It's also disheartening to see an NFL team getting blown out and see a shot of their bench and their laughing and smiling. Paycheck remains the same win or lose. NFL is boring and very meh.
What is Killing College Football
- Thread starter Stone Cold
- Start date
Toe
All-American
With all the opt-outs and transfers, to me it feels like it's getting harder to judge which team should be better. It's like the team that plays in the bowl game isn't really even the same team from the rest of the season because of all the players that are gone.
Which makes me wonder if we might eventually see transfers gaining mid-season eligibility. Like if a team's kicker decided to bail before the bowl, could a team bring in another and have him play in the bowl? How about a true freshman who plays in three games, transfers mid-season, then plays one game for his new team that year and is still considered a redshirt?
Identifying team-oriented guys who are less likely to transfer or bail on a bowl game is probably going to become a significant aspect of recruiting, if you want to build a culture.
Which makes me wonder if we might eventually see transfers gaining mid-season eligibility. Like if a team's kicker decided to bail before the bowl, could a team bring in another and have him play in the bowl? How about a true freshman who plays in three games, transfers mid-season, then plays one game for his new team that year and is still considered a redshirt?
Identifying team-oriented guys who are less likely to transfer or bail on a bowl game is probably going to become a significant aspect of recruiting, if you want to build a culture.
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chamrocck
All-American
I made a point to watch some of the games where matchups were of interest. UCF v Florida. The Oregon v OU game. That Purdue v Tenn game was good. Michigan St vs Pitt too. The playoff games were duds. I would have watched UCLA v NC State had it not been cancelled. I make a point to watch the Rose Bowl. The Fiesta and Sugar Bowls were not bad.
NoKoolAidForME
Starter
This is spot on because if it’s an 8 team playoff or a 16 team playoff you for sure want to be in the top spots compared to the bottom.
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Why football seems to be going bad-
1. Covid-19 nonsense. Total over reaction by many. These conditioned athletes have little to worry about- almost the issues as getting the flu.
2. The current playoff. Bowl don’t mean much unless your team is playing. Only the two championship bowls are important.
we should play the bowls like they used to be done. After the bowl season, pick the four teams to compete for the Championship.
Remember the days when sports writers used to go through convoluted bowl games outcomes to explain how your team could get into the top 10 or better. Most of the bowl games were important to the poll.
3. Rule changes. Too many rules changes ruins the game. Targeting is crap. The runner can use his helmet crown or hands to the face but the defender cannot. If safety is truly the, then both should be subject to the penalty. I think the entire penalty should be scrapped. Most refs have played and can determine if someone was trying hurt it injure the opposing player- in that case, the ref should have the description to eject anyone for unnecessary roughness. Blocking rule changes make it harder for smaller players to take the big monsters down. Can’t hit low if someone else is touching him high. Crack back restrictions.
sliding QB rules- IMO sliding should be a 15 yard and loss of down penalty for cowardice.
4. Instant replay. Too many interruptions. It’s like giving the teams double the time outs and disrupts momentum.
5. Player Portals and NFL early outs. Players should play for their teams until they are drafted. I don’t want to hear announcers whine about this team or the other playing without their key people. Without them playing, the game has the importance of the spring game or NFL preseason games.
6. Lack of fundamentals. Players seem to have the tackling Fonda mental of wrapping up the legs. The big fat guys seem to like the bear hug tackle and get dragged for 3-5 yards after contact. The little guys seem to adopt the bartering ram tackle with few wrapping up the legs.
1. Covid-19 nonsense. Total over reaction by many. These conditioned athletes have little to worry about- almost the issues as getting the flu.
2. The current playoff. Bowl don’t mean much unless your team is playing. Only the two championship bowls are important.
we should play the bowls like they used to be done. After the bowl season, pick the four teams to compete for the Championship.
Remember the days when sports writers used to go through convoluted bowl games outcomes to explain how your team could get into the top 10 or better. Most of the bowl games were important to the poll.
3. Rule changes. Too many rules changes ruins the game. Targeting is crap. The runner can use his helmet crown or hands to the face but the defender cannot. If safety is truly the, then both should be subject to the penalty. I think the entire penalty should be scrapped. Most refs have played and can determine if someone was trying hurt it injure the opposing player- in that case, the ref should have the description to eject anyone for unnecessary roughness. Blocking rule changes make it harder for smaller players to take the big monsters down. Can’t hit low if someone else is touching him high. Crack back restrictions.
sliding QB rules- IMO sliding should be a 15 yard and loss of down penalty for cowardice.
4. Instant replay. Too many interruptions. It’s like giving the teams double the time outs and disrupts momentum.
5. Player Portals and NFL early outs. Players should play for their teams until they are drafted. I don’t want to hear announcers whine about this team or the other playing without their key people. Without them playing, the game has the importance of the spring game or NFL preseason games.
6. Lack of fundamentals. Players seem to have the tackling Fonda mental of wrapping up the legs. The big fat guys seem to like the bear hug tackle and get dragged for 3-5 yards after contact. The little guys seem to adopt the bartering ram tackle with few wrapping up the legs.
Lorewarn
All-Conference
I'm not happy about the de facto NFL minor league state of college football, but if it's going to be this way it only makes sense that the players are able to look out for themselves and anyone holding that against them is a clown.
I love the idea of amateur athletics, sacrificing for the team, being a part of something greater, etc. But it wasn't the players who ruined that notion - it was the NCAA, the athletic departments/schools, the media who dictates the landscape and the coaches. The players finally had enough when all of the other parties started seeking the almighty dollar above all else. You have Herbstreit and Desmond Howard whining about how players these days are entitled and don't care enough with opting out of the bowl games, while these guys are millionaires paid by ESPN, one of the sole agents responsible for the cheapening of the value and importance of these bowl games with their playoff masturbation marketing year round. Then you've got coaches like Dabo making over $8,000,000 per year while whining about how there's no focus on academics anymore.
The spirit of college football is on its way to being ruined if it's not already there, but it was easy to see coming. I've always thought the real solutions to keeping it "pure" and healthy were to take money away, not to add more, but that's just not a feasible scenario in our country.
I love the idea of amateur athletics, sacrificing for the team, being a part of something greater, etc. But it wasn't the players who ruined that notion - it was the NCAA, the athletic departments/schools, the media who dictates the landscape and the coaches. The players finally had enough when all of the other parties started seeking the almighty dollar above all else. You have Herbstreit and Desmond Howard whining about how players these days are entitled and don't care enough with opting out of the bowl games, while these guys are millionaires paid by ESPN, one of the sole agents responsible for the cheapening of the value and importance of these bowl games with their playoff masturbation marketing year round. Then you've got coaches like Dabo making over $8,000,000 per year while whining about how there's no focus on academics anymore.
The spirit of college football is on its way to being ruined if it's not already there, but it was easy to see coming. I've always thought the real solutions to keeping it "pure" and healthy were to take money away, not to add more, but that's just not a feasible scenario in our country.
funhusker
All-American
I was just going to post something like this. You know who’s not opting out? Players in playoff games.
The best way to make the WHOLE season count is to guarantee that every Conference Champ and the highest ranked Independent is in the playoff. Add 5 “at larges” to get to 16. Play the first round at home stadium (higher rank hosts and its treated like a home game). The other 7 games can be the actual big bowls: Orange, Rose, Sugar, etc. The bowls would just have to accept that they would get moved off of New Years.
ColoradoHusk
Heisman Trophy Winner
Where is the gif of Old Man Yelling at Cloud?
BigRedBuster
International Man of Mystery
I actually agree with parts of both sides of this.
However, it’s not the playoffs that makes interest in bowls so low. It’s the pure number of them. When the playoffs started, people claimed it now makes the bowls meaningless. Well, here’s news for you. Even back in the 80s and 90s, there were a lot of bowls that were meaningless to the NC. In a typical year, there were maybe 3-4 bowls that mattered. Why is that different than three games now mattering towards the NC?
However, it’s not the playoffs that makes interest in bowls so low. It’s the pure number of them. When the playoffs started, people claimed it now makes the bowls meaningless. Well, here’s news for you. Even back in the 80s and 90s, there were a lot of bowls that were meaningless to the NC. In a typical year, there were maybe 3-4 bowls that mattered. Why is that different than three games now mattering towards the NC?
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Savage Husker
All-Conference
100% with your first paragraph. If a team wants to play a postseason game then go for it. Who cares about record, is my opinion. Reading about all the opt outs and now teams cancelling over covid, just make it so that anyone who actually wants to play will play. Some are opting out because they want to, not because they have to - it’s a waste of people’s time and resources to accept and then back out.
16 team playoff will create more parity, reduce man made matchups by “experts,” and stimulate more teams fighting for a title shot which creates more entertainment across the board - it would be more profitable too.
With the premise/reality that elite teams benefit from more rules/regulations, when they’re no longer vying for only 1 spot per conference, then preferential referee and conference decision treatment is reduced. (See ‘21 Arky vs Alabama for poorly officiated games, see ‘20 OSU > Indiana for CFP, ‘16 OSU > PSU).
This tippy toe playoff format and half assed bowl setup is a dud for entertainment value. I mean, if A&M didn’t even give the 12th man a shot to come down from the stands, then what is the point anymore?
seaofred92
All-American
I haven’t read this thread but a few things.
1. I don’t really think college football is “dead” or “dying”. People are acting like it really needs a total overhaul- the reality is there has really never been more parity across FBS ever. Just because the top 2-3 teams are insanely dominant doesn’t mean it’s broken.
2. The one thing I truly believe that is harming the sport is the complete arrogance that is shown by administrators, tv personalities, etc. Kirk Herbstreit used to be one of my favorite people ever to watch and listen to when it came to CFB. His take on players opting out yesterday was absolutely insane.
3. The entire “P5 v G5” debate people like to have is so stupid and lazy and also feeds into the arrogance. People choose to entirely ignore this but the “P5” label is an ADMINISTRATIVE title related to the number of votes each league gets in football related matters for NCAA purposes. It has NOTHING to do with competitive balance. And yet- despite the ACC losing 13 bowl games in a row (which nobody talked about) and the PAC12 going winless in bowls the last two years- we’ll still parade out the idea of being in the “P5” as some crazy badge of honor for competitive purposes. All it has done is allow for analysts and people talking about the game to get lazy in their analysis. So stupid.
Remember what I said above about parity? I think the results of this bowl season pretty much lays that out as fact- and yet we’re trying to pretend like playing teams like Washington State, Boston College, etc is vastly different than 95% of college football teams out there. The reality is there are tiers that more or less break out like this:
Top 2-3 teams (Bama, OSU, UGA)
Elite most years and can win a natty if it breaks right (LSU, Clemson, Oregon, Oklahoma)
Then there’s about 20 teams in a given year that are good and come in/out of the top 25 (Michigan, Penn State, Florida, Utah, etc)
Then there is about 80 teams that are more or less the same. On any given day they can beat one another. Central Michigan just beat Washington State. Utah State beat up Oregon State. Houston beat Auburn. Etc etc etc.
4. As a result of all of the above, instead of celebrating successful seasons for teams that come from outside of that group of 7 or so schools- we tend to immediately try to diminish their accomplishments. “Cincinnati sucks!” “Michigan was a fraud!” “Notre Dame can’t win a big game!”. It’s constant negative reinforcement and it blows my mind. UCF won 25 games in a row- TWENTY FIVE!- and instead of people being like “hey that is really awesome good for them” all we heard about was “they stink and don’t belong”. Dumb.
5. I think scheduling and the fan experience across college football needs to be looked at.
Scheduling: This breaks into two parts, the first of which is the “buy games” teams schedule. These should be 100% regional opponents.There’s no reason Arkansas should refuse to play Arkansas State regularly. Nebraska schedules FCS games against Fordham, SELA, etc (thankfully there are Dakota teams coming up) but not Missouri State, Drake, Northern Iowa, etc? The second part of this is regional home and home games which fans care about. NU has done a nice job getting CU, OU, OK St on future schedules. I’d love us to play KState, ISU, etc in the non-conference instead of our Arizona series. Or the Wazzu series Moos had lined up. Not that we can’t play teams from other regions but what moves the needle in Lincoln more- a game v Mizzou or a game v Arizona?
Fan Experience: This one is tricky for a variety of reasons. First off- it costs way way way too much money to go to a game in even decent seats. Nobody wants to sit on a crammed bench and watch a game from partially behind a pole or a goal post. The issue here is downsizing capacity for regular seats means even higher prices to make up for the reduction in attendance. Requiring donations of $1000+ per seat in order to buy season tickets that are no longer tax deductible? And you can’t purchase alcohol in the stadium and the only food you can get is a Runza, Valentinos, or hot dog? The entirety of the process needs to be looked at, from ticket sales to seating types and capacity to concession options to bathroom availability to in game promotions.
There’s probably more but I don’t really think CFB is “dead”. I think a 16 team postseason format that allowed for all FBS conference champions and 6 at larges would greatly enhance the value of all CFB contracts for all leagues across the sport- but nobody is interested in doing what is best for the greater good. And that- along with the “arrogance” factor I discussed earlier- is what gets us to where we are today.
1. I don’t really think college football is “dead” or “dying”. People are acting like it really needs a total overhaul- the reality is there has really never been more parity across FBS ever. Just because the top 2-3 teams are insanely dominant doesn’t mean it’s broken.
2. The one thing I truly believe that is harming the sport is the complete arrogance that is shown by administrators, tv personalities, etc. Kirk Herbstreit used to be one of my favorite people ever to watch and listen to when it came to CFB. His take on players opting out yesterday was absolutely insane.
3. The entire “P5 v G5” debate people like to have is so stupid and lazy and also feeds into the arrogance. People choose to entirely ignore this but the “P5” label is an ADMINISTRATIVE title related to the number of votes each league gets in football related matters for NCAA purposes. It has NOTHING to do with competitive balance. And yet- despite the ACC losing 13 bowl games in a row (which nobody talked about) and the PAC12 going winless in bowls the last two years- we’ll still parade out the idea of being in the “P5” as some crazy badge of honor for competitive purposes. All it has done is allow for analysts and people talking about the game to get lazy in their analysis. So stupid.
Remember what I said above about parity? I think the results of this bowl season pretty much lays that out as fact- and yet we’re trying to pretend like playing teams like Washington State, Boston College, etc is vastly different than 95% of college football teams out there. The reality is there are tiers that more or less break out like this:
Top 2-3 teams (Bama, OSU, UGA)
Elite most years and can win a natty if it breaks right (LSU, Clemson, Oregon, Oklahoma)
Then there’s about 20 teams in a given year that are good and come in/out of the top 25 (Michigan, Penn State, Florida, Utah, etc)
Then there is about 80 teams that are more or less the same. On any given day they can beat one another. Central Michigan just beat Washington State. Utah State beat up Oregon State. Houston beat Auburn. Etc etc etc.
4. As a result of all of the above, instead of celebrating successful seasons for teams that come from outside of that group of 7 or so schools- we tend to immediately try to diminish their accomplishments. “Cincinnati sucks!” “Michigan was a fraud!” “Notre Dame can’t win a big game!”. It’s constant negative reinforcement and it blows my mind. UCF won 25 games in a row- TWENTY FIVE!- and instead of people being like “hey that is really awesome good for them” all we heard about was “they stink and don’t belong”. Dumb.
5. I think scheduling and the fan experience across college football needs to be looked at.
Scheduling: This breaks into two parts, the first of which is the “buy games” teams schedule. These should be 100% regional opponents.There’s no reason Arkansas should refuse to play Arkansas State regularly. Nebraska schedules FCS games against Fordham, SELA, etc (thankfully there are Dakota teams coming up) but not Missouri State, Drake, Northern Iowa, etc? The second part of this is regional home and home games which fans care about. NU has done a nice job getting CU, OU, OK St on future schedules. I’d love us to play KState, ISU, etc in the non-conference instead of our Arizona series. Or the Wazzu series Moos had lined up. Not that we can’t play teams from other regions but what moves the needle in Lincoln more- a game v Mizzou or a game v Arizona?
Fan Experience: This one is tricky for a variety of reasons. First off- it costs way way way too much money to go to a game in even decent seats. Nobody wants to sit on a crammed bench and watch a game from partially behind a pole or a goal post. The issue here is downsizing capacity for regular seats means even higher prices to make up for the reduction in attendance. Requiring donations of $1000+ per seat in order to buy season tickets that are no longer tax deductible? And you can’t purchase alcohol in the stadium and the only food you can get is a Runza, Valentinos, or hot dog? The entirety of the process needs to be looked at, from ticket sales to seating types and capacity to concession options to bathroom availability to in game promotions.
There’s probably more but I don’t really think CFB is “dead”. I think a 16 team postseason format that allowed for all FBS conference champions and 6 at larges would greatly enhance the value of all CFB contracts for all leagues across the sport- but nobody is interested in doing what is best for the greater good. And that- along with the “arrogance” factor I discussed earlier- is what gets us to where we are today.
