Who wins a footrace...Crouch or Martinez?

[StPaulHusker]

I voted for Martinez based on straight line running but I would say that Crouch had a great first step. Not sure if Martinez is as good there. I think he wins the race but he would be making up ground on Crouch from the start.

 

[Joe_5700]

I think I'd take Crouch but it'd be close. Gotta remember Crouch ran 10.4 in high school as well as 4.4 at the combine. Crouch would be a god running the modern day spread. Was just watching the Wisconsin game from last year and saw a play where Taylor had a crease between two guys in the open field and got caught. My first thought was that Crouch would've split it and took it to the house. Martinez is electric but Crouch was something else.

Eh ... Crouch may have been clocked at 10.4 hand-held at a meet but his senior year he ran 10.82 in the prelims then 10.96 in the finals at state (electronically timed). Still pretty fast but a long ways from 10.4. He ran 4.47 at the combine. I'd bet Martinez will beat that next year.

It'll be close. I'd honestly be pretty surprised if he ran sub 4.4. Interesting tidbit, Jammal Lord ran 4.45 at Nebraska's pro day. Pro day times are usually faster, especially for Nebraska guys, but Jammal was pretty dang fast. Talk about easy speed, he looked like he was jogging half the time.

+1 He seemed to glide along the sidelines for huge chunks of yards while looking like he was not motoring at all.

 

[TGHusker]

Taylor would win a 20yd dash, his burst speed is great - but his top speed and evasive moves aren't all that great. Crouch had great moves, top speed and a good burst of speed. Id take Crouch over Martinez.

Agreed

 

[husker_99]

Alright as promised...

Research has shown that maximum velocity (or Vmax) during a 40 yard dash is weakly correlated to initial acceleration (measured in the first 5 or 10m), so if you are worried about Martinez's initial burst, you really need to compare his speed to others during the initial 5 or 10m of a sprint.

In the 2009 World Championship Finals, where Usain Bolt set the 100m world record at 9.58 sec, his first 10m were completed in 1.5 sec or 14.9 mph. The average stride, or length covered per step, for sprinters is 2.44m, so Bolt would have covered the first 10m in four steps. The video has Martinez at 15 mph in his first three steps. While Martinez (top speed 20.5 mph) would lose the 100m to Usain Bolt (top speed 23.35 mph), he accelerates a bit faster and could potentially beat him in the first three or four steps, Martinez's first three steps top out at 15 mph and Bolt's first four steps top out at 14.9 mph. In fact, most 100m sprinters do not hit Vmax until 50-60m.

Now, if you want to compare Martinez to other college football players, I found a study that looked at the Vmax of 61 NCAA Division II college football players. Basically, of the 29 skill players (QB, RB, WR, CB, and LB), the average time during the first 9.1m or 3-4 steps was 1.73 sec or 11.8 mph. Linemen (n=23) were slower at 1.86 sec or 10.9 mph.

[Data from: Brechue WF, Mayhew JL, Piper FC. (2010). Characteristics of sprint performance in college football players. J Strength Cond Res. 24: 1169-1178]

Also, looking at the times during the first 9.1m of a 40-yard dash for the 1,156 players that participated in the NFL Combine from 2005-2009, the average time was 1.62 sec or 12.5 mph with a standard deviation of ±0.11 sec. Which means that 68% (or athletes that fall within one standard deviation) of all these athletes ran the 9.1m between 1.51-1.73 sec or 11.76-13.5 mph. Further, this also means that 95% (or athletes that fall within two standard deviations) of all these athletes ran it between 1.4-1.84 sec or 11-14.5 mph. Thus, Martinez's first three steps (which is only 3*2.44m or 7.32m at 15 mph) is faster than 95% of the athletes that have competed at the NFL Combine from 2005-2009. Meaning Martinez is accelerating faster within less distance than most elite football players.

[Data covering the NFL Combine from: Robbins DW. (2012). The normalization of explosive functional movements in a diverse population of elite American football players. J Strength Cond Res. 26: 995-1000.]

So, no, Martinez does not take too long to get going. DUDE, IT'S SCIENCE!!!

You also assume he can still do this post injury. Yes i would agree with you pre-injury.

 

[Coqui]

According to Google, they both run a 4.47 40

So my money is on Crouch (given Martinez is running with today's technology in shoes, etc. and Crouch wasn't)

 

[onlyHskrfaninIL]

I would guess they have similar top end speed but Taylor gets off the line quicker - advantage Martinez

 

[Thanks_Tom RR]

Alright as promised...

Research has shown that maximum velocity (or Vmax) during a 40 yard dash is weakly correlated to initial acceleration (measured in the first 5 or 10m), so if you are worried about Martinez's initial burst, you really need to compare his speed to others during the initial 5 or 10m of a sprint.

In the 2009 World Championship Finals, where Usain Bolt set the 100m world record at 9.58 sec, his first 10m were completed in 1.5 sec or 14.9 mph. The average stride, or length covered per step, for sprinters is 2.44m, so Bolt would have covered the first 10m in four steps. The video has Martinez at 15 mph in his first three steps. While Martinez (top speed 20.5 mph) would lose the 100m to Usain Bolt (top speed 23.35 mph), he accelerates a bit faster and could potentially beat him in the first three or four steps, Martinez's first three steps top out at 15 mph and Bolt's first four steps top out at 14.9 mph. In fact, most 100m sprinters do not hit Vmax until 50-60m.

Now, if you want to compare Martinez to other college football players, I found a study that looked at the Vmax of 61 NCAA Division II college football players. Basically, of the 29 skill players (QB, RB, WR, CB, and LB), the average time during the first 9.1m or 3-4 steps was 1.73 sec or 11.8 mph. Linemen (n=23) were slower at 1.86 sec or 10.9 mph.

[Data from: Brechue WF, Mayhew JL, Piper FC. (2010). Characteristics of sprint performance in college football players. J Strength Cond Res. 24: 1169-1178]

Also, looking at the times during the first 9.1m of a 40-yard dash for the 1,156 players that participated in the NFL Combine from 2005-2009, the average time was 1.62 sec or 12.5 mph with a standard deviation of ±0.11 sec. Which means that 68% (or athletes that fall within one standard deviation) of all these athletes ran the 9.1m between 1.51-1.73 sec or 11.76-13.5 mph. Further, this also means that 95% (or athletes that fall within two standard deviations) of all these athletes ran it between 1.4-1.84 sec or 11-14.5 mph. Thus, Martinez's first three steps (which is only 3*2.44m or 7.32m at 15 mph) is faster than 95% of the athletes that have competed at the NFL Combine from 2005-2009. Meaning Martinez is accelerating faster within less distance than most elite football players.

[Data covering the NFL Combine from: Robbins DW. (2012). The normalization of explosive functional movements in a diverse population of elite American football players. J Strength Cond Res. 26: 995-1000.]

So, no, Martinez does not take too long to get going. DUDE, IT'S SCIENCE!!!

You also assume he can still do this post injury. Yes i would agree with you pre-injury.

What?! You are really digging yourself into a hole.

Are you saying Martinez vs Crouch today? Because you can't take Crouch in his prime (circa 2001) and not be willing to go three years back to Taylor's RS freshman year. If you were talking about them in their current conditions, Martinez would torch Crouch if they walked out on the field right now.

 

[husker_99]

Alright as promised...

Research has shown that maximum velocity (or Vmax) during a 40 yard dash is weakly correlated to initial acceleration (measured in the first 5 or 10m), so if you are worried about Martinez's initial burst, you really need to compare his speed to others during the initial 5 or 10m of a sprint.

In the 2009 World Championship Finals, where Usain Bolt set the 100m world record at 9.58 sec, his first 10m were completed in 1.5 sec or 14.9 mph. The average stride, or length covered per step, for sprinters is 2.44m, so Bolt would have covered the first 10m in four steps. The video has Martinez at 15 mph in his first three steps. While Martinez (top speed 20.5 mph) would lose the 100m to Usain Bolt (top speed 23.35 mph), he accelerates a bit faster and could potentially beat him in the first three or four steps, Martinez's first three steps top out at 15 mph and Bolt's first four steps top out at 14.9 mph. In fact, most 100m sprinters do not hit Vmax until 50-60m.

Now, if you want to compare Martinez to other college football players, I found a study that looked at the Vmax of 61 NCAA Division II college football players. Basically, of the 29 skill players (QB, RB, WR, CB, and LB), the average time during the first 9.1m or 3-4 steps was 1.73 sec or 11.8 mph. Linemen (n=23) were slower at 1.86 sec or 10.9 mph.

[Data from: Brechue WF, Mayhew JL, Piper FC. (2010). Characteristics of sprint performance in college football players. J Strength Cond Res. 24: 1169-1178]

Also, looking at the times during the first 9.1m of a 40-yard dash for the 1,156 players that participated in the NFL Combine from 2005-2009, the average time was 1.62 sec or 12.5 mph with a standard deviation of ±0.11 sec. Which means that 68% (or athletes that fall within one standard deviation) of all these athletes ran the 9.1m between 1.51-1.73 sec or 11.76-13.5 mph. Further, this also means that 95% (or athletes that fall within two standard deviations) of all these athletes ran it between 1.4-1.84 sec or 11-14.5 mph. Thus, Martinez's first three steps (which is only 3*2.44m or 7.32m at 15 mph) is faster than 95% of the athletes that have competed at the NFL Combine from 2005-2009. Meaning Martinez is accelerating faster within less distance than most elite football players.

[Data covering the NFL Combine from: Robbins DW. (2012). The normalization of explosive functional movements in a diverse population of elite American football players. J Strength Cond Res. 26: 995-1000.]

So, no, Martinez does not take too long to get going. DUDE, IT'S SCIENCE!!!

You also assume he can still do this post injury. Yes i would agree with you pre-injury.

What?! You are really digging yourself into a hole.

Are you saying Martinez vs Crouch today? Because you can't take Crouch in his prime (circa 2001) and not be willing to go three years back to Taylor's RS freshmen year. If you were talking about them in their current conditions, Martinez would torch Crouch if they walked out on the field right now.

You can't apply to Taylor's freshman year because most of his playing time is post injury. Besides that was only for like 8-9 games then he got hurt. Taylor is still in his prime. Since they are both going to have senior seasons you take those seasons as the race. I imagine a early 20 something kid could outrun a 34 year old who doesn't play anymore.

 

[HuskerNationNick]

You can't apply to Taylor's freshman year because most of his playing time is post injury. Besides that was only for like 8-9 games then he got hurt. Taylor is still in his prime. Since they are both going to have senior seasons you take those seasons as the race. I imagine a early 20 something kid could outrun a 34 year old who doesn't play anymore.

Ummm.... Taylor got injured in his 8th game, definitely not "most of his playing time is post injury". There were 6 more games after that, where we never game him time to heal. Taylor is not like what he was his RS Freshman year. He has yet to prove that, except with one run. He may have been physically back, but I don't believe he was mentally healed. I expect Taylor to run lights out this year, while making smarter decisions.

 

[Thanks_Tom RR]

Alright as promised...

Research has shown that maximum velocity (or Vmax) during a 40 yard dash is weakly correlated to initial acceleration (measured in the first 5 or 10m), so if you are worried about Martinez's initial burst, you really need to compare his speed to others during the initial 5 or 10m of a sprint.

In the 2009 World Championship Finals, where Usain Bolt set the 100m world record at 9.58 sec, his first 10m were completed in 1.5 sec or 14.9 mph. The average stride, or length covered per step, for sprinters is 2.44m, so Bolt would have covered the first 10m in four steps. The video has Martinez at 15 mph in his first three steps. While Martinez (top speed 20.5 mph) would lose the 100m to Usain Bolt (top speed 23.35 mph), he accelerates a bit faster and could potentially beat him in the first three or four steps, Martinez's first three steps top out at 15 mph and Bolt's first four steps top out at 14.9 mph. In fact, most 100m sprinters do not hit Vmax until 50-60m.

Now, if you want to compare Martinez to other college football players, I found a study that looked at the Vmax of 61 NCAA Division II college football players. Basically, of the 29 skill players (QB, RB, WR, CB, and LB), the average time during the first 9.1m or 3-4 steps was 1.73 sec or 11.8 mph. Linemen (n=23) were slower at 1.86 sec or 10.9 mph.

[Data from: Brechue WF, Mayhew JL, Piper FC. (2010). Characteristics of sprint performance in college football players. J Strength Cond Res. 24: 1169-1178]

Also, looking at the times during the first 9.1m of a 40-yard dash for the 1,156 players that participated in the NFL Combine from 2005-2009, the average time was 1.62 sec or 12.5 mph with a standard deviation of ±0.11 sec. Which means that 68% (or athletes that fall within one standard deviation) of all these athletes ran the 9.1m between 1.51-1.73 sec or 11.76-13.5 mph. Further, this also means that 95% (or athletes that fall within two standard deviations) of all these athletes ran it between 1.4-1.84 sec or 11-14.5 mph. Thus, Martinez's first three steps (which is only 3*2.44m or 7.32m at 15 mph) is faster than 95% of the athletes that have competed at the NFL Combine from 2005-2009. Meaning Martinez is accelerating faster within less distance than most elite football players.

[Data covering the NFL Combine from: Robbins DW. (2012). The normalization of explosive functional movements in a diverse population of elite American football players. J Strength Cond Res. 26: 995-1000.]

So, no, Martinez does not take too long to get going. DUDE, IT'S SCIENCE!!!

You also assume he can still do this post injury. Yes i would agree with you pre-injury.

What?! You are really digging yourself into a hole.

Are you saying Martinez vs Crouch today? Because you can't take Crouch in his prime (circa 2001) and not be willing to go three years back to Taylor's RS freshmen year. If you were talking about them in their current conditions, Martinez would torch Crouch if they walked out on the field right now.

You can't apply to Taylor's freshman year because most of his playing time is post injury. Besides that was only for like 8-9 games then he got hurt. Taylor is still in his prime. Since they are both going to have senior seasons you take those seasons as the race. I imagine a early 20 something kid could outrun a 34 year old who doesn't play anymore.

:facepalm: If you are going to compare them only during their senior years, then you can't even make any comparisons yet. You would obviously have to wait until after this next season. If this is your argument, then this entire conversation is moot.

 

[True2tRA]

Alright as promised...

Research has shown that maximum velocity (or Vmax) during a 40 yard dash is weakly correlated to initial acceleration (measured in the first 5 or 10m), so if you are worried about Martinez's initial burst, you really need to compare his speed to others during the initial 5 or 10m of a sprint.

In the 2009 World Championship Finals, where Usain Bolt set the 100m world record at 9.58 sec, his first 10m were completed in 1.5 sec or 14.9 mph. The average stride, or length covered per step, for sprinters is 2.44m, so Bolt would have covered the first 10m in four steps. The video has Martinez at 15 mph in his first three steps. While Martinez (top speed 20.5 mph) would lose the 100m to Usain Bolt (top speed 23.35 mph), he accelerates a bit faster and could potentially beat him in the first three or four steps, Martinez's first three steps top out at 15 mph and Bolt's first four steps top out at 14.9 mph. In fact, most 100m sprinters do not hit Vmax until 50-60m.

Now, if you want to compare Martinez to other college football players, I found a study that looked at the Vmax of 61 NCAA Division II college football players. Basically, of the 29 skill players (QB, RB, WR, CB, and LB), the average time during the first 9.1m or 3-4 steps was 1.73 sec or 11.8 mph. Linemen (n=23) were slower at 1.86 sec or 10.9 mph.

[Data from: Brechue WF, Mayhew JL, Piper FC. (2010). Characteristics of sprint performance in college football players. J Strength Cond Res. 24: 1169-1178]

Also, looking at the times during the first 9.1m of a 40-yard dash for the 1,156 players that participated in the NFL Combine from 2005-2009, the average time was 1.62 sec or 12.5 mph with a standard deviation of ±0.11 sec. Which means that 68% (or athletes that fall within one standard deviation) of all these athletes ran the 9.1m between 1.51-1.73 sec or 11.76-13.5 mph. Further, this also means that 95% (or athletes that fall within two standard deviations) of all these athletes ran it between 1.4-1.84 sec or 11-14.5 mph. Thus, Martinez's first three steps (which is only 3*2.44m or 7.32m at 15 mph) is faster than 95% of the athletes that have competed at the NFL Combine from 2005-2009. Meaning Martinez is accelerating faster within less distance than most elite football players.

[Data covering the NFL Combine from: Robbins DW. (2012). The normalization of explosive functional movements in a diverse population of elite American football players. J Strength Cond Res. 26: 995-1000.]

So, no, Martinez does not take too long to get going. DUDE, IT'S SCIENCE!!!

You also assume he can still do this post injury. Yes i would agree with you pre-injury.

What?! You are really digging yourself into a hole.

Are you saying Martinez vs Crouch today? Because you can't take Crouch in his prime (circa 2001) and not be willing to go three years back to Taylor's RS freshmen year. If you were talking about them in their current conditions, Martinez would torch Crouch if they walked out on the field right now.

You can't apply to Taylor's freshman year because most of his playing time is post injury. Besides that was only for like 8-9 games then he got hurt. Taylor is still in his prime. Since they are both going to have senior seasons you take those seasons as the race. I imagine a early 20 something kid could outrun a 34 year old who doesn't play anymore.

:facepalm: If you are going to compare them only during their senior year, then you can't even make any comparisons yet. You would obviously have to wait until after this next season. If this is your argument, then this entire conversation is moot.

Hahaha! Only at Huskerboard. We can complicate the hell out of anything here and apparently even argue over a scheme that has been called complicated for five years now by a few hundred thousand people, yet three guys on Huskerboard can pretend they've never heard such a thing! Now this! I love this place!

 

[I am I]

Wrong quote response, chive on