Taylor Martinez Sports Science

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bshirt said:
saunders45 said:
You know what, it's not even worth it. The truth is, haters are gonna hate, not matter what. Who gives a flying sh#t about things like facts and evidence. Personal bias is all that matters. GG Husker nation. Good %$#(#% Job.
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Exactly. Haters gotta hate.

Huskerscott and his blind mob don't give rat's a$$ about facts and evidence. They'll hate Tmart until the sun implodes. Nothing can ever change that.
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I don't understand this attitude, bshirt. I really don't. Why would we, as Husker fans, have a desire to unreasonably criticize our starting QB? You seem to believe that hating Martinez is the goal, and we will use anything to accomplish that end. All the while you seem to never wonder why we would have the goal in the first place . . . unless there are very real and legitimate concerns with his game.

In other words, you seem to believe that we begin with the presumption that Martinez is bad and then point out flaws in his game as a result; have you considered that it is the other way around?

 
Hujan said:
bshirt said:
saunders45 said:
You know what, it's not even worth it. The truth is, haters are gonna hate, not matter what. Who gives a flying sh#t about things like facts and evidence. Personal bias is all that matters. GG Husker nation. Good %$#(#% Job.
Click to expand...
Exactly. Haters gotta hate.

Huskerscott and his blind mob don't give rat's a$$ about facts and evidence. They'll hate Tmart until the sun implodes. Nothing can ever change that.
Click to expand...
I don't understand this attitude, bshirt. I really don't. Why would we, as Husker fans, have a desire to unreasonably criticize our starting QB? You seem to believe that hating Martinez is the goal, and we will use anything to accomplish that end. All the while you seem to never wonder why we would have the goal in the first place . . . unless there are very real and legitimate concerns with his game.

In other words, you seem to believe that we begin with the presumption that Martinez is bad and then point out flaws in his game as a result; have you considered that it is the other way around?
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Hujan, I really have no problem with criticizing Tmart's play last year. With two bad wheels he did indeed blow chunks. No question about that. That's where posters like you come in. We might not agree about how much of the problem was injuries but it gives us something to yak about. No problem. No major one anyway. :lol:

However, the haters take to to a different level by assaulting his character, courage, intelligence (as if guys like V. Young & M. Vick are rocket scientists), commitment, attitude.....heck "anything" they can dream up. They'll even diss Bo due to starting him (favoritism!!! It's just gotta be!!). It never ends and 99% of it is based on the ultra reliable "internet sources". It's just sickening. Every bloody day.

Another area we'll probably never agree on is how good Carnes or any other unproven freshman really is. But again, so what? Posters like you really think Carnes is the total package. No problem really. However, imo the haters back Carnes (or Green, or Spano, or Donald Duck or anybody else) mostly due to him not being Tmart. Now, that's just my opinion but the hater's daily character assassination of Tmart is everywhere on NU cfb forums for all to see and cannot be denied.

I've dissed many NU player's results on the field. But I don't say they're gutless, stupid, have a bad attitude, etc, etc, etc, unless there is overwhelming real factual evidence. That's the difference.

 
Everybody calling for TMart's head is gonna be right back on the bandwagon if he starts off like he did last year. Flavor off the Month

 
I don't have a problem with anybody criticizing T Mart's play last year, because they are very valid criticisms to bring up.

I cannot however accept people using T Mart's criticisms as reasons for why Carnes should start. Because if you think about, many of the reasons people criticize Martinez (the "low football iq", poor pocket presence, etc.) are things Carnes could very well do himself this year when the pressure is on, especially if he gets injured.

Besides people, don't forget. This kid's recruitment came down to Nebraska and Western Kentucky. He could still be great but it's not like he's the next V. Young or Tebow.

 
^ yeah, I don't think Carnes should start this year. It would not be good news. It would be a huge indictment of Taylor and I don't think he is going to struggle that bad as to necessitate this. Carnes starting would just be another wrench in an already challenging year.

But who cares what his recruitment came down to? He was committed to USF and chose to leave. Thought about some probably guaranteed early playing time at a small school before deciding to give it a try in the big time. Taylor's recruitment options? Nowhere, for QB, which is what he really wanted...except for us, and I'm sure even he questioned the kind of "chance" he was going to get here.

 
nhuskers5 said:
Everybody calling for TMart's head is gonna be right back on the bandwagon if he starts off like he did last year. Flavor off the Month
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I'm by no means calling for his head. I want Bo to play the best QB, experienced or not. If Taylor starts, I will save judgement til we play Washington and Wisconsin. If he does well, I might hop on the bandwagon again. Thats just the way sports go, when your team is winning everyone is happy. When they are losing, heads start to role. And its not just here are Nebraska that happens.

 
Po Belini said:
nhuskers5 said:
Everybody calling for TMart's head is gonna be right back on the bandwagon if he starts off like he did last year. Flavor off the Month
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I'm by no means calling for his head. I want Bo to play the best QB, experienced or not. If Taylor starts, I will save judgement til we play Washington and Wisconsin. If he does well, I might hop on the bandwagon again. Thats just the way sports go, when your team is winning everyone is happy. When they are losing, heads start to role. And its not just here are Nebraska that happens.
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It does happen everywhere. But for a fanbase that likes to tell everyone how awesome we as fans are, you'd think there'd be a little more honesty. The amount of outright lies people say and spread to tear someone down, both on and off the field, is mind boggling.

 
I don't recall the 2010 Spring very well... Was Taylor ripping off runs (scoring TDs) in the 2010 Spring game like he did in the first game up until his injuries? I am not sayng he is going to this year...I think he is still healing.

 
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saunders45 said:
Po Belini said:
nhuskers5 said:
Everybody calling for TMart's head is gonna be right back on the bandwagon if he starts off like he did last year. Flavor off the Month
Click to expand...
I'm by no means calling for his head. I want Bo to play the best QB, experienced or not. If Taylor starts, I will save judgement til we play Washington and Wisconsin. If he does well, I might hop on the bandwagon again. Thats just the way sports go, when your team is winning everyone is happy. When they are losing, heads start to role. And its not just here are Nebraska that happens.
Click to expand...
It does happen everywhere. But for a fanbase that likes to tell everyone how awesome we as fans are, you'd think there'd be a little more honesty. The amount of outright lies people say and spread to tear someone down, both on and off the field, is mind boggling.
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I'm actually a Martinez supporter because the kid is freakishly athletic, but the reality is that there were on and off-field issues concerning Taylor last year. His body language did not read well, and that kind of thing hinders your leadership potential. That doesn't mean he can't learn from last year and become a better quarterback and leader...far from it! The opposite is true.

But to say there is no room for criticism or that the criticism itself equates to dishonesty is inaccurate. Vitriol laden poisonous character assassination? Yeah, I'm against that. But saying the kid has some work to do isn't close to out of line. (And asking how much of an impact Taylor's injuries had on his decline during the end of the season and asking whether the coaches should have played him isn't out of line, either. The reality of the situation, as usual, is somewhere in between.)

Both sides have good points. But neither side wants to concede anything...gotta be 100% right! So rather than meet in the middle, where reality exists, you get a bunch of one-person see-saw arguments, totally weighted/slanted to one side, that devolve into name calling.

I mean...Taylor had a crazy season. From Heisman candidate to wounded deer-on-the-autobahn. I'd say that runs the gamut from exceptional to ineffective. So in my mind, you can argue both sides, but if you want to focus on his poor play late in the season then you are being dishonest if you choose to ignore his explosive, Heisman chatter inducing performances during the season. Likewise, if you're a big Taylor guy, then you can't just tell me about KSU or Washington 1 or OSU because Texas A&M happened. Oklahoma happened. Washington 2 (where NO one showed up) happened. I mean...everybody sees this, right?

EDIT: I want to retract the Texas A&M reference. That was a bad game for Taylor, but it was an even worse game for college football itself. I've literally never seen anything like that game before. It was like watching Oz on HBO.

 
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The fact is that nobody knows what we're really going to get with Taylor. There are incontrovertible points on the pro and con sides of the argument. Taylor's season last year gets an "Incomplete" because there's too much gray area between the brilliance and the buffoonery. Strictly speaking about PLAY on the field, he did great and he did horrible. There are caveats to both sides of his play.

We can go over the subject of how good/bad he is for another four months (and probably will), but there will never be anything conclusive written.

I'm pretty much done with this discussion. Nothing new is going to be said by anyone, no matter your opinion. Until we have new results from which to base our judgments, it's all been said already.

 
zoogies said:
^ yeah, I don't think Carnes should start this year. It would not be good news. It would be a huge indictment of Taylor and I don't think he is going to struggle that bad as to necessitate this. Carnes starting would just be another wrench in an already challenging year.

But who cares what his recruitment came down to? He was committed to USF and chose to leave. Thought about some probably guaranteed early playing time at a small school before deciding to give it a try in the big time. Taylor's recruitment options? Nowhere, for QB, which is what he really wanted...except for us, and I'm sure even he questioned the kind of "chance" he was going to get here.
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My point with the recruitment comment is Brion, like Taylor, was not heavily recruited to play the quarterback position at a big time division one football programs. Carnes definitely was more-so than Taylor, as most places had Taylor pegged as a safety, but Carnes was also being looked at as an athlete in other places.

I was just trying to say that these two didn't exactly have heavy expectations on them to perform at the next level coming out of high school. I would say Carnes did more-so than Martinez, but these guys weren't pegged as the next great dual-threat quarterbacks.

I hope that makes sense. I just think it's unfair to be putting these huge expectations on a guy like Carnes when I think before this year many people didn't even expect him to be in the quarterback discussion at this point.

 
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Nebula said:
saunders45 said:
Po Belini said:
nhuskers5 said:
Everybody calling for TMart's head is gonna be right back on the bandwagon if he starts off like he did last year. Flavor off the Month
Click to expand...
I'm by no means calling for his head. I want Bo to play the best QB, experienced or not. If Taylor starts, I will save judgement til we play Washington and Wisconsin. If he does well, I might hop on the bandwagon again. Thats just the way sports go, when your team is winning everyone is happy. When they are losing, heads start to role. And its not just here are Nebraska that happens.
Click to expand...
It does happen everywhere. But for a fanbase that likes to tell everyone how awesome we as fans are, you'd think there'd be a little more honesty. The amount of outright lies people say and spread to tear someone down, both on and off the field, is mind boggling.
Click to expand...
I'm actually a Martinez supporter because the kid is freakishly athletic, but the reality is that there were on and off-field issues concerning Taylor last year. His body language did not read well, and that kind of thing hinders your leadership potential. That doesn't mean he can't learn from last year and become a better quarterback and leader...far from it! The opposite is true.

But to say there is no room for criticism or that the criticism itself equates to dishonesty is inaccurate. Vitriol laden poisonous character assassination? Yeah, I'm against that. But saying the kid has some work to do isn't close to out of line. (And asking how much of an impact Taylor's injuries had on his decline during the end of the season and asking whether the coaches should have played him isn't out of line, either. The reality of the situation, as usual, is somewhere in between.)

Both sides have good points. But neither side wants to concede anything...gotta be 100% right! So rather than meet in the middle, where reality exists, you get a bunch of one-person see-saw arguments, totally weighted/slanted to one side, that devolve into name calling.

I mean...Taylor had a crazy season. From Heisman candidate to wounded deer-on-the-autobahn. I'd say that runs the gamut from exceptional to ineffective. So in my mind, you can argue both sides, but if you want to focus on his poor play late in the season then you are being dishonest if you choose to ignore his explosive, Heisman chatter inducing performances during the season. Likewise, if you're a big Taylor guy, then you can't just tell me about KSU or Washington 1 or OSU because Texas A&M happened. Oklahoma happened. Washington 2 (where NO one showed up) happened. I mean...everybody sees this, right?

EDIT: I want to retract the Texas A&M reference. That was a bad game for Taylor, but it was an even worse game for college football itself. I've literally never seen anything like that game before. It was like watching Oz on HBO.
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Don't disagree. My point was more to the people who are looking for something that isn't there. For instance, saying the kid is a jerk because of an interview, and you're in the extreme minority to interpret that? Seriously... That's no better than tabloid reporting or just blatant lying.

 
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