Riley Wants Running Game Identity

[StPaulHusker]

I'm not as concerned about the number of plays called but the effectiveness of those plays.

Yards per Rush:

2016 - 4.20

2015 - 4.72

2014 - 5.32

2013 - 4.80

2012 - 5.36

2011 - 4.62

2010 - 5.47

2009 - 4.02

2008 - 4.54

Yes, there were injuries and lack of a top-flight back.

But there was also a complete lack of creativity in the scheme and play-calling.

When you can only beat the vaunted 2009 offense in recent history, that's a problem.

Lack of 3 NFL running backs can make for an anemic run game as well.

 

[ColoradoHusk]

Don't misunderstand, I think our running game will show improvement. All other things being constant, simply having a viable passing attack will make it easier to run the ball. Now the O line play, play calling and fortitude to not totally abandon the run game.......those are concerns.

But full disclosure; I won't be happy until we can ram the ball down any opponents throat at will.

I see this used as an argument, and in fact, I think Riley uses the pass game to set up the run. However, I still find flaws in that philosophy. The QB run game forces the defense to slow down their pursuit and a defense can't attack the RB right away. Also, if a defense can stop the run game with only 7 defenders in the box, the defense can still have enough defenders in the pass game.

Now, if the o-line does start to impose their will, and it forces a safety to come near the LOS and forces LB's to play more honest, that will improve the run game, and offense overall.

 

[BigRedBuster]

There's flaws in every offensive philosophy.

 

[shyndy]

I'm not as concerned about the number of plays called but the effectiveness of those plays.

Yards per Rush:

2016 - 4.20

2015 - 4.72

2014 - 5.32

2013 - 4.80

2012 - 5.36

2011 - 4.62

2010 - 5.47

2009 - 4.02

2008 - 4.54

Yes, there were injuries and lack of a top-flight back.

But there was also a complete lack of creativity in the scheme and play-calling.

When you can only beat the vaunted 2009 offense in recent history, that's a problem.

Throw in the fact that the 2 leading rushers (Newby & Armstrong) aren't returning, and they both had YPC over 4.5 yards, there is cause for concern regarding the run game.
In fact, looking at returning ball carriers, the stats from 2016 are:

Devine Ozigbo 97 carries for 412 yards, 4.2 YPC, 37.5 YPG

Tre Bryant 43 carries for 172 yards, 4.0 YPC, 14.3 YPG

Mikale Wilbon, 15 carries for 89 yards, 5.9 YPC, 8.9 YPG

Pierson-El, 14 carries for 34 yards, 2.4 YPC, 2.6 YPG

Total 169 carries for 707 yards, 4.2 YPC, 54.4 YPG

That's not a lot of returning production.

imho the Pierson el ypc is troubling. We didn't get much production on the fly sweep from anyone this year. That's a change of pace run, it should be fewer attempts higher Ypc.

 

[ColoradoHusk]

I'm not as concerned about the number of plays called but the effectiveness of those plays.

Yards per Rush:

2016 - 4.20

2015 - 4.72

2014 - 5.32

2013 - 4.80

2012 - 5.36

2011 - 4.62

2010 - 5.47

2009 - 4.02

2008 - 4.54

Yes, there were injuries and lack of a top-flight back.

But there was also a complete lack of creativity in the scheme and play-calling.

When you can only beat the vaunted 2009 offense in recent history, that's a problem.

Throw in the fact that the 2 leading rushers (Newby & Armstrong) aren't returning, and they both had YPC over 4.5 yards, there is cause for concern regarding the run game.
In fact, looking at returning ball carriers, the stats from 2016 are:

Devine Ozigbo 97 carries for 412 yards, 4.2 YPC, 37.5 YPG

Tre Bryant 43 carries for 172 yards, 4.0 YPC, 14.3 YPG

Mikale Wilbon, 15 carries for 89 yards, 5.9 YPC, 8.9 YPG

Pierson-El, 14 carries for 34 yards, 2.4 YPC, 2.6 YPG

Total 169 carries for 707 yards, 4.2 YPC, 54.4 YPG

That's not a lot of returning production.

imho the Pierson el ypc is troubling. We didn't get much production on the fly sweep from anyone this year. That's a change of pace run, it should be fewer attempts higher Ypc.

The fly sweep was much more effective with Reilly (4.2 YPC) and Moore (5.3 YPC) running it. It's kind of a boom or bust play, and is done to help keep the defense honest. IMO, I just don't think Pierson-El is great at running it.

 

[JJ Husker]

Don't misunderstand, I think our running game will show improvement. All other things being constant, simply having a viable passing attack will make it easier to run the ball. Now the O line play, play calling and fortitude to not totally abandon the run game.......those are concerns.

But full disclosure; I won't be happy until we can ram the ball down any opponents throat at will.

I see this used as an argument, and in fact, I think Riley uses the pass game to set up the run. However, I still find flaws in that philosophy. The QB run game forces the defense to slow down their pursuit and a defense can't attack the RB right away. Also, if a defense can stop the run game with only 7 defenders in the box, the defense can still have enough defenders in the pass game.

Now, if the o-line does start to impose their will, and it forces a safety to come near the LOS and forces LB's to play more honest, that will improve the run game, and offense overall.

I guess my point was that at least one (but preferably both) facet of our offense needs to generate some respect from the defense. When you are only fair to middling at both running and passing, it is too easy for them to shut down both. If even one works reasonably well, it is bound to help the other. A poor passing QB and weak line play is a bad combination. If either of those improve, it will help the offense as a whole. I know, it's not rocket science....

 

[Hunter94]

we have one proven back.........wishful thinking on his part.

 

[Mavric]

I'm not as concerned about the number of plays called but the effectiveness of those plays.

Yards per Rush:

2016 - 4.20

2015 - 4.72

2014 - 5.32

2013 - 4.80

2012 - 5.36

2011 - 4.62

2010 - 5.47

2009 - 4.02

2008 - 4.54

Yes, there were injuries and lack of a top-flight back.

But there was also a complete lack of creativity in the scheme and play-calling.

When you can only beat the vaunted 2009 offense in recent history, that's a problem.

Lack of 3 NFL running backs can make for an anemic run game as well.

And perhaps the backs we had would look more like NFL talent if they could be used in a system that played more to their strengths.

 

[Apathy]

we have one proven back.........wishful thinking on his part.

Ozigbo is for sure our #1 back but I have a lot of faith in Tre Bryant. Kid for sure has explosiveness and is very fluid when he gets the rock with great vision. For a freshman he shined extremely well when given the chance

 

[lo country]

IF, we are going to be a pro style offense going forward, I'd like to see a run game predicated on traps, dives and counters. PA passes to keep the D honest. Basically a smash mouth run game where we use a run, pass option as our answer to the zone read running game or old "option" football. I know Chip Kelly tried at Philly to run a zone read in the passing game. Similar concept as the zone read run game in that QB reads a defender (can't remember which) and then makes the appropriate read and throws to the "open" receiver. On,y problem with the above, as with any O is the play of our OL. If they are slow, injured or unathletic, traps, sweeps, counters will be hard as someone has gotta pull and get outside or come across/around. Seem to remember that was the "excuse" for last seasons abandonment on any run, but up the middle.

The reality, as many have said, we have lacked an identity for years. It hasn't been just Riley. Regardless of scheme, if your identity is aggressive, physical, technique sound football you will win.

I like Wisky's O. I see them and remember when that was us....

 

[ColoradoHusk]

Don't misunderstand, I think our running game will show improvement. All other things being constant, simply having a viable passing attack will make it easier to run the ball. Now the O line play, play calling and fortitude to not totally abandon the run game.......those are concerns.

But full disclosure; I won't be happy until we can ram the ball down any opponents throat at will.

I see this used as an argument, and in fact, I think Riley uses the pass game to set up the run. However, I still find flaws in that philosophy. The QB run game forces the defense to slow down their pursuit and a defense can't attack the RB right away. Also, if a defense can stop the run game with only 7 defenders in the box, the defense can still have enough defenders in the pass game.
Now, if the o-line does start to impose their will, and it forces a safety to come near the LOS and forces LB's to play more honest, that will improve the run game, and offense overall.

I guess my point was that at least one (but preferably both) facet of our offense needs to generate some respect from the defense. When you are only fair to middling at both running and passing, it is too easy for them to shut down both. If even one works reasonably well, it is bound to help the other. A poor passing QB and weak line play is a bad combination. If either of those improve, it will help the offense as a whole. I know, it's not rocket science....

Fair enough. I just think that people think Lee or POB being good passing QB's will cure all the ills of the offense. That's been mentioned numerous times on this board, and I think that's a foolish opinion to have.

 

[JJ Husker]

Don't misunderstand, I think our running game will show improvement. All other things being constant, simply having a viable passing attack will make it easier to run the ball. Now the O line play, play calling and fortitude to not totally abandon the run game.......those are concerns.

But full disclosure; I won't be happy until we can ram the ball down any opponents throat at will.

I see this used as an argument, and in fact, I think Riley uses the pass game to set up the run. However, I still find flaws in that philosophy. The QB run game forces the defense to slow down their pursuit and a defense can't attack the RB right away. Also, if a defense can stop the run game with only 7 defenders in the box, the defense can still have enough defenders in the pass game.
Now, if the o-line does start to impose their will, and it forces a safety to come near the LOS and forces LB's to play more honest, that will improve the run game, and offense overall.

I guess my point was that at least one (but preferably both) facet of our offense needs to generate some respect from the defense. When you are only fair to middling at both running and passing, it is too easy for them to shut down both. If even one works reasonably well, it is bound to help the other. A poor passing QB and weak line play is a bad combination. If either of those improve, it will help the offense as a whole. I know, it's not rocket science....

Fair enough. I just think that people think Lee or POB being good passing QB's will cure all the ills of the offense. That's been mentioned numerous times on this board, and I think that's a foolish opinion to have.

Oh I agree, it will take more than just a good passing QB but, considering the obvious preference has been to throw the ball and to pay lip service to the running game, a good passing QB sure can't hurt. Of course line play and Langsdorf are probably even more important to our offensive success. I have my doubts that the type of running game these guys have shown a propensity for will work anyway. I would like to see more smash mouth power and they seem to prefer a lighter finesse game. Doesn't seem like the recipe for run game success in the B1G but I'll give them the chance to prove me wrong.

 

[Lil' Red]

I'm not as concerned about the number of plays called but the effectiveness of those plays.

Yards per Rush:

2016 - 4.20

2015 - 4.72

2014 - 5.32

2013 - 4.80

2012 - 5.36

2011 - 4.62

2010 - 5.47

2009 - 4.02

2008 - 4.54

Yes, there were injuries and lack of a top-flight back.

But there was also a complete lack of creativity in the scheme and play-calling.

When you can only beat the vaunted 2009 offense in recent history, that's a problem.

Lack of 3 NFL running backs can make for an anemic run game as well.

And perhaps the backs we had would look more like NFL talent if they could be used in a system that played more to their strengths.

I still believe talent is the bigger issue. Losing Janovich is probably the main reason our ypc dropped so much from 2015. Janovich is also a good example of the coaching staff doing a better job of playing to the strengths of the player than the previous staff.

 

[ColoradoHusk]

I'm not as concerned about the number of plays called but the effectiveness of those plays.

Yards per Rush:

2016 - 4.20

2015 - 4.72

2014 - 5.32

2013 - 4.80

2012 - 5.36

2011 - 4.62

2010 - 5.47

2009 - 4.02

2008 - 4.54

Yes, there were injuries and lack of a top-flight back.

But there was also a complete lack of creativity in the scheme and play-calling.

When you can only beat the vaunted 2009 offense in recent history, that's a problem.

Lack of 3 NFL running backs can make for an anemic run game as well.

And perhaps the backs we had would look more like NFL talent if they could be used in a system that played more to their strengths.

I still believe talent is the bigger issue. Losing Janovich is probably the main reason our ypc dropped so much from 2015. Janovich is also a good example of the coaching staff doing a better job of playing to the strengths of the player than the previous staff.

Without Janovich's carries and yards, NU averaged 4.56 YPC in 2015. So, yes Jano was one factor in the decline in YPC, but that's still a decent decline without him.

 

[Lil' Red]

I'm not as concerned about the number of plays called but the effectiveness of those plays.

Yards per Rush:

2016 - 4.20

2015 - 4.72

2014 - 5.32

2013 - 4.80

2012 - 5.36

2011 - 4.62

2010 - 5.47

2009 - 4.02

2008 - 4.54

Yes, there were injuries and lack of a top-flight back.

But there was also a complete lack of creativity in the scheme and play-calling.

When you can only beat the vaunted 2009 offense in recent history, that's a problem.

Lack of 3 NFL running backs can make for an anemic run game as well.

And perhaps the backs we had would look more like NFL talent if they could be used in a system that played more to their strengths.

I still believe talent is the bigger issue. Losing Janovich is probably the main reason our ypc dropped so much from 2015. Janovich is also a good example of the coaching staff doing a better job of playing to the strengths of the player than the previous staff.

Without Janovich's carries and yards, NU averaged 4.56 YPC in 2015. So, yes Jano was one factor in the decline in YPC, but that's still a decent decline without him.

You also have to factor in his blocking.