohibitive favorites). The only real attainable thing for NU next year is the potential to finish the season ranked --- I think they have a reasonable shot --- and just about as reasonable a shot not to make it.

Will TM's play maybe swing us into the top 25 at seasons end --- or move us just outside the top 25? maybe. But probably more the deciding factor will be the teams general focus, the teams turnover margin and the performance of the OL. TM will not be the biggest determining factor by any means.

With those low expectations, it makes it easy for the team to have a successful season.

Well.... we'll see!

These were my expectations for the past tow years as well --- and, each of the past two years there NU was at season's end --- not in the NC, conference, or division championship picture

For what it's worth, last year Nebraska won the Big12 North division and should have beaten Oklahoma in the CCG and won the conference title. If we would have won, we could have played UConn in a BCS bowl and most likely ended the year on a high note, likely in the top 10. Instead, we pissed the 2nd half of the CCG down our leg and layed an egg vs a team that we never should have been matched up against in the bowl game.

In fact, had we played well against Texas or aTm, we would have been undefeated, pushing for a bid in the national championship. It all comes down to that one word that so many fans hate so much: EXECUTION. Bo knows what he is talking about, and one of these days, we will see a Husker football team that executes and wins every game on the schedule. It's a difficult thing to do, but I am still a Boliever, and I think that is where this team is headed with Bo sooner than later.

Good for you Shark. I like the enthusiasm and the hopeful expectations. And... you may be right about the future. In fact, I hope you are.

The past is the best --- in particular, the immediate past --- is the best predictor of the future. On that basis, the Huskers next year aspiring to much more than essentially what happened this year... is not very reasonable. This coaching staff that you are a believer in has not produced a focused, polished, intense, fundamentally sound team yet --- not on any consistent basis. It has not often made halftime adjustments as well as our opponents. And the talent level differential relative to the conference elite (like OSU, Michigan & Wisconsin) is, probably (though this is hard to measure) going in the wrong direction --- that is, the talent gap that these programs have over NU is widening rather than narrowing. Again, time will tell..

Back to the original topic. I do not think that TM's personal performance will change much re: where NU lands in the conference. If he improves somewhat we still end up #4 or #5 in conference. If he stays the same... NU lands, probably, in the same spot. The bigger determining factors are again team preparedness (are they focused, will they play hard all game, will they be fundamentally sound and catch passes better, create turnovers more, limit penalties, and will the coaches make adjustments better than our opponents, etc.) --- these things will more decide where NU lands than TM's performance. And... nothing from the immediate past would suggest a massive improvement in these areas. But... there is always hope.

 

[melscott62]

May as well chime in.

Just how good TM will be is uncertain... and maybe not that overly connected to what limits NU. First, on the offensive side of the ball --- our OL is likely below 4-5 teams in the conference. Our WR's are no better than 5th or 6th in the conference. Our RB's are near the top. Our Game plan is hard to measure --- but lack of focus, penalties, dropped passes and turnovers all limit this offense. Now... sure TM is pretty limited (or has been) in terms of what he can do. If he overcomes his timidity and is no longer hesitant running the ball and improves overall a bit --- that will help. But the OL, the Wr's. The penalties, drops, fumbles, lack of passion/focus (if those things continue) will severely limit this offense. So... TM is only one of many things that need improvement.

Defensively we have issues too.

Overall, Michigan, Ohio State and Wisconsin will, overall, be beyond (perhaps well beyond) what NU will be able to contend with. MSU and NU may be pretty close... though they have some momentum we do not. So... TM and his performance, whatever that might be.... will not move us in the pecking order much... if at all. The Huskers again will --- at the national level --- not be in any NC conversations, or in any conversations regarding BiG championship... or likely in the conversation re: the Legends Division title (Michigan will be prohibitive favorites). The only real attainable thing for NU next year is the potential to finish the season ranked --- I think they have a reasonable shot --- and just about as reasonable a shot not to make it.

Will TM's play maybe swing us into the top 25 at seasons end --- or move us just outside the top 25? maybe. But probably more the deciding factor will be the teams general focus, the teams turnover margin and the performance of the OL. TM will not be the biggest determining factor by any means.

as young as those positions are I think it will be hard to judge. I could see any of those young guys stepping up and becoming one of the best WR in the league. when you add in westerkamp and allen into the mix next year.... thats a ton of young talent(I cant think of the last time we have had this much). the key to the whole thing is catching the ball. the line is similar to a lesser extent.

 

[Polarhusker]

May as well chime in.

Just how good TM will be is uncertain... and maybe not that overly connected to what limits NU. First, on the offensive side of the ball --- our OL is likely below 4-5 teams in the conference. Our WR's are no better than 5th or 6th in the conference. Our RB's are near the top. Our Game plan is hard to measure --- but lack of focus, penalties, dropped passes and turnovers all limit this offense. Now... sure TM is pretty limited (or has been) in terms of what he can do. If he overcomes his timidity and is no longer hesitant running the ball and improves overall a bit --- that will help. But the OL, the Wr's. The penalties, drops, fumbles, lack of passion/focus (if those things continue) will severely limit this offense. So... TM is only one of many things that need improvement.

Defensively we have issues too.

Overall, Michigan, Ohio State and Wisconsin will, overall, be beyond (perhaps well beyond) what NU will be able to contend with. MSU and NU may be pretty close... though they have some momentum we do not. So... TM and his performance, whatever that might be.... will not move us in the pecking order much... if at all. The Huskers again will --- at the national level --- not be in any NC conversations, or in any conversations regarding BiG championship... or likely in the conversation re: the Legends Division title (Michigan will be prohibitive favorites). The only real attainable thing for NU next year is the potential to finish the season ranked --- I think they have a reasonable shot --- and just about as reasonable a shot not to make it.

Will TM's play maybe swing us into the top 25 at seasons end --- or move us just outside the top 25? maybe. But probably more the deciding factor will be the teams general focus, the teams turnover margin and the performance of the OL. TM will not be the biggest determining factor by any means.

With those low expectations, it makes it easy for the team to have a successful season.

Well.... we'll see!

These were my expectations for the past tow years as well --- and, each of the past two years there NU was at season's end --- not in the NC, conference, or division championship picture

For what it's worth, last year Nebraska won the Big12 North division and should have beaten Oklahoma in the CCG and won the conference title. If we would have won, we could have played UConn in a BCS bowl and most likely ended the year on a high note, likely in the top 10. Instead, we pissed the 2nd half of the CCG down our leg and layed an egg vs a team that we never should have been matched up against in the bowl game.

In fact, had we played well against Texas or aTm, we would have been undefeated, pushing for a bid in the national championship. It all comes down to that one word that so many fans hate so much: EXECUTION. Bo knows what he is talking about, and one of these days, we will see a Husker football team that executes and wins every game on the schedule. It's a difficult thing to do, but I am still a Boliever, and I think that is where this team is headed with Bo sooner than later.

Good for you Shark. I like the enthusiasm and the hopeful expectations. And... you may be right about the future. In fact, I hope you are.

The past is the best --- in particular, the immediate past --- is the best predictor of the future. On that basis, the Huskers next year aspiring to much more than essentially what happened this year... is not very reasonable. This coaching staff that you are a believer in has not produced a focused, polished, intense, fundamentally sound team yet --- not on any consistent basis. It has not often made halftime adjustments as well as our opponents. And the talent level differential relative to the conference elite (like OSU, Michigan & Wisconsin) is, probably (though this is hard to measure) going in the wrong direction --- that is, the talent gap that these programs have over NU is widening rather than narrowing. Again, time will tell..

Back to the original topic. I do not think that TM's personal performance will change much re: where NU lands in the conference. If he improves somewhat we still end up #4 or #5 in conference. If he stays the same... NU lands, probably, in the same spot. The bigger determining factors are again team preparedness (are they focused, will they play hard all game, will they be fundamentally sound and catch passes better, create turnovers more, limit penalties, and will the coaches make adjustments better than our opponents, etc.) --- these things will more decide where NU lands than TM's performance. And... nothing from the immediate past would suggest a massive improvement in these areas. But... there is always hope.

Love it when posters post about facts based on non-experience. Your right NU will get worse and every other team will improve.

I understand you don't like NU.

:ahhhhhhhh

,

 

[robsker]

Man I love NU --- over 30 years w/o missing a game in terms of following the team. Good, bad, indifferent --- matters not how the team performs, I love the Huskers and the University. This just happens to be a time where the team has not been very good, is not so good and all indicators are that massive change is necessary for there to be improvement in the immediate future .... with little to indicate that such change is imminent. Oh.... and nothing posted is tethered in any way to non-experience --- what, precisely, do you mean?.

 

[bshirt]

Man I love NU --- over 30 years w/o missing a game in terms of following the team. Good, bad, indifferent --- matters not how the team performs, I love the Huskers and the University. This just happens to be a time where the team has not been very good, is not so good and all indicators are that massive change is necessary for there to be improvement in the immediate future .... with little to indicate that such change is imminent. Oh.... and nothing posted is tethered in any way to non-experience --- what, precisely, do you mean?.

I most respectfully disagree as the next few years will bring in boatloads of talent for both lines (where while not enticing, is usually where games are won or lost). Amazingly, we'll even start to develop a little depth on the lines too. Couple that with an experienced qb and coaches that have survived their initial trial by fire and we'll have a very good chance of making some big waves.

 

[MilwWIHusker]

I'm encouraged by the recruiting in the past two years. More importantly, I've been in Big Ten Country my whole life, taken a lot of crap from Bucky supporters, and I absolutely know that Nebraska can compete for titles in this conference on a regular basis. Barry Alvarez used Nebraska's pattern to turn Wisconsin's program from garbage to perennial contenders. They didn't do it by becoming quarterback U, but by developing O-Lines. There are only two teams to truly fear in the B1G....OSU and to a lesser extent Michigan. No reason the Huskers can't compete for a conference title every year....and I can not wait to watch it happen.

GBR!

 

['SkersRule]

Nebraska will probably have 9-10 wins max based on nothing more than talent as long as Taylor is the starting QB. He just doesn't have the arm or mental ability to read and beat defenses.

 

[MilwWIHusker]

I agree with that, he's frustrating to watch. He's shown improvement, but I wonder how far he can go. The OL pickups in the last two years, as well as Armstrong and maybe Fuller, give me alot of hope for the future. Next year might look like this year, but it's going to get better with some big ten experience.