Martinez and the NFL

[Enhance]

That's a good list!


Personally, I'd rather have Wilson over Romo, Eli and Matt Ryan.

And this is more than just numbers, stats, and whatever. It's just the way each of those guys "feel". I'm not feeling it with Romo. He's lost a lot of big games, by no fault of his, but he just hasn't done it. Eli has two rings, but he's seemed inconsistent recently. Too inconsistent. Has Ryan won a playoff game?

Flacco I'm on the fence, but he gets pretty hot during the playoffs. I know Wilson obviously does too, but honestly, it's a toss up.

The other guys, I can get down with taking before Wilson.

You raise good points. I mean, honestly, there are a lot of NFL teams that would take Russell Wilson, and some would be better off than what they have now. I'm a Vikings fan, and even though I'm hoping Teddy Bridgewater develops well, I'd love to have Russell Wilson on my team. Russell Wilson to me is the guy that brings great intangibles to the table and make big plays when you need them. But if someone is telling me 'hey, start building your NFL roster and pick a QB first,' I don't know that Wilson is the guy I look to.

I'm with you though in that I can definitely see arguments for having him above guys like Romo and Ryan. Ryan I think has one playoff victory to his name but that's it. I guess the big thing for me is seeing what Wilson does over the rest of his career. He's had an unreal defense and one of the best RB's in the league, but he was also a bit spotty in the playoffs - he had a good game against Carolina, but then only completed just more than 50% of his passes against Packers/Patriots, throwing five picks and three TD's. So, we'll see. I definitely like him but I think he needs more pieces around him to be successful than other guys.

 

[skersfan]

A lot on that list will be gone very soon.

I seem to remember this same conversation when there was a slight chance that Russel could have looked at Nebraska. Most felt he was of no value, we had far better, had no need for his services at all. Am I wrong on that. But it seems that was forum take.

Amazing how in the last 5 years things have changed.

I am one of Taylor's biggest fans, but he was not a D1 college QB. He was a freakishly fast athlete playing the position, giving us everything he had. But I would have preferred to have RW on our team his last year in college. I think Taylor would have learned a lot from him.

I would have taken Russel Wilson in a heart beat. He was a QB with talent, and the ability to win.

And if I remember correctly he has something that most on that list do not have, a Super Bowl ring.

Luck is growing, but a lot of the rest are done and will never sniff a ring.

That is how NFL QB's are judged.

 

[Decked]

A lot on that list will be gone very soon.

I seem to remember this same conversation when there was a slight chance that Russel could have looked at Nebraska. Most felt he was of no value, we had far better, had no need for his services at all. Am I wrong on that. But it seems that was forum take.

Amazing how in the last 5 years things have changed.

I am one of Taylor's biggest fans, but he was not a D1 college QB. He was a freakishly fast athlete playing the position, giving us everything he had. But I would have preferred to have RW on our team his last year in college. I think Taylor would have learned a lot from him.

I would have taken Russel Wilson in a heart beat. He was a QB with talent, and the ability to win.

And if I remember correctly he has something that most on that list do not have, a Super Bowl ring.

Luck is growing, but a lot of the rest are done and will never sniff a ring.

That is how NFL QB's are judged.

If Taylor isn't a D1 QB, then Armstrong isn't even a high school starter.

 

[lo country]

You know what makes Wilson win. Two simple things:

Scheme

Coaching

Martinez had neither and did well at the college level.

Riley brings scheme and coaching to the table. IMO, QB will improve dramatically.

 

[papersun87]

I am one of Taylor's biggest fans, but he was not a D1 college QB.

 

[The Dude]

Man, Romo is as good as any QB not named Rodgers right now. Wilson is nowhere near that level. Y'all are nuts. Or just don't watch much football.

Rivers is easily better too.

Wilson has the benefit of an elite defense carrying the team. That's about it. As a QB he's fringe top ten at best.

That being said, being the 10th, 11th, or 12th best QB in the NFL is still pretty damn good.

 

[skersfan]

Was he recruited by a single program to play the position?

I think we only offered as a chance, recruited as an athlete.

Just because I don't feel he was a QB, does not mean he did not play it. He struggled and most on this site were on his back the whole time. But most were stuck to the crotch of our former coach to. Go back read your posts.

He was our QB because we did not have anything better, we did not recruit well.

Have you ever heard me say I thought Armstrong was a good QB? Nothing against the kid, again he is not what most programs would recruit to play QB. And again Tommy currently is the best we have. I am hoping the Coach Riley can develop him, and regret we did not have anyone capable of making Taylor better. Both gave/give us all they have. But very few places that are top 25 programs where either would start.

All for both kids, but neither posses the talent to play at the next level at the QB position, never did.

Taylor might have gotten a chance with the Eagles because of Kelly, but he had to be healthy.

 

[EmeraldIngot]

I've got a funny feeling that Martinez is going to get surgery and physical therapy, get back into football shape, and give it one more shot. When he's healthy, he has too much pure athletic talent to not find some kind of skill position for him. Even if that position is not QB.

Now whether or not anyone is going to sign him is another argument...

 

[Landlord]

Was he recruited by a single program to play the position?

I think we only offered as a chance, recruited as an athlete.

Just because I don't feel he was a QB, does not mean he did not play it.

The coaches of the league decided he was the best quarterback in the conference in 2012. If that isn't a QB, then what is?

I suppose Tommy Frazier, Scott Frost, Eric Crouch and others weren't quarterbacks either.

 

[Enhance]

Man, Romo is as good as any QB not named Rodgers right now. Wilson is nowhere near that level. Y'all are nuts. Or just don't watch much football.

Rivers is easily better too.

Wilson has the benefit of an elite defense carrying the team. That's about it. As a QB he's fringe top ten at best.

That being said, being the 10th, 11th, or 12th best QB in the NFL is still pretty damn good.

I think people knock Romo/Rivers because they haven't been able to QB their teams to Super Bowls, but in terms of pure ability, I agree with you and would love to have them on my team. Wilson isn't in the same conversation yet in my opinion.

 

[jmfb]

Was he recruited by a single program to play the position?

I think we only offered as a chance, recruited as an athlete.

Just because I don't feel he was a QB, does not mean he did not play it.

The coaches of the league decided he was the best quarterback in the conference in 2012. If that isn't a QB, then what is?

I suppose Tommy Frazier, Scott Frost, Eric Crouch and others weren't quarterbacks either.

Frazier, Frost and Crouch's teams won Championships and didnt have the chronic turnover problems & bad losses that haunted TM, even though he wasnt even running the Triple Option

Being a great QB goes beyond who has the biggest arms, fastest feet, who had the biggest heart or who made the occasional freakish play JMO

 

[Landlord]

Was he recruited by a single program to play the position?

I think we only offered as a chance, recruited as an athlete.

Just because I don't feel he was a QB, does not mean he did not play it.

The coaches of the league decided he was the best quarterback in the conference in 2012. If that isn't a QB, then what is?

I suppose Tommy Frazier, Scott Frost, Eric Crouch and others weren't quarterbacks either.

Frazier, Frost and Crouch's teams won Championships and didnt have the chronic turnover problems & bad losses that haunted TM, even though he wasnt even running the Triple Option

Being a great QB goes beyond who has the biggest arms, fastest feet, who had the biggest heart or who made the occasional freakish play JMO

My understanding was that we were talking about being a quarterback period. No mention of great QBs versus good or average ones, skersfan's only submission is that Taylor Martinez in fact isn't and wasn't a quarterback.

 

[Guy Chamberlin]

Still...in most games played during the Martinez era, I didn't feel envious of the opposing team's quarterback.

I wanted our guy to make fewer mistakes. I wanted our defense to stop making marginal quarterbacks look better.

But Taylor Martinez could certainly hang with everyone else playing in Division 1.

Being a great QB goes beyond who has the biggest arms, fastest feet, who had the biggest heart or who made the occasional freakish play JMO

It sure didn't hurt Frazier, Frost and Crouch to have outstanding defenses, along with offensive schemes that allowed them to complete only 50% of their passes without much criticism.

Taylor Martinez had his issues, and they paralleled our growing disenchantment with Bo Pelini, but I'd hate for his multiple career records at the University of Nebraska to be overlooked just because we wanted so much more.

 

[True2tRA]

Still...in most games played during the Martinez era, I didn't feel envious of the opposing team's quarterback.

I wanted our guy to make fewer mistakes. I wanted our defense to stop making marginal quarterbacks look better.

You pretty much said it yourself. We played a lot of marginal quarterbacks.

But Taylor Martinez could certainly hang with everyone else playing in Division 1.

What do you mean "hang with"? Are you saying he was as talented as any other division 1 QB's at the time? Just curious.

It sure didn't hurt Frazier, Frost and Crouch to have outstanding defenses, along with offensive schemes that allowed them to complete only 50% of their passes without much criticism.

I think that's a strange way to put it. No offensive scheme is designed to "allow" a 50% or less completion percentage.

The goal of the offense is to score more points than the opponent and to be able to do so in whichever manner is required, whether that's through the air or on the ground. Tommie Frazier threw the ball 469 times in his career. Taylor threw almost 1000 times. Frazier, Frost or Crouch wasn't criticized as much because the offense was scoring points and winning games without being forced to utilize the passing game as much.

Nebraska didn't stray away from the run game when it wasn't working. Eventually, the run game always gained steam.

Beck used the passing game in a different way much of Martinez's career. Beck would go awy from the run game when it wasn't working. Somtimes even when it was. He seemed to be forcing the passing game instead of using it smartly to supplement drives and maintain balance.

Also, we have to believe the passing game was focused on much more in practice during Taylors time here than it was when Frazier, Frost, and Crouch were here. The option game was our identitiy and it was our goal to perfect the execution of that part of the offene and we did. What did Beck and Martinez perfect? What was the identity?

Taylor Martinez had his issues, and they paralleled our growing disenchantment with Bo Pelini, but I'd hate for his multiple career records at the University of Nebraska to be overlooked just because we wanted so much more.

Let's face the facts. Those records are nice and well-deserved. There are reasons that records are being set all over college football right now though. The other fact is, Taylor would be remembered far more fondly than he is if Nebraska had just pulled off one of those big wins or won a conference championship. Nebraska fell apart at all the wrong times and usually in a spotlight. That only magnified the mistakes but they wern't just Taylors mistakes. As we've all talked about, there were plenty of issues on those teams.

 

[Landlord]

Let's face the facts. Those records are nice and well-deserved. There are reasons that records are being set all over college football right now though. The other fact is, Taylor would be remembered far more fondly than he is if Nebraska had just pulled off one of those big wins or won a conference championship. Nebraska fell apart at all the wrong times and usually in a spotlight. That only magnified the mistakes but they wern't just Taylors mistakes. As we've all talked about, there were plenty of issues on those teams.

Good post. The way I see it, Taylor played in four huge, big games. Two conference championships and two Capital One Bowls. He played very well against Georgia, but what the hell is a quarterback supposed to do when his defense gives up 50+ points? Same with Wisconsin. Oklahoma his end zone interception completely changed the tide of the game and was a really poor decision, but he was also playing on one ankle. South Carolina, well, he didn't play great, didn't play awful, we just stunk.

All in all, he definitely wasn't the reason we lost any of those four. When you look back at other big games during the regular season, the only ones that stand out that he particularly played absolutely awful in are 2011 Wisconsin and Michigan.

He was a 3+ year starter, but he also had more wins over ranked teams than all of our other quarterbacks post Eric Crouch combined.