interperpeting the targetting/cheap shot rule?

[Husker66]

OK, leading with the crown of the helmet is wrong and we all know that. Kids getting seriously hurt is horrible and I think we can all agree on that. but how do you take away the fact that we have generations of players who have been conditioned to make hard hits. most of us who played defense did so because we relished the opportunity for a big hit. go on the internet and look at old Husker videos about the blackshirts and see how many of those players would have been tossed this week (i.e "The Hit" by Ruud back in the 70's as one quick example comes to mind). We were taught to hit with the screws of our facemask. head up and make it sting. and sometimes I was the one getting stung.

Now? as far as the officials calling games, I am not even sure I can tell you the difference between a penalizing hit and a very intense good football play on a player. Polini is intense, and the expectation is you hit hard. that's football. thats blackshirt defense. Blacksirts are known for big hits. for decades. I see them doing nothing different now than in the past. Some say they are dirty but I think that is because they do not understand and haven't always had some of the athletes and coaching we have had on defense.I feel like this rule is going to neuter the game. We will have all kinds of missed tackles because kids are afraid of getting tossed and do not know how to interpret the rule.

If we get another suspension this week, I think NU has to go after the league on this. make it good and public. we have nothing to lose anymore. If they start handing out suspensions to us every week, I would suggest atleast another dozen equivelent hits happened around the league. Provide the film of us and all the others and make the league accout for their decisions in full view of the sports community.

 

[Enhance]

While this this is the course of action I think we all would want, it realistically wouldn't happen. Why?

The ruling on E-Mart came straight from Beebe and his office. Which means that if we appeal any decision that has been made, it goes right back to them. Conversely, if another player is suspended this week, the only complaint we can make is straight to the people that gave out the suspension. Sure, we can voice our disagreement, but as far as going after them there really isn't a lot we can do.

The Martin situation has already proven to be a blunder by Beebe. Martin was suspended because he 'led with the crown of his helmet against a defenseless player'. Both of those accusations are false. Not only did he lead with his shoulder, but there is no such thing as a defenseless player on kick off coverage. That OSU player's job is to run down the field and destroy our ball carrier. Similarly, Martin's job is to destroy whoever gets in our ball carrier's way. The OSU player shouldn't have been briskly making his way down the field. It's the coaches fault that the kid got hurt, and not Martin. Keep your head on a swivel and that hit doesn't happen and that kid doesn't get hurt.

I don't know if they'll suspend Osborne. Given that they suspended Martin, I see no reason why they wouldn't find a reason to suspend Osborne. I was at the game and witnessed the hit but still haven't seen a lot of replays of it. Most of our fans seem to think Gabbert was going to the ground when Osborne had already made his hit trajectory, and the helmet to helmet was just a 'wrong place at the wrong time' situation.

In the end, this is football, a sport violent in nature and philosophy. When you start technically diagnosing the hits that have made this game what it is, then you start destroying the integrity of the game. I'm all for preventing the ruthless, obviously malicious hits. But other than that this rule is going down a very dangerous road.

 

[Hercules]

The coaches should go public. They should comment on the officiating, and on the rule itself. They should comment on proper tackling technique, and they should comment on the reality of the game itself.

Will they get fined by the Big 12 conference? Yes. Maybe TO can hand out an extra bonus at the end of the year to make up for it. But somebody should step up and say something. Bo's gruff "Next question!" at the post game press conference won't get the media play conference-wide that the topic should be getting.

 

[huKSer]

I'm going with "Two hands below the waist"

 

[knapplc]

I'm finally getting a moment to sit down and watch the game, and I'll tell you this: If Beebe doesn't suspend Andrew Gachkar for CLEARLY:

1) Targeting a defenseless player, and

2) Helmet-to-helmet hit

then this is a sham league and a sham season, and you should buy into the conspiracy theories wholeheartedly.

The entire reason these helmet-to-helmet hits were put on the big stage was DBs crashing into WRs as they caught the ball. On Nebraska's fourth play from scrimmage Martinez hits Niles for a 21 yard gain, and Gachkar launches himself into Paul as he's catching the ball and very clearly helmets collide. It's almost the first parts of their bodies that touch.

If you have the game recorded, go watch and see what I'm talking about. It is not ambiguous. After the play Niles goes to the sideline tapping his head.

Coincidentally, the announcers make zero mention of this hit. Not even a "maybe."

Your move, Mr. Beebe.

 

[huKSer]

I'm finally getting a moment to sit down and watch the game, and I'll tell you this: If Beebe doesn't suspend Andrew Gachkar for CLEARLY:

1) Targeting a defenseless player, and

2) Helmet-to-helmet hit

then this is a sham league and a sham season, and you should buy into the conspiracy theories wholeheartedly.

The entire reason these helmet-to-helmet hits were put on the big stage was DBs crashing into WRs as they caught the ball. On Nebraska's fourth play from scrimmage Martinez hits Niles for a 21 yard gain, and Gachkar launches himself into Paul as he's catching the ball and very clearly helmets collide. It's almost the first parts of their bodies that touch.

If you have the game recorded, go watch and see what I'm talking about. It is not ambiguous. After the play Niles goes to the sideline tapping his head.

Coincidentally, the announcers make zero mention of this hit. Not even a "maybe."

Your move, Mr. Beebe.

What we need is a video clip and Danno's email address. and ESPN and CBS and Sporting News

 

[HuskerJosh]

I'm finally getting a moment to sit down and watch the game, and I'll tell you this: If Beebe doesn't suspend Andrew Gachkar for CLEARLY:

1) Targeting a defenseless player, and

2) Helmet-to-helmet hit

then this is a sham league and a sham season, and you should buy into the conspiracy theories wholeheartedly.

The entire reason these helmet-to-helmet hits were put on the big stage was DBs crashing into WRs as they caught the ball. On Nebraska's fourth play from scrimmage Martinez hits Niles for a 21 yard gain, and Gachkar launches himself into Paul as he's catching the ball and very clearly helmets collide. It's almost the first parts of their bodies that touch.

If you have the game recorded, go watch and see what I'm talking about. It is not ambiguous. After the play Niles goes to the sideline tapping his head.

Coincidentally, the announcers make zero mention of this hit. Not even a "maybe."

Your move, Mr. Beebe.

Yeah, I think I mentioned this in the gameday thread. No one cares about the hits when someone gets up. It's the ones where someone gets hurt that people get all riled up over. Clearly, this isn't about punishing the action, it's about punishing the result because people feel bad.

 

[knapplc]

Clearly, this isn't about punishing the action, it's about punishing the result because people feel bad.

Agree 100%. It's very reactionary, and it reacts to hysteria.

In the meantime, I'm almost through the first quarter watching the game, and I just saw a play that very much resembles Martin's hit against OSU. With about 2:40 to go in the first quarter Gabbert scrambles from pressure and ends up with that long run that was called back due to a facemask on Wes Kemp. On the pursuit Moore was focusing on Gabbert and got absolutely decleated by a Missouri player. Couldn't catch his number, but Moore was as "defenseless" as Andrew Hudson was on that play, and was very clearly targeted by the Missouri player.

Again, Mr. Beebe - your move.

 

[JTrain]

Clearly, this isn't about punishing the action, it's about punishing the result because people feel bad.

Agree 100%. It's very reactionary, and it reacts to hysteria.

In the meantime, I'm almost through the first quarter watching the game, and I just saw a play that very much resembles Martin's hit against OSU. With about 2:40 to go in the first quarter Gabbert scrambles from pressure and ends up with that long run that was called back due to a facemask on Wes Kemp. On the pursuit Moore was focusing on Gabbert and got absolutely decleated by a Missouri player. Couldn't catch his number, but Moore was as "defenseless" as Andrew Hudson was on that play, and was very clearly targeted by the Missouri player.

Again, Mr. Beebe - your move.

Not comparable. Almost no helmet contact, and the defenseless player clause only applies when contact is above the shoulders. This hit was right at chest/shoulder level.

 

[knapplc]

Clearly, this isn't about punishing the action, it's about punishing the result because people feel bad.

Agree 100%. It's very reactionary, and it reacts to hysteria.

In the meantime, I'm almost through the first quarter watching the game, and I just saw a play that very much resembles Martin's hit against OSU. With about 2:40 to go in the first quarter Gabbert scrambles from pressure and ends up with that long run that was called back due to a facemask on Wes Kemp. On the pursuit Moore was focusing on Gabbert and got absolutely decleated by a Missouri player. Couldn't catch his number, but Moore was as "defenseless" as Andrew Hudson was on that play, and was very clearly targeted by the Missouri player.

Again, Mr. Beebe - your move.

Not comparable. Zero helmet to helmet contact, and the defenseless player clause only applies when contact is above the shoulders. This hit was right at chest/shoulder level.

It's close. I'm pretty sure helmets didn't collide.

 

[The Snork]

One of the guys on "Big Red Reaction" pointed out why this suspension was stupid. "In order to uniformly enforce the rule, the Big XII now has to review every play of every game." And you can't tell me if they do they won't find at least one player of every team, every week that deserves punishment. If there's not more suspensions this week then it appears that Nebraska has been unfairly singled out.