The 40

[EZ-E]

After watching the combine this year I am going to go out on a limb and say that there is a huge discrepancy between what is reported to rivals, and what kids actually run. I am sure that there are a lot of examples out there. With what I have learned about it in my time following the combine this year I am going to start putting more stock into what I see on tape and not so much just shear numbers that are on a rivals page.

 

[Nexus]

I'm an eyeball guy myself. I have to actually see it before I can judge. Which is why I told you the other day that I can't know how so-and-so performs because I haven't seen any film on them; Nathan Hughes, Brennan Scarlett, etc.

So yeah, I agree with you.

 

[whateveritis1224]

You can't teach speed though. Sure you can run a perfect 40, but that'd only probably take half a tenth to a tenth off of your time. So if the recruiting sites put up that the kid runs a 4.4, I'm going to say that he's probably running anywhere between 4.4 and 4.6. But yes you shouldn't put too much into the 40, but it does give you an indication at just how fast a kid can be.

 

[hskerholic]

why dont we ask al davis and the radiers about the 40 and how good they are?

 

[kchusker_chris]

I don't think CF coaches put as much stock into the 40 as NFL scouts do. A kid doesn't necessarily need to worry about posting an EXACT 40 time because it's not as important.

In regards to the combine I'm not 100% sure I know what you mean. The guys we thought were going to be fast (Spiller, Best) ended up being pretty damn fast. I didn't see any major surprises as far as 40 times go, but I didn't pay that close attention. I figured Asante was about a 4.6-4.7 guy. NU doesn't even come close to conditioning that type of speed. Perhaps in Callahan't time, but not anymore. I guess I don't see how it correlates to the accuracy of Rivals.

 

[Judoka]

Agree. Don't believe it til you see it....then see it twice.

 

[robsker]

You can't teach speed though. Sure you can run a perfect 40, but that'd only probably take half a tenth to a tenth off of your time. So if the recruiting sites put up that the kid runs a 4.4, I'm going to say that he's probably running anywhere between 4.4 and 4.6. But yes you shouldn't put too much into the 40, but it does give you an indication at just how fast a kid can be.

The rule of thumb with a recruits 40 time --- add .15 seconds and you are likely fairly accurate (if they state 4.4 expect a real 4.55; if they say 4.5 expect a 4.65 or so). Of course, some report as much as .2 or more lower than the real time. And, some report real times. just can't tell which is which. And then, if you could the question then is whether such track times relate to much anything useful on the field anyway.

Another angle to take --- a HS kid with a sub 4.5 40 --- a real sub 4.5 40 is very, very, very rare.

 

[NUance]

Partly due to hand-held measurement. But partly due to exaggeration. HS kids (and their coaches) even exaggerate their height and weights.

 

[carlfense]

1. All 40 times of high school students are suspect unless they are electronically timed at one of the major camps.

2. It's irrelevant anyways because the 40 yard dash could very well be the most overrated football statistic. (Timed in gym cloths and run on tracks, 10 yard dash more meaningful, etc.)

 

[Eric]

I was thinking about this myself. A legit 4.4 is rare.

This article had some decent info, about timing errors and such. They also had Joe Haden, and Florida's 40 board, which is a crock. They had him running a 4.33 at Florida, his actual time was a 4.57 at the combine! Only off by .24!

Dr Saturday Blog

I'm going to add .2 to whatever 40 time i see

 

[Ohio Pete]

I'll be interested to see the combine numbers for T. Pryor and the safety from USC (whose name escapes me) in a few years. When they were hyping that USC-OSU game last year, they kept talking about how both of those guys run 4.2-4.3 40s.

 

[kchusker_chris]

I'll be interested to see the combine numbers for T. Pryor and the safety from USC (whose name escapes me) in a few years. When they were hyping that USC-OSU game last year, they kept talking about how both of those guys run 4.2-4.3 40s.

The safety you are thinking of is probably Taylor Mays, and he ran a 4.43, which was the fastest time for a safety. I remember reading an Andy Staples article or something on the T.Pryor 4.3 40 time. He was disputing it, and trying to clock U.Bolt. The gist of the article was that 4.3 times are about as rare as a 6'9" offensive linemen

Looking at the combine, there were only a handful of sub-4.4 times. Then again from the time these kids begin college until they end up at the combine, they bulk up and put on more football weight. Their bodies change, and it is possible a number of them sacrifice a tenth of a second for an extra 20 pounds of power. It's apples to oranges comparing their high school 40's to their 40's in the combine...too much has changed.

 

[schuhbdoo]

After watching the combine this year I am going to go out on a limb and say that there is a huge discrepancy between what is reported to rivals, and what kids actually run. I am sure that there are a lot of examples out there. With what I have learned about it in my time following the combine this year I am going to start putting more stock into what I see on tape and not so much just shear numbers that are on a rivals page.

To further your point. If you go to the 2007 recruits and pull up the 40 time of Larry Asante, he is listed a 4.4. Either he has slowed down as he gets ready to enter the NFL or the 40 times listed for incoming recruits are meaningless. The hand times by NFL Network staffers were off sometimes as much as .20 hundreds of a second.

I think Larry Asante is in the best shape of his life and has trained specifically to run the 40 for a couple months now, so 40 times don't mean anything unless it is timed at the combine.

Way too many kids listed as 4.4 and 4.5 and we see how hard it is to run a sub 4.5 or 4.6 at the combine.