NUance
Assistant Coach
I agree with all the bolded although only looking at stats can be misleading (which I suspect you'd agree with). Stats or no, Ron Kellogg was a better passer than Martinez. And Sam Keller was better than them both.
Greatest QB
- Thread starter BigRedPowerWagon
- Start date
HUSKER FREAK
Starter
WTH. Tommy may not be the best QB we have ever had YET, But acting like he sucks is ridiculous. I have zero problem with most of his play, but I wish we could put a microphone in his helmet to tell him he needs to hit Bell across the middle. The last game wasn't the only time he missed him while trying to force it to Westy. After that one play I came away thinking man do they have a problem with each other or what is going on. I have also seen some eye rolls from Bell after Tommy talks to him also after a bad play. Not sure what the deal is here.
Husker no ka oi
Starter
Vince, then again some of you where not even a twinkle in daddy's eye when he played.
kchusker_chris
All-American
There is absolutely something lacking between the WRs and the routes they run, and TA. Didn't we hear at the beginning of the year that one of the changes Beck was implementing was giving the receivers more freedom to change their routes to get open? That requires them to be on the same page, all the time. That's obviously not happening - and it's not limited to KB, Westy has been off with TA, Moore, Turner, etc. If you watch all of his INTs, almost every one of them was a good throw the a spot he thought they were going to be and they weren't. Plenty of that is on TA, but something is going on. It's not like he's throwing into triple coverage 6 times a game, or shot putting a long pass that gets picked (martinez). It's a good throw to a spot he thought someone was supposed to be.
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Number12
Three-Star Recruit
Agreed kchusker_chris. I actually think Tommy is gonna end up being a really good one for us, but there is absolutely some kind of miscommunication that is plaguing our passing game. He throws a great looking ball, and unlike Taylor (who I liked as well) Tommy actually "looks" like a QB. I feel like there's a chance something will just click with him at some point and he'll become a very good QB.
zoogs
Assistant Coach
^Tommy can throw a great ball but he's got inconsistencies that have to be addressed.
Bo has to work the phones and line up the best full-time offensive staff assistant who can work with QBs that he can find. Really, until we get some veteran and quality coaching here, most every QB prospect who walks through the door is going to show up with all sorts of correctable issues on gameday that don't get corrected.
And that's going to be really frustrating. Guys who look the part, appear to have what it takes, but don't manage to put it all together. Molding talent into an elite or even just good quarterback isn't easy.
Bo has to work the phones and line up the best full-time offensive staff assistant who can work with QBs that he can find. Really, until we get some veteran and quality coaching here, most every QB prospect who walks through the door is going to show up with all sorts of correctable issues on gameday that don't get corrected.
And that's going to be really frustrating. Guys who look the part, appear to have what it takes, but don't manage to put it all together. Molding talent into an elite or even just good quarterback isn't easy.
BigRedBuster
International Man of Mystery
Thankyou...I agree with both of you.
Tommy is not a bad QB. There needs to be something worked out with the WRs on knowing where everyone is going to be.
Heck, I have seen the best hall of fame QBS in history throwing into blank space and then having conversations with WRs in the huddle showing they weren't on the same page. It happens. It needs to be reduced as much as possible. But....it happens.
kchusker_chris
All-American
If he was on the same page with his WRs he'd be sitting at 15/4 instead of 13/8. There's plenty he needs to work on, but getting w/ his WRs is the #1 need IMO. He throws a bullet sometimes when there should be a little touch, but at least it's not a wounded duck thrown up as a free-for-all. That's a huge improvement right there. He misses an open receiver, or underthrows a cross route. But it's not absolutely alarming to me. For some reason I think he's pretty close to pulling it together. He had some great throws against Rutgers where he thread a needle on a cross to Moore I think, and the tight end in the end zone was a perfect throw - westy on a slant He doesn't make those in the first couple games of the season. I think he's a lot closer than some think. They look at a couple instances where there was a complete breakdown in communication that led to the INT, and forget about all the other things that are so much farther along than we're used to. Just the fact that it usually takes a complete breakdown in order for him to throw an INT is moving forward to me. That's fixable, there's something that's just off there. It's not mechanics IMO, it's not bad reads, or trying to do too much. It seems fixable - which with Martinez I didn't think it ever was.
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zoogs
Assistant Coach
Footwork is mechanics. Inconsistency in the little things add up and produce bad results. I can't share your optimism right now because I just don't think the coaching is there. He's not an absolute project where you look at his abilities and think, "How is any coach going to radically transform him into a passer". That's not what we're talking about here, but without really good coaching, how will he or anybody else mature to their full potential?
Diagnosing the fix is only the small first step in the process.
Diagnosing the fix is only the small first step in the process.
kchusker_chris
All-American
I have no idea why I'm optimistic - but for some reason I think TA will click soon. I can't argue w/ the lack of coaching though - you know full well where I stand on that. I think Tommy could be great w/ the right coaching, right offense, etc. As it is, I think he can still be pretty dang good though. I thought Martinez could have been a lot better too. He had 4 years, and he wasn't much better in his last than he was the first half of his first. There was no "transformation" - just a slight jump each season that reverted back to old ways as much as it didn't. At the end of the day this is what we've got though, so I'm not going to harp on the kid and act like he's Joe Dailey running around out there. He's close. I think that about most of this team though. The talent appears to be there. Not as deep as it needs to be, there are still huge gaps between a few position groups, but with the right coaching the #1s could be good enough to play anyone in the nation close.
(so with all that said,we just lack depth and coaching - no big deal right
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HUSKER FREAK
Starter
I like Tommy have no reason to think he is hurting this team right now. I know we're 8-1 but some of the problems and sloppy play will result in losses. But, I want to think that we play to our opponents level (it helps me feel better). The receivers and Tommy definitely aren't because he cant throw a good ball and who ever thinks it is doesn't watch very closely. They have to use this bye week to figure it out though.I have no idea why I'm optimistic - but for some reason I think TA will click soon. I can't argue w/ the lack of coaching though - you know full well where I stand on that. I think Tommy could be great w/ the right coaching, right offense, etc. As it is, I think he can still be pretty dang good though. I thought Martinez could have been a lot better too. He had 4 years, and he wasn't much better in his last than he was the first half of his first. There was no "transformation" - just a slight jump each season that reverted back to old ways as much as it didn't. At the end of the day this is what we've got though, so I'm not going to harp on the kid and act like he's Joe Dailey running around out there. He's close. I think that about most of this team though. The talent appears to be there. Not as deep as it needs to be, there are still huge gaps between a few position groups, but with the right coaching the #1s could be good enough to play anyone in the nation close.
(so with all that said,we just lack depth and coaching - no big deal right)
Guy Chamberlin
Heisman Trophy Winner
I forgot we had a quarterback named McCathorn Clayton and another one named Keithen McCant. I think I ended up combining them in my brain.
And yeah, Gerry Gdowski is overlooked in the pantheon. He needed one more season to enter the great QB conversation.
I saw every quarterback on that list play, so I'm all in on the context thing. Honestly? I didn't cringe when Taylor Martinez dropped back. I don't cringe when Tommy Armstrong drops back. I don't cringe when we hand the ball off to a running back, even though they might fumble or get dropped for a loss or no gain.
Bad things can happen on any play. Good things, too. No more so with runs than passes. So I tend to wait till the play is over before cringing or cheering.
I did cringe during Jammal Lord's two seasons. That was the toughest offense I ever had to watch.
And yeah, Gerry Gdowski is overlooked in the pantheon. He needed one more season to enter the great QB conversation.
I saw every quarterback on that list play, so I'm all in on the context thing. Honestly? I didn't cringe when Taylor Martinez dropped back. I don't cringe when Tommy Armstrong drops back. I don't cringe when we hand the ball off to a running back, even though they might fumble or get dropped for a loss or no gain.
Bad things can happen on any play. Good things, too. No more so with runs than passes. So I tend to wait till the play is over before cringing or cheering.
I did cringe during Jammal Lord's two seasons. That was the toughest offense I ever had to watch.
BigRedPowerWagon
Banned
Without going into huge history, i watched nebraska since 1985. But i was 5 and didnt get a huge grasp around the game. Grew up during the great years but never really understanding what i was watching. Watched the NC games and then i was 19 so i just did what 19 year olds did and kinda fell off of football. After settling down i started really watching football. Watching and studying it. That was in 2007 and if you look at the month i joined as well. So didnt think it was necessary but i spelled it out there for all of you. And im not throwing tommy under the bus, i just cant honestly remember ever not cringing when a nebraska qb threw the ball.
