Tackle Eligible

[Joe_5700]

What's better is the scholar in the broadcast booth kept calling the 16 yd line the 14 yd line which was wrong to begin with. Sure miss big 12 officiating......

He corrected himself (made fun of himself for it too) , and it was a yard off the 15 yard line, so if he was just glancing at the yard line, it would probably be an easy mistake to make.

Exactly. In the heat of the moment subtracting a yard (like you would on a positive play) instead of adding a yard was a very easy mistake to make. The much bigger mistake was made in the replay booth.

 

[ZRod]

I think the head referee was a Big 12 guy. Wasn't he?

Yes. They called a good game, minus the usual missed holding calls. Probably a better game than the B1G guys do.

 

[shyndy]

I was watching the game in a location where I couldn't hear the announcers (local saloon), so I couldn't hear the explanation by the white hat or what the announcers were saying, but I don't think the issue was whether Lewis was eligible or not (because he was, assuming that he reported to the officials).

Looked to me as if the issue was that the other linemen were downfield and therefore the pass had to be backwards (a screen) in order for that to be legal.

I thought they called "ineligible man downfield", but that it was on one of the other linemen, not Lewis. There was no reason Lewis was ineligible assuming he reported to the officials, which I guarantee he did considering the play was 100% set up to go to him. You just don't forget to report as eligible if you are a 320 lb OT. That's every tackles dream.

This is a good point, however the linemen can go downfield as for a screen play as long as the catch is made behind the LoS, doesnt have to actually be a lateral.

Basically it all boils down to the NCAA having a specific rule about those numbers and being ineligible, which i think is a strange way of handling it. personally think it should be handled like the NFL. Again i haven't found anything yet that forces a team to use the ineligible numbers, there has to be something saying you have to have 5 with those numbers, otherwise I'd think offenses would stop using them.

 

[VA Husker Fan]

Basically it all boils down to the NCAA having a specific rule about those numbers and being ineligible, which i think is a strange way of handling it. personally think it should be handled like the NFL. Again i haven't found anything yet that forces a team to use the ineligible numbers, there has to be something saying you have to have 5 with those numbers, otherwise I'd think offenses would stop using them.

It's one of the very first rules, Rule 1, Section 1, Article 1.b.2

At the snap, at least five players wearing jerseys numbered 50 through

79 are on the offensive scrimmage line and no more than four players

are in the backfield (Rules 2-21-2, 2-27-4 and 7-1-4-a) (Exception: Rule

7-1-4-a-5) (A.R. 7-1-4-IV-VI).

 

[MichiganDad3]

I thought it was illegal to lateral or hand-off to a lineman. That is why Turner Gill intentionally fumbled on the fumblerooski. Has that rule changed?

 

[Minnesota_husker]

I would be curious to know if Barney/Beck knew that it would need to be a "lateral".

I would think on a trick play like that, you would check first and my assumption is that Tommy was told it needed to be backward.

My assumption is they planned all along for it to be lateral since most would assume since he didnt check in that he was ineligible. This seems like it was more Tommy or Alex's fault.

That being said. I love the play call and after the replays i still think it was a legal fat man touchdown, but the refs were too stupid to overturn.

 

[shyndy]

The fumble advancement rules are kind of weird too, I think an offensive player cannot generally advance another player's fumble, but as we saw in the minnesota game a couple years ago, there are circumstances where it can, I think in that case it was because the ball was recovered behind the LoS? Not really able to look at the rules right now. My understanding is that a hand off or lateral would be legal but not sure.

 

[cg_8]

It is my understanding that a lateral is a glorified and planned fumble. With that in mind, any lateral to any person is legal, regardless of position, number, credence, nationality, race, gender, etc.

Just think of how teams run hook and laterals, and they lateral to whomever is on their team. Regardless of the LOS, a lateral is still a lateral.

A forward lateral is totally different. Only those ruled eligible, can receive a forward lateral pass. It is my understanding that they share before the game, what plays may require a player whom can be generally viewed as "ineligible", can/will be used as an eligible receiver. They must notify the Officials prior to the snap, and the Official will notify the opposing team.

Let's just think of this differently. It may have been a designed play, but let's say Tommy is running the ball out of a shotgun, a lineman gets pushed back far behind Tommy, and Tommy decides (while being tackled) that this lineman has a better chance to score than himself, so he pitches it back to him. The lineman then runs the ball in for a TD. Same thing, only, designed.

As for advancing a fumble. I may be incorrect in this, but it is my understanding that in college, any side of the ball can advance a fumble at any point in the game. However, in the NFL, only the player that fumbled can advance a fumble in the 2 minute warning. I don't know if this rule changed, but I know that the officials indicate "no advanced fumbles" prior to snaps with what we see as a "false start" call. I think this may even be the case on a fourth down too. An offensive player can recover the fumble, but it is a dead ball, so the ball is down where the ball is recovered.

 

[shyndy]

It is my understanding that a lateral is a glorified and planned fumble. With that in mind, any lateral to any person is legal, regardless of position, number, credence, nationality, race, gender, etc.

Just think of how teams run hook and laterals, and they lateral to whomever is on their team. Regardless of the LOS, a lateral is still a lateral.

A forward lateral is totally different. Only those ruled eligible, can receive a forward lateral pass. It is my understanding that they share before the game, what plays may require a player whom can be generally viewed as "ineligible", can/will be used as an eligible receiver. They must notify the Officials prior to the snap, and the Official will notify the opposing team.

Let's just think of this differently. It may have been a designed play, but let's say Tommy is running the ball out of a shotgun, a lineman gets pushed back far behind Tommy, and Tommy decides (while being tackled) that this lineman has a better chance to score than himself, so he pitches it back to him. The lineman then runs the ball in for a TD. Same thing, only, designed.

As for advancing a fumble. I may be incorrect in this, but it is my understanding that in college, any side of the ball can advance a fumble at any point in the game. However, in the NFL, only the player that fumbled can advance a fumble in the 2 minute warning. I don't know if this rule changed, but I know that the officials indicate "no advanced fumbles" prior to snaps with what we see as a "false start" call. I think this may even be the case on a fourth down too. An offensive player can recover the fumble, but it is a dead ball, so the ball is down where the ball is recovered.

i dont think that a player other than the ball carrier can advance a forward fumble that occurs past the LoS, but I'm not 100pct sure. I think they may have altered fumble advancement rules some in the past decade.

 

[Mavric]

I thought it was illegal to lateral or hand-off to a lineman. That is why Turner Gill intentionally fumbled on the fumblerooski. Has that rule changed?

From the Rule Book:

Planned Loose Ball

ARTICLE 7. A Team A player may not advance a planned loose ball in the vicinity of the snapper.
PENALTY—Five yards from the previous spot and loss of down [s19 and S9].

 

[Sargon]

What blows my mind, is how the replay booth screwed it up so bad. The ball was thrown a full yard backwards. It should have counted, regardless of him being eligible or not.

The same texass league replay woman didn't overturn USC's ball on the ground non-interception.

BTW, having a great time watching the gooners getting smashed 40-0 so far in the bowl game vs. Clemson.

 

[SWAMI]

Ok this has been bothering me and YES I know we still scored and I'm not trying to make some kind of officiating argument, but I would like a good explanation of why Alex Lewis is not an eligible receiver. I don't see anyone really saying much about this, everyone is focused on "was it a lateral? was it tipped?"

My memory tells me the end man on the LoS is always eligible, as well as anyone lined up in the "backfield." I'm having a little trouble finding a good replay of the play to watch but I'm pretty sure Lewis is not covered by a SE (definitely no TE on his side). In fact the only WR on his side motioned to the other side. If Lewis is the end man on the LoS he is eligible for reception of any kind of pass, the dude can run a fade if he wants and thus the argument of whether it was a lateral or not doesn't matter.

So I went to look it up, and I found a couple different things. Wikipedia (yeah i know) said that per ncaa rules anyone wearing numbers 50-79 is automatically ineligible with a few exceptions. One of these exceptions was if said person was the end man on the LoS! However, all I found in the rulebook was that these numbers are automatically ineligible, period.

SO I'm wanting to see if anyone knows, is this what it boils down to that he is ineligible solely because of what number he wears? Also, this is one of the dumbest rules the NCAA has. If I were a coach i wouldn't use these numbers (50-79) on offense- I don't think there is any kind of rule saying if you are over 260 pounds on offense you have to wear a number between 50-79, lol.

I consider myself to be knowledgeable on football. Having said that I wonder why you can't hand off to a lineman (i.e. the bummerrooskie sp? play), but you can throw a lateral pass. Can anyone tell me the difference?

 

[California Husker]

As a few people have said above, there is no such thing as "reporting in" as an eligible receiver in college football. BUT, as people above have also said, the pass was backwards and in that case it doesn't matter what number you are wearing, it is legal.

Also, as some have said above, the officiating was not good...but it was at least partially a Big XII squad...so what would you expect.

They got that call wrong (and as someone else has said, it didn't really matter since NU scored. The bigger screw up on the part of the officials was on the kick return for a TD by Adoree Jackson. That TD, by rule, should have been disallowed. The rule says (this is not a quote, rather a paraphrase) that when a player does some sort of a celebration or act that brings attention to himself, that is unsportsmanlike conduct and that it should be penalized 15 yards from where the act began. In this case, Jackson sort of bounce stepped (to start his front flip) at about the two yard line. So the flag should have been thrown and the TD taken off the board. The ball should have been placed at the 16 or 17 yard line...first and ten USC.

 

[VA Husker Fan]

Ok this has been bothering me and YES I know we still scored and I'm not trying to make some kind of officiating argument, but I would like a good explanation of why Alex Lewis is not an eligible receiver. I don't see anyone really saying much about this, everyone is focused on "was it a lateral? was it tipped?"

My memory tells me the end man on the LoS is always eligible, as well as anyone lined up in the "backfield." I'm having a little trouble finding a good replay of the play to watch but I'm pretty sure Lewis is not covered by a SE (definitely no TE on his side). In fact the only WR on his side motioned to the other side. If Lewis is the end man on the LoS he is eligible for reception of any kind of pass, the dude can run a fade if he wants and thus the argument of whether it was a lateral or not doesn't matter.

So I went to look it up, and I found a couple different things. Wikipedia (yeah i know) said that per ncaa rules anyone wearing numbers 50-79 is automatically ineligible with a few exceptions. One of these exceptions was if said person was the end man on the LoS! However, all I found in the rulebook was that these numbers are automatically ineligible, period.

SO I'm wanting to see if anyone knows, is this what it boils down to that he is ineligible solely because of what number he wears? Also, this is one of the dumbest rules the NCAA has. If I were a coach i wouldn't use these numbers (50-79) on offense- I don't think there is any kind of rule saying if you are over 260 pounds on offense you have to wear a number between 50-79, lol.

I consider myself to be knowledgeable on football. Having said that I wonder why you can't hand off to a lineman (i.e. the bummerrooskie sp? play), but you can throw a lateral pass. Can anyone tell me the difference?

I think the purpose is to eliminate the deceptive play where the QB gets the snap and immediately hands it back forward to the center or guard and it's all disguised in the jumble at the line. IIRC a lineman can take a handoff but has to be facing his own goal or something like that. Not curious enough to look up the exact rule. A lateral pass is out in the open so its more like a misdirection play than outright trickery. I'm just guessing since I think it's been a rule for a long long time and they don't usually give the rationale for a rule in the book.

 

[VA Husker Fan]

As a few people have said above, there is no such thing as "reporting in" as an eligible receiver in college football. BUT, as people above have also said, the pass was backwards and in that case it doesn't matter what number you are wearing, it is legal.

Also, as some have said above, the officiating was not good...but it was at least partially a Big XII squad...so what would you expect.

They got that call wrong (and as someone else has said, it didn't really matter since NU scored. The bigger screw up on the part of the officials was on the kick return for a TD by Adoree Jackson. That TD, by rule, should have been disallowed. The rule says (this is not a quote, rather a paraphrase) that when a player does some sort of a celebration or act that brings attention to himself, that is unsportsmanlike conduct and that it should be penalized 15 yards from where the act began. In this case, Jackson sort of bounce stepped (to start his front flip) at about the two yard line. So the flag should have been thrown and the TD taken off the board. The ball should have been placed at the 16 or 17 yard line...first and ten USC.

I was looking for that too, but I guess the penalty is the flip itself and it looked like the ball was on or over the line when he started the flip so the TD had been scored. It could've been called at the hop I guess but if he just hops into the end zone with no flip they probably don't call anything.