Carnes Starter?

[ADS]

I mean For Real. This is pathetic.

 

[walksalone]

What part of "new offense", "new offensive co-ordinator", "more line coaching", "silly incoming talent", and "fat slow opponents on the way" did you miss?

ITS BEEN ADDRESSED. STOP CRYING.

at least give the new staff a chance before you jump off the cliff with the rest of the lemmings.

FOLLOW ME, FOLLOW ME TO FREEDOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[RedDenver]

FOLLOW ME, FOLLOW ME TO FREEDOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!

My All-Time favorite Sportscenter commercial.

 

[Enhance]

The only reason why people are courting Carnes and dogging Taylor is because Carnes hasnt been given the oppurtunity fo F**k up yet. People are making him out to be the next coming of Christ after he had a decent SPRING GAME.

Although Carnes did have a good spring game that isn't fully the reason. Did you not watch the end of last year? It was absolutely pathetic. Obviously stats wise it was horrible, but his attitude was even worse, and he still isn't fully healthy. I think Taylor and Carnes can take us far. Just have to trust Bo and his decision.

The greater majority (mainly the second half) of 2009 was pathetic. People clamored for Martinez during the spring/fall and low-and-behold he started in 2010. He got injured, and the offense was pathetic to finish out another season.

Two seasons in a row, two different quarterbacks and both offenses were just embarrassing against above average competition.

I'm not clamoring for either quarterback, and obviously Martinez was a problem. How could he not be with the way he played to finish 2010? But two years in a row our offenses failed after injuries to our quarterback, which says a lot to me about the TEAM than just the quarterback. Championship teams should be able to perform better than they did when the starter got hurt, and I blame that more on Watson and his offensive unit as a whole than I do Martinez.

I still feel today that our offensive line and the coaching is the weakest facet of this team.

Damn good point, Enhance. The only little point I disagree with is that 2009's offense was pathetic the instant it finished with the three SunBelt teams.

I would even further say Tmart's outrageously talent masked a horribly inept offensive scheme & coaching when healthy. He gets hurts...."poof!".....instant 2009 all over again.

I totally agree with your premise with the small exception that "possibly" the Oline's major problem was taking marching orders from a grossly incompetent OC the last three years. This year shows substantial improvement with the Oline or it's bu-bye Barney.

I don't know squat about the new offensive coaches or even what they're going to do but I figure odds are very high they'll do better than the previous ones. Yeah, that isn't saying much but there's a reasonable chance they'll do much better.

GBR!

The terminology Beck throws around already makes me more comfortable than Watson. Beck likes to talk about attacking a defense. Watson liked to talk about reading the defense and taking what they give us.

There will always be some read and react to an offensive (and for that matter, defensive) scheme, but I enjoy the idea that they will fight to do what they want to do. I don't like the concept of letting the defense dictate how you play your game. The offense should be dictating the tempo and the course of the game.

This is why I just can't put everything on Martinez, or Lee from the year before. If a team puts up three of four disappointing offensive performances to finish the season after a quarterback is hurt, then I blame the offense.

 

[Hujan]

walksalone, aspeedin, and UGAHusker:

I lol'd. You cats crack me up.

 

[zoogs]

The terminology Beck throws around already makes me more comfortable than Watson. Beck likes to talk about attacking a defense. Watson liked to talk about reading the defense and taking what they give us.

It does make you more comfortable, the terminology, doesn't it? “I’ve always tried to stay on the cutting edge,” the coach said. “I push myself and keep my box open to new ideas and trends to attack a defense. I mean, that’s my job, to stay ahead of the curve. So this has been a real easy transition.”"

This is why I just can't put everything on Martinez, or Lee from the year before. If a team puts up three of four disappointing offensive performances to finish the season after a quarterback is hurt, then I blame the offense.

Because an offense should play well regardless of whether a passing QB has an injured throwing arm, or whether a running QB has injured wheels? I don't know about that.

 

[Hunter94]

The only reason why people are courting Carnes and dogging Taylor is because Carnes hasnt been given the oppurtunity fo F**k up yet. People are making him out to be the next coming of Christ after he had a decent SPRING GAME.

Although Carnes did have a good spring game that isn't fully the reason. Did you not watch the end of last year? It was absolutely pathetic. Obviously stats wise it was horrible, but his attitude was even worse, and he still isn't fully healthy. I think Taylor and Carnes can take us far. Just have to trust Bo and his decision.

The greater majority (mainly the second half) of 2009 was pathetic. People clamored for Martinez during the spring/fall and low-and-behold he started in 2010. He got injured, and the offense was pathetic to finish out another season.

Two seasons in a row, two different quarterbacks and both offenses were just embarrassing against above average competition.

I'm not clamoring for either quarterback, and obviously Martinez was a problem. How could he not be with the way he played to finish 2010? But two years in a row our offenses failed after injuries to our quarterback, which says a lot to me about the TEAM than just the quarterback. Championship teams should be able to perform better than they did when the starter got hurt, and I blame that more on Watson and his offensive unit as a whole than I do Martinez.

I still feel today that our offensive line and the coaching is the weakest facet of this team.

Damn good point, Enhance. The only little point I disagree with is that 2009's offense was pathetic the instant it finished with the three SunBelt teams.

I would even further say Tmart's outrageously talent masked a horribly inept offensive scheme & coaching when healthy. He gets hurts...."poof!".....instant 2009 all over again.

I totally agree with your premise with the small exception that "possibly" the Oline's major problem was taking marching orders from a grossly incompetent OC the last three years. This year shows substantial improvement with the Oline or it's bu-bye Barney.

I don't know squat about the new offensive coaches or even what they're going to do but I figure odds are very high they'll do better than the previous ones. Yeah, that isn't saying much but there's a reasonable chance they'll do much better.

GBR!

The terminology Beck throws around already makes me more comfortable than Watson. Beck likes to talk about attacking a defense. Watson liked to talk about reading the defense and taking what they give us.

wow, i don't care what the guy says or how he says it, i would be happy with some long drives, occasional points scored and some decent half time adjustments, when necessary.

There will always be some read and react to an offensive (and for that matter, defensive) scheme, but I enjoy the idea that they will fight to do what they want to do. I don't like the concept of letting the defense dictate how you play your game. The offense should be dictating the tempo and the course of the game.

sounds good, but when a D stacks the box, you better come out throwing or with some play action.

This is why I just can't put everything on Martinez, or Lee from the year before. If a team puts up three of four disappointing offensive performances to finish the season after a quarterback is hurt, then I blame the offense.

Martinez played as poorly as his offensive line, plenty of blame to go around.

 

[Enhance]

Because an offense should play well regardless of whether a passing QB has an injured throwing arm, or whether a running QB has injured wheels? I don't know about that.

An offense should play better than 6 points against A&M and 7 against Washington, regardless of the quarterback. That's just my philosophy and my opinion on the matter, of course. An injured Martinez shouldn't have resulted in those poor of offensive outputs against average defenses.

I think it's a well accepted fact that Martinez just masked clear problems with the offense, but maybe I'm off base with that.

 

[zoogs]

I'd disagree with that assertion in the last sentence. An offense only has its players to work with. The idea that a good player "masks" a poor offense is like saying an offense should be able to succeed by our usual standards without any good players. I think that's an unreasonable expectation (although we've done it before - the output we had in '08 with smart, tough, but far from elite players in Ganz, Swift, and Peterson was pretty incredible).

I could see an argument if Taylor was constantly succeeding by operating outside the offense,doing things on his own when plays broke down. But Taylor's best success all year came when he was operating within it, and whenever he improvised, it turned out disastrously.

An offense should certainly play better than that in my opinion, but *regardless* of QB. If the guy we are trotting out there is injured and hobbled in his greatest asset, though, all bets are off.

 

[Enhance]

I'd disagree with that assertion in the last sentence. An offense only has its players to work with. The idea that a good player "masks" a poor offense is like saying an offense should be able to succeed by our usual standards without any good players. I think that's an unreasonable expectation (although we've done it before - the output we had in '08 with smart, tough, but far from elite players in Ganz, Swift, and Peterson was pretty incredible).

I could see an argument if Taylor was constantly succeeding by operating outside the offense,doing things on his own when plays broke down. But Taylor's best success all year came when he was operating within it, and whenever he improvised, it turned out disastrously.

An offense should certainly play better than that in my opinion, but *regardless* of QB. If the guy we are trotting out there is injured and hobbled in his greatest asset, though, all bets are off.

Even when Martinez wasn't out there and Cody was in the game, the offense still should have been able to run the ball effectively and execute well. They didn't with an injured Martinez or healthy Green.

In the last home game against Colorado we had to use two gimmick-type plays with Burkhead at quarterback in order to get touchdowns. And then when you look at the A&M and Washington games to finish the season, the fact that we could only muster one touchdown with an injured Martinez says a lot. The fact that we had to use the wildcat to score points (even though we have mobile quarterbacks) frightens me.

Furthermore, Martinez operating within the system can still mask problems. If your entire offense is based around the zone-read and you have a player run it almost to perfection, then good for you. But when your player gets hurt, he can no longer run that play to perfection and your offense begins to fail, that says to me that the player himself masked issues. He operated within the system and succeeded, yes. But when he got hurt and could no longer operate the system, what happened? It failed. You could look at this two ways, but from my perspective a healthy Martinez hid that this offense couldn't do anything that well.

An unhealthy Martinez proved as much.

That said, I have no problem with tailoring an offense to fit a player's skills. For example, do you think anybody on the Texas roster could have run the Texas offense the way Vince Young did? No way in hell. That offense was suited to help him succeed, and he did with relatively few issues. If you asked somebody to run VY's system to a T, they couldn't do it like him.

Similarly, nobody could run the offense like Martinez did. But instead of having a way to work around an unhealthy Martinez, we simply didn't have a way to do it. Martinez being unhealthy proved that this offense wasn't prepared to deal with something that didn't include Martinez' blinding speed week in and week out. I'm not saying we should be able to plug and chug quarterbacks, because that's entirely unreasonable. But we should have a system that can be tailored to fit a quarterback, not a quarterback that is tailored to fit the system. Because if the quarterback-tailored-to-system...system...fails, how do you fix the resulting problems?

 

[walksalone]

Because an offense should play well regardless of whether a passing QB has an injured throwing arm, or whether a running QB has injured wheels? I don't know about that.

An offense should play better than 6 points against A&M and 7 against Washington, regardless of the quarterback. That's just my philosophy and my opinion on the matter, of course. An injured Martinez shouldn't have resulted in those poor of offensive outputs against average defenses.

I think it's a well accepted fact that Martinez just masked clear problems with the offense, but maybe I'm off base with that.

There were decision making problems from OC down to the QB.

 

[Enhance]

Because an offense should play well regardless of whether a passing QB has an injured throwing arm, or whether a running QB has injured wheels? I don't know about that.

An offense should play better than 6 points against A&M and 7 against Washington, regardless of the quarterback. That's just my philosophy and my opinion on the matter, of course. An injured Martinez shouldn't have resulted in those poor of offensive outputs against average defenses.

I think it's a well accepted fact that Martinez just masked clear problems with the offense, but maybe I'm off base with that.

There were decision making problems from OC down to the QB.

Agreed.