NFL 2025

Guy Chamberlin said:
The VIkings looked pathetic and the Bears looked confident. Then the fourth quarter started and they totally switched places.

I don't think either team is going to threaten the Packers this year. Hard to tell how Detroit will shake out.
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Annoyingly, I agree (annoyed because I don't like the Packers).

I had the Vikings finishing second in the division this year. I just don't see Detroit overcoming the loss of both Ben Johnson and Aaron Glenn.

I will say, aside from the success of getting a week 1 win, I feel a lot better this morning if I'm a Vikings fan than I do a Bears fan. The Bears did what they continue to do best - poop their big boy pants. JJ McCarthy showed a lot of promise for his first start, on the road, in his home town, and Kevin O'Connell... he's in the handful or so of coaches I'd take if I was a GM and had the pick of the litter.
 
I am NOT for outlawing the tush push. I actually think it's a great football play. If you don't want them to be successful, be better against it.

BUT....the this is totally unacceptable from the NFL refs. It's very similar to a similar play Nebraska ran against Cincinnati on the goal line and didn't get in. Something like 5 Cinci players were in the neutral zone and it wasn't called.

 
If I had no history as an NFL fan and I was asked to appraise it as a business model I'd say it's never gonna work. No workplace should have that many injuries, taking the best members of your workforce off the job when they're needed most.
 
Guy Chamberlin said:
If I had no history as an NFL fan and I was asked to appraise it as a business model I'd say it's never gonna work. No workplace should have that many injuries, taking the best members of your workforce off the job when they're needed most.
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There are always injuries. But the number of QB that are suddenly in danger of missing time is pretty crazy.

And, as far as I can tell, none of them were because of the types of hits that has QBs being treated like they're made of glass over the past few years.
 
Mavric said:
There are always injuries. But the number of QB that are suddenly in danger of missing time is pretty crazy.

And, as far as I can tell, none of them were because of the types of hits that has QBs being treated like they're made of glass over the past few years.
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Well I'm also looking through the lens of the 49ers, where before the season even started we were missing our #1 and #2 WRs, our #2 RB, our #1 Safety, a starting linebacker and offensive lineman, and the three rookie defensive linemen who were slated to start missed virtually all of training camp with injuries. A promising rookie WR was also out with injuries, and the veteran WR they brought in has a three game suspension for a DUI.

First game of the season we lost our All-Pro tight end and starting QB, and in the second game we lost a starting OL and all-purpose fullback. On the upside: we're 2-0.

You're right - many of these injuries aren't from traditional nasty hits. Seems like a lot of them crop up in practice or simply drills. The theory is that there have been tremendous advancements in building bulk and muscle, but the ligaments aren't coming along for the ride.
 
BigRedBuster said:
I am NOT for outlawing the tush push. I actually think it's a great football play. If you don't want them to be successful, be better against it.

BUT....the this is totally unacceptable from the NFL refs. It's very similar to a similar play Nebraska ran against Cincinnati on the goal line and didn't get in. Something like 5 Cinci players were in the neutral zone and it wasn't called.

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I think the problem with the Tush Push is now the Meta around it moreso than the actual play itself. It began as a pretty clever and legal play within the rules, but this KC game put a spotlight on what's actually been happening for a really long time - neutral zone infractions, false starts, offsides, and difficulty for the referees to officiate it cleanly. A small part of the reason the Eagles execute it so well so often is because they break some rules to do it and don't get penalized. These infractions long pre-date what happened against KC this past weekend... I think the KC game just put a bigger spotlight on it.

Overall, I have been against outlawing it... but I think if it can't be officiated cleanly or fairly, and results in widespread, uncalled penalties, then it's time the league acts. Not because the play concept is broken but because the Meta around it has become distorted and unenforceable.
 
Enhance said:
I think the problem with the Tush Push is now the Meta around it moreso than the actual play itself. It began as a pretty clever and legal play within the rules, but this KC game put a spotlight on what's actually been happening for a really long time - neutral zone infractions, false starts, offsides, and difficulty for the referees to officiate it cleanly. A small part of the reason the Eagles execute it so well so often is because they break some rules to do it and don't get penalized. These infractions long pre-date what happened against KC this past weekend... I think the KC game just put a bigger spotlight on it.

Overall, I have been against outlawing it... but I think if it can't be officiated cleanly or fairly, and results in widespread, uncalled penalties, then it's time the league acts. Not because the play concept is broken but because the Meta around it has become distorted and unenforceable.
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The league needs to act by figuring out how to enforce the rules of the game around the play. It should be just as easy to see if players are lined up in the neutral zone on this play as any other play. Same with jumping off sides.

I don't want this because it takes time away from the game. But, if need be, make the play automatically reviewed. So, then the refs can go back and make sure the rules were abided by. A few times the Eagles would be flagged and TDs taken off the board, would prevent them from doing it in the future.
 
Guy Chamberlin said:
You're right - many of these injuries aren't from traditional nasty hits. Seems like a lot of them crop up in practice or simply drills. The theory is that there have been tremendous advancements in building bulk and muscle, but the ligaments aren't coming along for th
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I’m in this camp too.
 
BigRedBuster said:
The league needs to act by figuring out how to enforce the rules of the game around the play. It should be just as easy to see if players are lined up in the neutral zone on this play as any other play. Same with jumping off sides.
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I agree with the part about the neutral zone; I really don't understand why that's an issue in the first place. They've even sent verbal warnings to the Eagles about this in the past back when Jason Kelce was there. It's wild that it has just continued to be a problem.

The other rules though... I get why they're struggling with those. Some of the false starts and offsides are hard to see in the moment because of the nature of the play. It's also really difficult to spot the ball because it's effectively a scrum. So, I don't think they'll want to open the door to making a specific play automatically reviewed for rule infractions. If they feel referees aren't able to effectively officiate the play in the moment (which is where the narrative is trending now) then I think the play is a goner.

I do wonder if there are some things they could consider though outside of straight banning the play entirely e.g. making it so you can only push a teammate forward once they've passed the LOS or something like that. Would make it a bit easier on the defense. But there's still the huge dependency on the referees actually being able to officiate the whole thing correctly, and this would just give them one more thing to have to look for.

I have a sneaking suspicion 2025 will be the Tush Push's final season. I don't love it, and I'm not even an Eagles fan, but I'm not sure I see another route.
 
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