Nebraska's Michael Rose-Ivey receives racial backlash for anthem protest

[Landlord]

My mistake, I thought you were implying that you could get down with that line of reasoning.

Regardless, there are departments with awful cultures of racist and unconstitutional tendencies that prove police reform is still needed, there are departments that are being proactive in reform and seeing great results from it as well. There is nothing tenable about a position of, "There isn't any reforming left to do."

 

[GBRHouston]

My mistake, I thought you were implying that you could get down with that line of reasoning.

All good.

Regardless, there are departments with awful cultures of racist and unconstitutional tendencies that prove police reform is still needed, there are departments that are being proactive in reform and seeing great results from it as well. There is nothing tenable about a position of, "There isn't any reforming left to do."

There are not departments with awful cultures that prove reform is needed. I bet anything there is not a single department out there with the rule "If a black man seems suspicious to you, shoot him." If change does need to happen, it will not be overnight, nor will it be sudden. It would be gradual over the course of years, maybe even decades.

 

[Landlord]

My mistake, I thought you were implying that you could get down with that line of reasoning.

All good.

Regardless, there are departments with awful cultures of racist and unconstitutional tendencies that prove police reform is still needed, there are departments that are being proactive in reform and seeing great results from it as well. There is nothing tenable about a position of, "There isn't any reforming left to do."

There are not departments with awful cultures that prove reform is needed. I bet anything there is not a single department out there with the rule "If a black man seems suspicious to you, shoot him." If change does need to happen, it will not be overnight, nor will it be sudden. It would be gradual over the course of years, maybe even decades.

Here is a department that is found to have a culture that results in many civil rights and constitutional violations - https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/crt/legacy/2014/07/22/newark_findings_7-22-14.pdf

Here is a department that is found to have placed revenue raising as a top priority over public safety, as well as operating with adversely affecting racial disparities - https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/opa/press-releases/attachments/2015/03/04/ferguson_police_department_report.pdf

Here is a department that is found to foster perpetual unconstitutional policing, excessive force, and systemic deficiencies in in training/supervision/accountability - https://www.justice.gov/opa/file/883366/download

Here is a department that is found to be hostile to the community while engaging in common excessive force - https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/opa/press-releases/attachments/2014/12/04/cleveland_division_of_police_findings_letter.pdf?wpisrc=nl-wonkbk&wpmm=1

That's just from one page of a single google search.

 

[GBRHouston]

My mistake, I thought you were implying that you could get down with that line of reasoning.

All good.

Regardless, there are departments with awful cultures of racist and unconstitutional tendencies that prove police reform is still needed, there are departments that are being proactive in reform and seeing great results from it as well. There is nothing tenable about a position of, "There isn't any reforming left to do."

There are not departments with awful cultures that prove reform is needed. I bet anything there is not a single department out there with the rule "If a black man seems suspicious to you, shoot him." If change does need to happen, it will not be overnight, nor will it be sudden. It would be gradual over the course of years, maybe even decades.

Here is a department that is found to have a culture that results in many civil rights and constitutional violations - https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/crt/legacy/2014/07/22/newark_findings_7-22-14.pdf

Here is a department that is found to have placed revenue raising as a top priority over public safety, as well as operating with adversely affecting racial disparities - https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/opa/press-releases/attachments/2015/03/04/ferguson_police_department_report.pdf

Here is a department that is found to foster perpetual unconstitutional policing, excessive force, and systemic deficiencies in in training/supervision/accountability - https://www.justice.gov/opa/file/883366/download

Here is a department that is found to be hostile to the community while engaging in common excessive force - https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/opa/press-releases/attachments/2014/12/04/cleveland_division_of_police_findings_letter.pdf?wpisrc=nl-wonkbk&wpmm=1

That's just from one page of a single google search.

That's not even what I had said.

 

[Landlord]

You said there are not departments with awful cultures that prove reform is needed.

I just linked you to four of them that do have awful cultures that need to be reformed.

 

[GBRHouston]

You said there are not departments with awful cultures that prove reform is needed.

I just linked you to four of them that do have awful cultures that need to be reformed.

I meant something different. There are no policies that need to be reformed in the department.

 

[skersfan]

I have seen some of the horrendous shooting of innocent people. It is terrible when it happens. But saying use a stun gun, rubber bullets, aim lower, all this sounds good, until the suspect is actually shooting real bullets at you. It is easy for people that have never had the situation happen to them, to make comments like the above.

We have many problems, seems to be more in the ghetto areas. I seriously doubt a white or black cop gets up in the morning with the idea. Well I guess I will go and kill a young black man today, or white, or Mexican. Things happen on the street, that when looked at, at a distance could have been done differently. Almost everything is that way. Life or death decisions are being made in the matter of a heart beat. By both sides of the situation.

We just lost two police officers in Palm Springs, going to a household disturbance, shot through the door. Doubtful they were expecting that to happen. Anything can happen. There really are bad people out there and the Police are only layer between us and them. I am sure some of them are as bad, but most are good people trying to do their job and go home to their family like the rest of us. Just a lot less chance of that happening in their careers than ours.

Treat people how you want to be treated, the first step to making things better

 

[GBRHouston]

I have seen some of the horrendous shooting of innocent people. It is terrible when it happens. But saying use a stun gun, rubber bullets, aim lower, all this sounds good, until the suspect is actually shooting real bullets at you. It is easy for people that have never had the situation happen to them, to make comments like the above.

We have many problems, seems to be more in the ghetto areas. I seriously doubt a white or black cop gets up in the morning with the idea. Well I guess I will go and kill a young black man today, or white, or Mexican. Things happen on the street, that when looked at, at a distance could have been done differently. Almost everything is that way. Life or death decisions are being made in the matter of a heart beat. By both sides of the situation.

We just lost two police officers in Palm Springs, going to a household disturbance, shot through the door. Doubtful they were expecting that to happen. Anything can happen. There really are bad people out there and the Police are only layer between us and them. I am sure some of them are as bad, but most are good people trying to do their job and go home to their family like the rest of us. Just a lot less chance of that happening in their careers than ours.

Treat people how you want to be treated, the first step to making things better

+1, you are saying what exactly I am thinking. With bad people out there, cops really do not know what to expect.

 

[URSS]

The players who will not stand for the anthem should be benched. I don't agree with their methods. While they are in uniform and in the stadium, they represent the University, the State and fans. There should be no personal politics on the field.

That's your opinion and you are entitled to it.

The anthem honors the millions of Americans, past and present, including those soldiers who fought to stop slavery in the Civil War, stop dictators in other wars, Martin Luther King, and other good people. The kneeling is an insult to those people and does not accomplish much else other than discord- as is evidenced by the responses to this thread.

The anthem is for all Americans, not just veterans. Don't presume to speak on behalf of other people as to what the anthem represents. I think the majority of veterans (like myself) are fine with the protests. They are done with respect but they get the point across. If they sat down instead (and Kapernick has changed his stance here) or turned their back to the flag, that would be showing disrespect.

I don't buy into the helping hand to rebuild the inner cities.

Why would you? It doesn't affect you.

This nation has spent trillions over the past 50 years and we still have the same percentage of poor, the same run down inner cities and race relations are probably as bad as they have been since the 1960s.

Race relations are better, but the playing field stil isn't level.

Those problems won't be solved on the football field by kneeling and insulting millions.

No they won't, but by bringing attention to the issue, some good can come from it.

As for those insulted... they are the ones who don't think there is a problem and aren't affected. They need to be made aware of the problems in this country. This country isn't just for white, middle class people. We should strive to create opportunity for everyone, not just those born into good circumstances.

If these players think they have ideas, then call a press conference on their time in their civilian clothes and make specific proposals to the their representatives like adult citizens are supposed to do.

By taking a knee, these players have done far more than every poster in this thread combined to make this country a better place and they should be applauded and not ridiculed.

This protest isn't going to do anything for those who won't admit to there being a problem in this country. Their lives are fine, how can it be different for others? Instead of being upset with the protest, try to learn about why it's taking place and what minorities deal with on a daily basis.

We will never agree.

 

[Nebfanatic]

I have seen some of the horrendous shooting of innocent people. It is terrible when it happens. But saying use a stun gun, rubber bullets, aim lower, all this sounds good, until the suspect is actually shooting real bullets at you. It is easy for people that have never had the situation happen to them, to make comments like the above.

We have many problems, seems to be more in the ghetto areas. I seriously doubt a white or black cop gets up in the morning with the idea. Well I guess I will go and kill a young black man today, or white, or Mexican. Things happen on the street, that when looked at, at a distance could have been done differently. Almost everything is that way. Life or death decisions are being made in the matter of a heart beat. By both sides of the situation.

We just lost two police officers in Palm Springs, going to a household disturbance, shot through the door. Doubtful they were expecting that to happen. Anything can happen. There really are bad people out there and the Police are only layer between us and them. I am sure some of them are as bad, but most are good people trying to do their job and go home to their family like the rest of us. Just a lot less chance of that happening in their careers than ours.

Treat people how you want to be treated, the first step to making things better

thing is if dozens of other countries can keep civilian deaths by police at relatively low numbers, so can we. I'm sorry but there should be no justification for police killing 1000 people in a year, when other countries are sitting at 2 or 3. That is a significant gap and it needs to be reduced. Put people in jail, let them go through the justice system as it is designed. Sure I haven't been in these situations, but tens of thousands of other officers around the world go through alot of these scenarios and find ways to come out of them with everyone alive. This is not too much to ask for plain and simple.

 

[GBRHouston]

I have seen some of the horrendous shooting of innocent people. It is terrible when it happens. But saying use a stun gun, rubber bullets, aim lower, all this sounds good, until the suspect is actually shooting real bullets at you. It is easy for people that have never had the situation happen to them, to make comments like the above.

We have many problems, seems to be more in the ghetto areas. I seriously doubt a white or black cop gets up in the morning with the idea. Well I guess I will go and kill a young black man today, or white, or Mexican. Things happen on the street, that when looked at, at a distance could have been done differently. Almost everything is that way. Life or death decisions are being made in the matter of a heart beat. By both sides of the situation.

We just lost two police officers in Palm Springs, going to a household disturbance, shot through the door. Doubtful they were expecting that to happen. Anything can happen. There really are bad people out there and the Police are only layer between us and them. I am sure some of them are as bad, but most are good people trying to do their job and go home to their family like the rest of us. Just a lot less chance of that happening in their careers than ours.

Treat people how you want to be treated, the first step to making things better

thing is if dozens of other countries can keep civilian deaths by police at relatively low numbers, so can we. I'm sorry but there should be no justification for police killing 1000 people in a year, when other countries are sitting at 2 or 3. That is a significant gap and it needs to be reduced. Put people in jail, let them go through the justice system as it is designed. Sure I haven't been in these situations, but tens of thousands of other officers around the world go through alot of these scenarios and find ways to come out of them with everyone alive. This is not too much to ask for plain and simple.

Those countries that have 2 or 3, what is their population compared to our's?

 

[Nebfanatic]

I have seen some of the horrendous shooting of innocent people. It is terrible when it happens. But saying use a stun gun, rubber bullets, aim lower, all this sounds good, until the suspect is actually shooting real bullets at you. It is easy for people that have never had the situation happen to them, to make comments like the above.

We have many problems, seems to be more in the ghetto areas. I seriously doubt a white or black cop gets up in the morning with the idea. Well I guess I will go and kill a young black man today, or white, or Mexican. Things happen on the street, that when looked at, at a distance could have been done differently. Almost everything is that way. Life or death decisions are being made in the matter of a heart beat. By both sides of the situation.

We just lost two police officers in Palm Springs, going to a household disturbance, shot through the door. Doubtful they were expecting that to happen. Anything can happen. There really are bad people out there and the Police are only layer between us and them. I am sure some of them are as bad, but most are good people trying to do their job and go home to their family like the rest of us. Just a lot less chance of that happening in their careers than ours.

Treat people how you want to be treated, the first step to making things better

thing is if dozens of other countries can keep civilian deaths by police at relatively low numbers, so can we. I'm sorry but there should be no justification for police killing 1000 people in a year, when other countries are sitting at 2 or 3. That is a significant gap and it needs to be reduced. Put people in jail, let them go through the justice system as it is designed. Sure I haven't been in these situations, but tens of thousands of other officers around the world go through alot of these scenarios and find ways to come out of them with everyone alive. This is not too much to ask for plain and simple.

Those countries that have 2 or 3, what is their population compared to our's?

population of the UK is approximately 65 million. USA is at 320 million. That is 5 times more people. UK had 3 deaths last year we had 990, or 330 times more civilian deaths.
Germany has 81 million, 7 deaths in 2014

China has 1.3 billion, 5 deaths in 2015

I will add, in 2015, 36 police were killed by gun violence. None in the other major countries I'm referencing.

 

[Nebfanatic]

I am not suggesting we can completely avoid deaths on both sides, but we can surely try and reduce this issue. To me it insane to think there is no solution or we shouldn't pursue a way to kill less civilians and also put less officers in harms way if I am law enforcement.

 

[GBRHouston]

We are a crime-ridden country. I hate to admit it, but we are. In many other countries, cops have nearly no reason to shoot people, because there are way fewer violent crimes featuring armed criminals.

 

[Nebfanatic]

We are a crime-ridden country. I hate to admit it, but we are. In many other countries, cops have nearly no reason to shoot people, because there are way fewer violent crimes featuring armed criminals.

This is just untrue. No facts here you are just using a general statement to try to justify the fact that police kill civilians in america at an extremely high rate compared to most of the world.
There is violent crime everywhere and trying to say there isn't is not very valid