Knoxville Husker

I believe the quote was TM was "the least of our problems."

I'd like to ask the coach why that blueprint still works 10 months later.

I guess they just burned the film?

I understand that it's easier to blame the QB for everything. It's easier to pretend that when he graduates or gets demoted, everything will be better. But I have news for you... Martinez did not play well, but he isn't the biggest problem.

I agree with what I think is Accountability's point.......Armstrong and/or Kellogg are keeping the chains moving. That's not happening as we need it with Martinez in there. Why is that? I don't really know. I know when we've needed to put some points on the board, it hasn't happened with a Martinez led offense.

The evidence here is the time of possession, 35:37 in favor of MN. This is exhibit 1 of why I am an Armstrong fan. He can lead us on sustained drives that chew clock, get us points, and keep our defense off the field. From the time we line up to the time we get into the red zone or goal line there is a confidence that is palpable exuding from TA onto the rest of the offense. It even appeared to be giving the defense more swagger.

When I check the box score to decide whether to watch the NW game (before you roast me I'll be out of town all the entire following week), it will be real interesting to see who trots out there next week to lead the team.

There are a lot of factors in this loss. We don't know how any other QB would do, but they aren't responsible for giving up 34 points to an immobile QB who was running.

It was shocking to see what appeared to be a very slow QB and RB making our defense look even slower. Something was not right on either side of the ball.

I'll never understand the logic that we would rather miss the CCG entirely than watch us get beaten down. I'd rather win enough to get there and take our chances. If we're beaten down, we're beaten down. It is a very powerful Ohio State team, after all.

 

You'll never be the best if you don't play the best. You'll certainly never be the best if you shy away from doing so.

Let's say hypothetically that OSU beat us 63-14 like they just beat Penn State. Unfortunately that is not a far fetched scenario.

Would you rather be say 9-3 and add on that loss, or perhaps 9-3 and lose out on a division tiebreaker where Michigan received such a beat down in our place?

That is the logic, we may then end up in a better bowl than Michigan even.

While I approach every game with the mindset that it is winnable, the reality is were not very good right now and unlikely to improve enough to be competitive against OSU.

@dirkchatelain

Vincent Valentine hadn't practiced as well as Curry/Randle. That's why he barely played.

 

Yikes, that's interesting. When did VV stop being the best player on our DL? I'm only asking because I thought that's what he was and it wasn't even close. That has to be the most confusing non-injury scratch I've seen in a long time.

VV ran down a RB all the way on the sideline last game, very impressive for a 330 pound DL! I guess we can just chalk this up as yet another baffling personnel decision by the coaching staff.

No sense dwelling on this loss. One thing appears certain, we are in no way shape or form ready to square off against OSU! Just look at what they are doing to PSU, up 42-7 at half.

Hopefully we can get our personnel issues worked out, and if this loss costs us a game against OSU that's probably a positive in the final analysis.

Man people must have been substantially more impressed than I with Armstrong's 6 of 18 for 43 yards and 3 interceptions against Purdue.

 

This isn't mean to knock Armstrong, he's a young kid that will get better. But let's not pretend like he's Tommie Frazier or even Joe Ganz at this point.

 

Yeah, that was a really bad day for him. However, when he missed, he often missed deep, often on early downs and a number of times on almost plays that at least had the effect of keeping the defense honest. I think that opened up the rest of the offense as a result, and not to mention, we had the ground game to lean on while he was there. He runs the option quite adroitly. And we also had RK3's presence to lean on, changing in and out.

 

That's not Frazier and it's not Ganz, but it is a methodical, promising attack, and it does seem like our best bet this year.

Let's not forget the 2-3 BAD drops for about 100 yards and a sure touchdown. TA's day looks a lot better without those.

TA was the better overall QB in first two game of the rotation (though it was close), while RKIII obviously played better against Purdue.

Yes we are fools to think that teams would not attack us the same way. However, what I saw a lot of was straight up hand offs for eight yards a crack. Mainly this was due to us not being to get off their blocks, and of course we hardly ever get in the backfield due to our contain scheme or whatever the reason.

What I do know is giving 8 yards per carry on straight up the middle hand offs will almost always get you beat!

If this is true, I think we totally blew it by playing Taylor, but I also don't think the coaches are stupid. Unless Taylor's health situation changes dramatically, I'd have to think that this mistake won't be repeated again. I'd like to see an announcement made early on that we're going with Tommy and Ron and preparing with those two for the next game right away.

They may not be stupid, but they are very stubborn.

Zoogs if far more optimistic than I, we've just seen this movie so many times before the last 4 years. Now we've hit rock bottom over it.

I won't comment on being stubborn or stupid, other than to say judge for yourself after a guy with two broken toes and a shoulder problem played every snap at QB.

No doubt the D sucked big time, but I think we outscore Minny with either TA or RK.

I am nominating this for post of the day. Incredibly succinct and I think it captured how about 99% of us feel!

I would say more like two turnovers. That interception was with less than a minute and we had already lost

That interception really summarized the whole day though on one play.

Sadly, I think regardless of the results of remaining games, today showed that Bo as much as he wants to win, doesn't know how to coach the team to win. His loyalties is admirable but has also cost him his HC job in my opinion.

I'm only responding to this part of your original post because I think the rest is pretty old news by now and really goes without saying.

The part I quoted is the most perplexing part of it all. I think the answer is simply just poor personnel decisions, which of course just goes back to coaching and we are stuck in a circular loop.

Sadly there seems to be only one way this can end.

It makes you wonder sometimes (at least me), if Watson could have played the QB he wanted and not Taylor, would Watson still be OC?

Fair question to me, with RKIII looking as good as he has this year. There is no reason we should favor any one Husker over another when it comes to putting the best player on the field.

Do you have some way of actually knowing Watson wanted to play a different QB? Really the move to a mobile QB is something I liked, but the caveat is a very effective mobile QB. Osborne went to the option long ago because of the cold weather games making it more difficult to win in November without a very strong run game.

As far as folks thinking the option doesn't work, go look at Air Force, G Tech, or the ultra modern version Oregon runs. It works, it's all about execution and the right personnel!

Taylor had 4 runs for 43 yards, and 4 sacks for -27. Although one of those sacks was on a designed QB draw, so it should count as a run. I don't know why sacks are counted as carries, that does nothing but make it confusing for everyone.

 

I agree, when we got down one touchdown, I think we had three straight pass plays and went 3-and-out. Whether that's audible or by design it seems like a poor call. When we were down two scores we mounted that very successful TD drive with a heavy dose of Ameer, and that's really what we should have built off of all day.

The problem is more with the 4 runs for 43 yards than the sacks actually. The reason I say that is I believe one run was for about 35 yards. That leaves 3 carries for 8 yards. Otherwise we have one nice pass play to Bell and that one long run. That's really no consistent run threat at QB and 2 plays the entire today from the position. You just can't win that way, an effective running QB will essentially help "grind out" yardage and help keep drives moving. We did not have that today.

Minnesota actually had the blueprint for how we should have played, and I think Armstrong is the guy for that gameplan. I doubt we could have beaten them running the ball more and as much as they did, but we'll never know. I guess it doesn't matter who the QB is if they just hand off all day.

 

Initially, the praise of Dobson was high. But I have not heard hardly any praise for Dobson in recent years.

 

The one thing I have consistenly heard about Dobson is that he can be very rigid in training. Dobson is very 'old school' in training, and isn't one of those guys who is innovative or stays completely modern in what he wants the athletes doing.

 

But after getting physically whipped this year, especially defensively. And then seeing numerous true freshman (i.e., Taylor, Gerry, Collins, Carter) come in this summer and be physically in better shape than ALOT of our current players should worry folks.

 

Either one is to believe we recruited alot of 'freak' athletes in a single recruiting class, or we are simply not getting it done in the weight room like we should.

It appears the player development could be better lately, especially on the defensive side of the ball the last few years.

Kenny Bell ‏@AFRO_THUNDER80 18m

I appreciate those who r positive and supportive. It's very difficult to decipher real fans on days like these

 

Kenny .. c'mon man.

I thought tweeting by players was not allowed in season?

If we hire Frost, who do we get as OC and DC? Somebody with more or less experience than Frost has? If they are MORE experienced, how does that affect the HC/Asst dynamic? If they're less experienced, then we're starting over from scratch. I'm all for getting Frost, but not yet. Theres a big difference between being a HC and being a top notch Coordinator. I think Bo has proven that.

Not sure Frost would lateral over but at some point we need to stop doubting whether he's a good coach. If we can't get anyone with a proven track record as a head coach (which is quite possible) he may be as good a choice as any of coordinators due for promotion and as a leader of men.

For the record I didn't even want to be having this conversation about BP, though I much preferred Gill as the HC choice at the time. In an ideal world, I thought GIll as HC and running the offense, with BP as DC would have been the best situation. Unfortunately Callahan fired BP which possibly cost him is own job (ironically). Could you imagine to this day us with a BC/BP coaching paring? Just crazy enough it may have worked.

I get that some people have a bug up their ass about Martinez, but these arguments are baseless. Just say you don't like the guy and be done with it.

I have nothing against TM but have hated his game since 2011. He's awful and was ineffective yet again today. You can't win with such poor QB play. I am pretty sure we have two other guys that could have played equally bad, and perhaps a little better. One of them is a 5th year senior, the other has 3 year's eligibility left. Those are the points you seem to be missing.

Most people aren't capable of being a CEO. BP and TM clearly are two such people.

Even Lou Hotlz said NE looked better with Amstrong! We simply quit!

 

Lou Holtz isn't any kind of authority I'd be quoting to make my point.

 

And if you think the defense would have played better if Tommy Armstrong was out there, you need to double-check which side of the ball he plays on.

Really???? You can't be serious can you? Did you not watch the last three games? The whole team was upbeat and having fun. The Offense was making plays and giving the D time to rest and adjust. And in making these plays on Offense also gets the D pumped up.

And Martinez was hanging receivers out. How many times did we get hit hard because of throwing in coverage or a pass thrown behind or short. These guys know who the best option is for this team to win and its not TM. It's simple, watch how they play.

TM is a microcosm for BP. I believe TM was sent to us to help BP lose his job. BP says in the the postgame conference TM was not the problem. Wow he's confused. This is not old school smash mouth football where we are going to win games 21-7. The game has changed. If you don't have a confident and effective leader at QB, all is lost.

Fate may be on our side here. Once we went up 10-0, Bo got confused and scrapped his alleged plan to play more than one QB, if that was ever true. He thought that TM was playing well enough, and since the D was letting down he could not see past that.

Good for Bo, please take that act somewhere else it's time.

It's the same old stuff, starts with Bo whose simply not fit to be a head coach and was a poor selection. That manifests in playing an ineffective running QB who can only rush for 5 total yards while being unable to complete anything downfield. Meanwhile the rookie QB for MN, who looked pretty slow to me, runs for 55 yards, passes for 152 and accounts for 3 TDs.

Yes the defense had a bad day, but they were hung out to dry by our grand total of 328 yards on offense and paltry 139 yards passing. We are placed in the position of Abdullah having to single handedly win the game on offense. Guess we found out how that would work yet again, eerily similar to the UCLA meltdown but longer and more drawn out after the 10-0 lead.

Fortunately I'll be traveling during next week's game and probably at a soccer tournament the following. Normally I would DVR the games and stay away from scores until I could watch it, Now the smarter approach is check the score and decide whether to watch the game at all. Hopefully BP will stick exclusively with Martinez, if that's what it takes to get rid of Bo it would be worth it but not likely to be worth watching.

I've been counting the days until a new QB since TM sophomore season. I skipped going to our minor Florida bowl that year just because he was our QB and that destroyed my enthusiasm. It was pretty obvious we needed a little some extra today that TM was not capable to give. What a coincidence that this was by far our worst game since UCLA.

I was not excited about the BP hire from day 1. I would have been ten times happier with Gill, but Osborne didn't want him. Maybe Gill wasn't the guy either, but I guess we'll never know that.

Can we please not talk about the NC? We havent won a conference title since 99' - that should be our focus. I know it was hypothetical in some sorts, but cmon people.

 

Right now the team to beat for sure is Mich St - they don't play Osu or Wiscy, like we don't. Mich and Nw for sure will have 3 losses at seasons end in the conference.

Can we please not talk about Michigan St?!?! We have to beat Minnesota one game at a time!

(actually by my math if Bama wins the other top SEC teams have to have at least two losses, 12-1 NU to the BCS title game baby!)

Enunwa dropped 3 passes straight up. One was a diving attempt for a TD. I'll give him a break here, but it's still a catch he makes more times than not. Then, he also dropped that real pretty ball right over his shoulder on that sick scramble by TA. Then the 3rd one was on a slant, hit him right in the hands, though it was behind him, and was intercepted. One less pick, 2 touchdowns, and a 58-7 instead of a 44-7 win, and the perception and outlook is way completely different on this game and the near future, all based on 3 drops.

Are we playing the what-if game? It is my favorite!

 

What if Tommy Armstrong throws a ball into quadruple coverage, and instead of Kenny Bell making a stupid no-look one-handed catch for a 40-yard touchdown, it is intercepted like it easily would have been?

 

Even with your hypotheticals, TA would have had have only had a 50% completion rate and two horrendous interceptions against Purdue, the 83rd best passing defense in FBS.

We don't know whether the WRs even ran the correct routes on some of those bad miss throws. Like I said, I think Tommy was a bit too confident (e.g. arrogant) on a couple of the throws due to such weak coverage the prior two games. Lack of experience is all.

As far as one handed catches, i don't see what is so hard. While I may have been a bit too slow and small in my playing days, one thing that came easy to me was catching anything that came my way. Honestly any WR prone to bad drops just baffles me, and I think we should see more "spectacular" one-handed grabs than we do, given the athletic ability WRs have these days. Plus you can't even tattoo a guy anymore as punishment for going up high over the middle.