Xbox One

[simplekin]

I blame the backlash from the community. If we would've taken more time to think about the pros the combination once a day Internet connection and the DRM instead of just blasting on the cons (some of which are misguided), perhaps this could've led to a better gaming future for the consumer. The article GSG posted from Gizmodo points this out.

Sony took advantage of the people's misconceptions of how DRM works, and it worked. But in the long run, we (the community) will come out on the losing end, again. They forced Microsoft to abandon their vision, and that sucks.

Very good points. I agree. On the bright side, it seems the One will still be capable of everything they were trying to do anyway since the thing was based on that architecture. I still believe it will happen eventually.

What I think is funny, is all of the people that are giving MS sh#t for reverting all of the policies everyone was pissed about in the first place. Like it's even worse that they changed their policy to accommodate the players. eyeswear2allthatsholy

 

[Apathy]

Would you ever date someone who tried raping you?

 

[navysker]

Would you ever date someone who tried raping you?

Would you date someone who lost your credit card information?

 

[Saunders]

I blame the backlash from the community. If we would've taken more time to think about the pros the combination once a day Internet connection and the DRM instead of just blasting on the cons (some of which are misguided), perhaps this could've led to a better gaming future for the consumer. The article GSG posted from Gizmodo points this out.

Sony took advantage of the people's misconceptions of how DRM works, and it worked. But in the long run, we (the community) will come out on the losing end, again. They forced Microsoft to abandon their vision, and that sucks.

Nope. Microsoft never came out and explained exactly what you could and couldn't do. Their entire PR campaign was handwaving and vagaries. Even Major Nelson looked dumb in interviews (and I normally like the guy) because everything wasn't spelled out.

I've been a gamer all my life. I grew up playing Lucasarts Adventure titles, did the fps clan thing in the mid 90's, and I saw what happened to PC games because of "DRM" like starforce. People keep comparing Xbone to Steam, but they were in entirely different markets. PC games had huge piracy rates from day 1, and we've had CD keys and crappy DRM solutions for over a decade. While steam isn't perfect, it proved to be a boon for PC games, because they have virtually no shelf space in brick and mortar stores. This allows valve and publishers to run awesome sales, because they aren't undercutting retailers and dealing with those contracts.

Contrast that with consoles, which dominate retail space, and haven't had DRM, ever. Borrowing and selling console games has been common forever. Microsoft's used game deal sucked for consumers, because they were negotiating back door deals with Gamestop and Best Buy for "official" used game deals. They would cut out p2p sales (craigslist and ebay) and have a stranglehold on pricing. Look at the big games on PC (COD, Blizzard games) that have shelf space in brick and mortar stores and they don't drop price at all. Same thing would happen on Xbox one.

 

[Chaddyboxer]

Would you ever date someone who tried raping you?

Would you date someone who lost your credit card information?

Having Sony Online hacked wasn't in Sony's intentions...now....having to pay a fee to sell a used Xbox One game, the consoles having to be on 24 hours, and lastly having the Kinect on at all times while it audio records ya.....those things are totally in Microsoft's control and were initially intentional. Microsoft is back-peddling now trying to make everything right...I use to be a big Xbox fan, welp...they lost one.

 

[Lyons in the Sea of Red.]

So just because a company majorly f'd up but it wasn't in their intentions that means they get a free pass? I dont think you'd feel that way if for some reason you were hurt financially because of it. I understand what you are trying to say, but that is a really shallow way of looking at it.

 

[Saunders]

So just because a company majorly f'd up but it wasn't in their intentions that means they get a free pass? I dont think you'd feel that way if for some reason you were hurt financially because of it. I understand what you are trying to say, but that is a really shallow way of looking at it.

Valve's been hacked. EA's been hacked. Visa's been hacked, Almost every bank major bank has been hacked. It's a problem, but it's not that uncommon unfortunately.

 

[Lyons in the Sea of Red.]

So just because a company majorly f'd up but it wasn't in their intentions that means they get a free pass? I dont think you'd feel that way if for some reason you were hurt financially because of it. I understand what you are trying to say, but that is a really shallow way of looking at it.

Valve's been hacked. EA's been hacked. Visa's been hacked, Almost every bank major bank has been hacked. It's a problem, but it's not that uncommon unfortunately.

This is true, and I don't disagree. And I wouldn't bail on Sony for it. But let's be real, Sony got raped. Maybe I'm just being naive, but imo, there is no reason a company of that magnitude, especially in the technology sector, with that amount of sensitive information, should ever let it get to the point that sony did. And then take over a month to get a handle on the situation.

 

[It'sNotAFakeID]

I blame the backlash from the community. If we would've taken more time to think about the pros the combination once a day Internet connection and the DRM instead of just blasting on the cons (some of which are misguided), perhaps this could've led to a better gaming future for the consumer. The article GSG posted from Gizmodo points this out.

Sony took advantage of the people's misconceptions of how DRM works, and it worked. But in the long run, we (the community) will come out on the losing end, again. They forced Microsoft to abandon their vision, and that sucks.

Nope. Microsoft never came out and explained exactly what you could and couldn't do. Their entire PR campaign was handwaving and vagaries. Even Major Nelson looked dumb in interviews (and I normally like the guy) because everything wasn't spelled out.

I've been a gamer all my life. I grew up playing Lucasarts Adventure titles, did the fps clan thing in the mid 90's, and I saw what happened to PC games because of "DRM" like starforce. People keep comparing Xbone to Steam, but they were in entirely different markets. PC games had huge piracy rates from day 1, and we've had CD keys and crappy DRM solutions for over a decade. While steam isn't perfect, it proved to be a boon for PC games, because they have virtually no shelf space in brick and mortar stores. This allows valve and publishers to run awesome sales, because they aren't undercutting retailers and dealing with those contracts.

Contrast that with consoles, which dominate retail space, and haven't had DRM, ever. Borrowing and selling console games has been common forever. Microsoft's used game deal sucked for consumers, because they were negotiating back door deals with Gamestop and Best Buy for "official" used game deals. They would cut out p2p sales (craigslist and ebay) and have a stranglehold on pricing. Look at the big games on PC (COD, Blizzard games) that have shelf space in brick and mortar stores and they don't drop price at all. Same thing would happen on Xbox one.

Neither of us knows how it would've worked out. It's all speculation.

For the record, the price of Starcraft 2 has dropped from $49.99 to $39.99, in both the physical and digital worlds.

 

[simplekin]

Don Mattrick's First Draft of the Xbox One Update Announcement

http://www.dorkly.com/article/52521/don-mattricks-first-draft-of-the-xbox-one-update-announcement

 

[Saunders]

I blame the backlash from the community. If we would've taken more time to think about the pros the combination once a day Internet connection and the DRM instead of just blasting on the cons (some of which are misguided), perhaps this could've led to a better gaming future for the consumer. The article GSG posted from Gizmodo points this out.

Sony took advantage of the people's misconceptions of how DRM works, and it worked. But in the long run, we (the community) will come out on the losing end, again. They forced Microsoft to abandon their vision, and that sucks.

Nope. Microsoft never came out and explained exactly what you could and couldn't do. Their entire PR campaign was handwaving and vagaries. Even Major Nelson looked dumb in interviews (and I normally like the guy) because everything wasn't spelled out.

I've been a gamer all my life. I grew up playing Lucasarts Adventure titles, did the fps clan thing in the mid 90's, and I saw what happened to PC games because of "DRM" like starforce. People keep comparing Xbone to Steam, but they were in entirely different markets. PC games had huge piracy rates from day 1, and we've had CD keys and crappy DRM solutions for over a decade. While steam isn't perfect, it proved to be a boon for PC games, because they have virtually no shelf space in brick and mortar stores. This allows valve and publishers to run awesome sales, because they aren't undercutting retailers and dealing with those contracts.

Contrast that with consoles, which dominate retail space, and haven't had DRM, ever. Borrowing and selling console games has been common forever. Microsoft's used game deal sucked for consumers, because they were negotiating back door deals with Gamestop and Best Buy for "official" used game deals. They would cut out p2p sales (craigslist and ebay) and have a stranglehold on pricing. Look at the big games on PC (COD, Blizzard games) that have shelf space in brick and mortar stores and they don't drop price at all. Same thing would happen on Xbox one.

Neither of us knows how it would've worked out. It's all speculation.

For the record, the price of Starcraft 2 has dropped from $49.99 to $39.99, in both the physical and digital worlds.

I was being somewhat hyperbolic, but still, SC2 is 3 years old. I bought The new tomb Raider for PC for $33 on launch day, because its steamworks. It was $60 on consoles. PC games drop faster in price than their console counterparts, even though the dev costs are normally higher, because they don't have to deal with retail. Microsoft also charges a crap ton more than valve, and there's no way they were gonna pass that on to consumers.

 

[Saunders]

Don Mattrick's First Draft of the Xbox One Update Announcement


http://www.dorkly.com/article/52521/don-mattricks-first-draft-of-the-xbox-one-update-announcement

its amusing how wrong this article is. Used games could only be bought/sold through official channels, like GameStop. What they did, was cut out p2p sales like Craigslist, eBay, or selling to a buddy. Couple this with the fact that their family share plan was nothing more than a timed demo, and they were screwing customers over.
No thank you.

 

[It'sNotAFakeID]

I blame the backlash from the community. If we would've taken more time to think about the pros the combination once a day Internet connection and the DRM instead of just blasting on the cons (some of which are misguided), perhaps this could've led to a better gaming future for the consumer. The article GSG posted from Gizmodo points this out.

Sony took advantage of the people's misconceptions of how DRM works, and it worked. But in the long run, we (the community) will come out on the losing end, again. They forced Microsoft to abandon their vision, and that sucks.

Nope. Microsoft never came out and explained exactly what you could and couldn't do. Their entire PR campaign was handwaving and vagaries. Even Major Nelson looked dumb in interviews (and I normally like the guy) because everything wasn't spelled out.

I've been a gamer all my life. I grew up playing Lucasarts Adventure titles, did the fps clan thing in the mid 90's, and I saw what happened to PC games because of "DRM" like starforce. People keep comparing Xbone to Steam, but they were in entirely different markets. PC games had huge piracy rates from day 1, and we've had CD keys and crappy DRM solutions for over a decade. While steam isn't perfect, it proved to be a boon for PC games, because they have virtually no shelf space in brick and mortar stores. This allows valve and publishers to run awesome sales, because they aren't undercutting retailers and dealing with those contracts.

Contrast that with consoles, which dominate retail space, and haven't had DRM, ever. Borrowing and selling console games has been common forever. Microsoft's used game deal sucked for consumers, because they were negotiating back door deals with Gamestop and Best Buy for "official" used game deals. They would cut out p2p sales (craigslist and ebay) and have a stranglehold on pricing. Look at the big games on PC (COD, Blizzard games) that have shelf space in brick and mortar stores and they don't drop price at all. Same thing would happen on Xbox one.

Neither of us knows how it would've worked out. It's all speculation.

For the record, the price of Starcraft 2 has dropped from $49.99 to $39.99, in both the physical and digital worlds.

I was being somewhat hyperbolic, but still, SC2 is 3 years old. I bought The new tomb Raider for PC for $33 on launch day, because its steamworks. It was $60 on consoles. PC games drop faster in price than their console counterparts, even though the dev costs are normally higher, because they don't have to deal with retail. Microsoft also charges a crap ton more than valve, and there's no way they were gonna pass that on to consumers.

I agree, and I never for once thought that we would see similar price drops for console games as what does occur with PC games. But, if console games prices dropped somewhere in the $8-$10 to ~$50, isn't that good enough? It is for me.

 

[Chaddyboxer]

So just because a company majorly f'd up but it wasn't in their intentions that means they get a free pass? I dont think you'd feel that way if for some reason you were hurt financially because of it. I understand what you are trying to say, but that is a really shallow way of looking at it.

Valve's been hacked. EA's been hacked. Visa's been hacked, Almost every bank major bank has been hacked. It's a problem, but it's not that uncommon unfortunately.

This is true, and I don't disagree. And I wouldn't bail on Sony for it. But let's be real, Sony got raped. Maybe I'm just being naive, but imo, there is no reason a company of that magnitude, especially in the technology sector, with that amount of sensitive information, should ever let it get to the point that sony did. And then take over a month to get a handle on the situation.

Honestly...I don't like it either. I never had to go through that BS because I owned an xbox 360 with a xbox live subscription. I just hate that a company would try to take away aspects of the gaming that made it very enjoyable.

I mean...c'mon...I BOUGHT the damn game...I OWN it...it is MINE. I should have the right to do what I want with it. You have that freedom with basically pretty much everything else you buy that is your property.

 

[Saunders]

I blame the backlash from the community. If we would've taken more time to think about the pros the combination once a day Internet connection and the DRM instead of just blasting on the cons (some of which are misguided), perhaps this could've led to a better gaming future for the consumer. The article GSG posted from Gizmodo points this out.

Sony took advantage of the people's misconceptions of how DRM works, and it worked. But in the long run, we (the community) will come out on the losing end, again. They forced Microsoft to abandon their vision, and that sucks.

Nope. Microsoft never came out and explained exactly what you could and couldn't do. Their entire PR campaign was handwaving and vagaries. Even Major Nelson looked dumb in interviews (and I normally like the guy) because everything wasn't spelled out.

I've been a gamer all my life. I grew up playing Lucasarts Adventure titles, did the fps clan thing in the mid 90's, and I saw what happened to PC games because of "DRM" like starforce. People keep comparing Xbone to Steam, but they were in entirely different markets. PC games had huge piracy rates from day 1, and we've had CD keys and crappy DRM solutions for over a decade. While steam isn't perfect, it proved to be a boon for PC games, because they have virtually no shelf space in brick and mortar stores. This allows valve and publishers to run awesome sales, because they aren't undercutting retailers and dealing with those contracts.

Contrast that with consoles, which dominate retail space, and haven't had DRM, ever. Borrowing and selling console games has been common forever. Microsoft's used game deal sucked for consumers, because they were negotiating back door deals with Gamestop and Best Buy for "official" used game deals. They would cut out p2p sales (craigslist and ebay) and have a stranglehold on pricing. Look at the big games on PC (COD, Blizzard games) that have shelf space in brick and mortar stores and they don't drop price at all. Same thing would happen on Xbox one.

Neither of us knows how it would've worked out. It's all speculation.

For the record, the price of Starcraft 2 has dropped from $49.99 to $39.99, in both the physical and digital worlds.

I was being somewhat hyperbolic, but still, SC2 is 3 years old. I bought The new tomb Raider for PC for $33 on launch day, because its steamworks. It was $60 on consoles. PC games drop faster in price than their console counterparts, even though the dev costs are normally higher, because they don't have to deal with retail. Microsoft also charges a crap ton more than valve, and there's no way they were gonna pass that on to consumers.

I agree, and I never for once thought that we would see similar price drops for console games as what does occur with PC games. But, if console games prices dropped somewhere in the $8-$10 to ~$50, isn't that good enough? It is for me.

It wasn't going to happen. Console games were already staying at $60, while PC games are still at $50 for the most part. The bullsh#t inflation of dev costs is mostly due to marketing (IIRC, activision spent something like 50% of their COD:BO2 budget on marketing). They aren't giving that money back.

This wasn't about offering a deal consumers, it was about control. On PC you have Steam, Origin, gamefly, GMG, GOG, etc.... there's a crapton of digital delivery platforms, and they're all competing. With Microsofts plan, every game (even physical copies) were essentially digital copies that you bought from them. They got their share, cut out p2p used game sales (craigslist and ebay) and "offered" an offical used game sale through Gamestop, Best Buy, etc where they can tack on a transaction fee. Couple that with the fact that their touted "family sharing" was nothing more than a timed demo (remember when we used to get real demos?), and there was actual appeal to what they were offering.