College Football Hall of Fame - 2012 class... No Frazier

[kchusker_chris]

Tommy played in the Big8, Tim played in the SEC during one of these most dominant periods of that league. The undefeated thing doesn't mean as much to me. Not saying those teams couldn't have gone undefeated in the SEC...but you have to agree it was much easier to do w/ our mid 90's schedule than with Tebow's.

 

[knapplc]

The 1995 team beat four teams that finished in the top ten. I don't know how much more dominant the SEC is than that.

I will give the SEC all due respect in the last 10 years. But those 90s teams would have played with anyone in the SEC.

 

[austinhusker]

Ahh my mistake, I misread something on the interwebzz a while back about Tommie being the only mvp of that game. Stupid on my part. Still doesn't take away from him winning 3 consecutive NC mvp's though...who else can say they accomplished that?? Not Timmy...

 

[Mierin]

but you have to agree it was much easier to do w/ our mid 90's schedule than with Tebow's.

No, you don't. What knapp said.

 

[The Dude]

I'll take the rings Tommie helped us get over Tebow's wildly padded stats any day.

 

[tschu]

Tim Tebow pretty clearly had a better career than Tommie and I don't think it is even remotely close.

 

[knapplc]

Tim Tebow pretty clearly had a better career than Tommie and I don't think it is even remotely close.

He was ESPN's darling for three years, that's for sure. Other than that, "better career" is Frazier's. And that's not even close. Better winning percentage, tougher overall competition, more championships, more undefeated seasons, etc. Tebow was good, no doubt about that. But Frazier was better. Easily.

 

[RedRedJarvisRedwine]

Yeah... Who wins a heisman on a team that loses 4 games!!! Joke

 

[fro daddy]

The 1993 Orange Bowl MVPs were Tommie Frazier and Charlie Ward (FSU)

The 1994 Orange Bowl MVPs were Tommie Frazier and Chris T. Jones (Miami)

The 1995 Fiesta Bowl had two MVPs - both from Nebraska (Frazier and Michael Booker).

I don't see the relevance of this. Frazier was named MVP of three straight National Championship games. How is that now in dispute?

That also doesn't address the hue and cry raised by national media types yesterday when Frazier was omitted from the Hall.

Well quite simply, they choose an MVP from each team, regardless of who won. So in the simpliest of terms if they choose MVP's the way they do now (O & D and winning team) it is not even POSSIBLE for someone to loss the championship game and get MVP like TF did. How many losers get MVP today Knapp?? You cant compare that to todays games. They are not giving MVP to losing teams. Back in the day they had to award a MVP on each team. IF you dont see how that is a skewed arguement against players in today game then I dont know what to tell you.

And I already addressed the media. And again I never said he didnt deserve anything. Good god sometimes husker fans are sooooo sensitive. people are aguing with me on stuff that I never freaking said. All i did was point out a homer comment that was totally off base. thats all....

And again if the ONLY main arguement people have is that it was a good team that won all of their games then I guess we should crown every player on that team as a HOF. OR every player on ANY team that was really good regardless of how impressive or unimpressive their numbers were.

And as far as schedules go, kc has a point. Playing in the modern SEC in much tougher than the 1990's big 12. Infact since florida won in 2006 and SEC team has won every year. The big 12 ( mostly big8) was pretty bad during the mid 1990's.

We all know that NE went undefeated in 1994 & 1995. In 1994 they played 5 teams that had winning records. Of those only 3 were better than 1 game above .500. There opps combined record was 78-71-3. IN 95 they played 6 winning teams, 4 were better than 1 game above .500. Like Knapp said they beat 4 top 10 teams. Combined record was 75-62-2. Althought that 1995 team was very very good, so it may not have mattered who they played.

In comparison, FL in the SEC in 06 & 08 lost 1 game each those years. In 2006 they played 9 teams that had winning records. Of those 8 were better than 1 game above .500. Opps combined record was 99-68. In 2008 they played 10 teams with winning records. Of those 6 were better than 1 game above .500. Opps record was 109-73. They also beat 4 top 10 teams this year. Including the #3, #1 & #1 teams.

NE

1994 - 13-0 - played 5 winning teams, 3 more than 1 game above .500, opps win % of .523

1995 - 12-0 - played 6 winning teams, 4 more than 1 game above .500, opps win % of .547

FL

2006 - 13-1 - played 9 winning teams, 8 more than 1 game above .500, opps win % of .593

2008 - 13-1 - played 10 winning teams, 6 more than 1 game above .500, opps win % of .599

 

[tschu]

Tim Tebow pretty clearly had a better career than Tommie and I don't think it is even remotely close.

He was ESPN's darling for three years, that's for sure. Other than that, "better career" is Frazier's. And that's not even close. Better winning percentage, tougher overall competition, more championships, more undefeated seasons, etc. Tebow was good, no doubt about that. But Frazier was better. Easily.

Sorry, think you're being biased on this one. Way off base. Read what fro daddy just posted.

 

[knapplc]

The 1993 Orange Bowl MVPs were Tommie Frazier and Charlie Ward (FSU)

The 1994 Orange Bowl MVPs were Tommie Frazier and Chris T. Jones (Miami)

The 1995 Fiesta Bowl had two MVPs - both from Nebraska (Frazier and Michael Booker).

I don't see the relevance of this. Frazier was named MVP of three straight National Championship games. How is that now in dispute?

That also doesn't address the hue and cry raised by national media types yesterday when Frazier was omitted from the Hall.

Well quite simply, they choose an MVP from each team, regardless of who won. So in the simpliest of terms if they choose MVP's the way they do now (O & D and winning team) it is not even POSSIBLE for someone to loss the championship game and get MVP like TF did. How many losers get MVP today Knapp?? You cant compare that to todays games. They are not giving MVP to losing teams. Back in the day they had to award a MVP on each team. IF you dont see how that is a skewed arguement against players in today game then I dont know what to tell you.

And I already addressed the media. And again I never said he didnt deserve anything. Good god sometimes husker fans are sooooo sensitive. people are aguing with me on stuff that I never freaking said. All i did was point out a homer comment that was totally off base. thats all....

Where did I say you said he didn't deserve anything? If we're talking about "sensitive Husker fans," can we pull up a seat for the sensitive Tiger fans as well? I think you're the pot or the kettle there. Take your pick.

Colin Kaepernick was named MVP of the 2008 Humanitarian Bowl. Nevada lost the game.

 

[knapplc]

Tim Tebow pretty clearly had a better career than Tommie and I don't think it is even remotely close.

He was ESPN's darling for three years, that's for sure. Other than that, "better career" is Frazier's. And that's not even close. Better winning percentage, tougher overall competition, more championships, more undefeated seasons, etc. Tebow was good, no doubt about that. But Frazier was better. Easily.

Sorry, think you're being biased on this one. Way off base. Read what fro daddy just posted.

I accept your apology. Don't listen to me, then. Listen to the national media saying it's a shame.

 

[kchusker_chris]

None of us are saying Tommie isn't deserving. I think it's complete crap he's not in there yet. I'd think it's complete crap if Tebow didn't get in early too though. I can understand why some people think Tebow had a better career that Tommy (I personally don't, but I see the argument and certainly feel it could go either way).

The argument behind Tebow is, that if you take him out of the game...Florida loses 4-6 games a season. You take Tommy out of the game (which he was frequently) - and Nebraska still rolls to an undefeated season. I often wonder what kind of QB Martinez would be on those teams. My guess is pretty damn dominant. Tebow had great players around him as well - but nothing like those 94' 95' teams IMO.

 

[fro daddy]

Yeah... Who wins a heisman on a team that loses 4 games!!! Joke

I thought the Heisman went to the most outstanding player?!?! I had no idea that you had to be on a team that losses a max of 1 or 2 games!! HECK!! All these years I just foolishly went through life not knowing that it wasn't an most outstanding player award..... :facepalm:

Maybe its just that you hate that ESPN is on his jock....or that he is ubber religious....or that he is a bit of a tool...i really dont know.

I want to have some fun. Play along...

Player A - 1510 yrds passing, 55.6% completion, 7 TD's, 10 Ints, 1115 rushing, 18 TD's.

Player B - 3286 yrds passing, 66.9% completion, 32 TD's, 6 Ints, 895 rushing, 23 TD's

Player C - 4306 yrds passing, 68.2% completion, 33 TD's, 11 Ints, 253 rushing, 4 TD's

Two won the Heismen. Two are from teams that lost 2 games. One is your favorite player. Who is the lesser player statistically??

or even more fun

Player A - 1510 yrds passing, 55.6% completion, 7 TD's, 10 Ints, 1115 rushing, 18 TD's

Player B - 2304 yrds passing, 59.4% completion, 13 TD's, 9 Ints, 1301 rushing, 16 TD's

Two players, 2 senior seasons. One is thought of as one of the greatest ever and the other was just a good college player.

 

[zoogs]

Is this one of those times when the uninformed national media is right about one our guys?

I'd have to say that if such a rule doesn't exist, it is a shame he hasn't gotten in yet. But he clearly will. So I dunno. I'm not too bothered by that.