BigPeterJ

4 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

I don’t see it as intentional. 
 

I just think the people making decisions didn’t have winning championships as a priority. 

I think Pearlman didnt care for Sports, and Eichorst, being his dog of the female gender, just did what ge was told.  Pearlman did alot for the university, but really neglected sports.  

I knew we didnt have a ton of talent left from Riley, but i didnt realize how bad it was until some guys like Mavric and Big Ern and maybe one more showed the guys that are still here from Riley.  The chart showing the 4 star guys on our team is under emphasized.  (Cant remember if that was here or on Huskermax.com).  But by the time attrition set in, basically Frost was left with some good lineman (that dont necessarily fit his offense), and TEs.  Not much else.  We have less quality upperclassmen than most in our division, so despite our recruiting class rankings from the past 5 years, only our past 2 classes have much talent.  I really think we are still a year away unfortunately.

4 hours ago, Huskinator said:

I don’t think people Realized just how close to the drain we were spiraling.  This is a huge undertaking and will take lots of time. 

When Riley was fired alot of players went with him.  But Shawn Eichorst along with his boss Pearlman really drove this into the ground.  It almost seems that it would have to be intentional.  Riley had no ties to Nebraska, a style of football that we had already tried, and brought down the toughness that Pelini had built back into the culture.  Eichorst called it a culture hire.  But Pelini's guys rarely got in much trouble, they worked hard, they typically outperformed their talent.  Riley seemed out of place from day one.  He knew very little about Nebraska.  They didnt develop anyone very good, they didnt work hard, and by 3 seasons of that we had a bunch of out of shape guys who quit on Riley and didnt care much.  So yea, Eichorst wasnt kidding when he called it a culture hire.  Riley may be a good fit for certain places, but not for a college team in the midwest.  Imagine what would happen to Wisconsin if Mike Riley took over for 3 years.  Worst AD ever.

1 minute ago, Landlord said:

 

 

We've lost a bunch and we've added a bunch. We're not where we want to be, but we're better off than everyone in our division. Time to start acting like it.

Im not sure we have more talent in our upperclassmen than Wisconsin or Iowa .  But I agree that we have more than our performance level has been.

3 hours ago, Landlord said:

 

 

Our talent isn't average. It's better than everyone in our division, and all but two of our 2020 opponents. 7 wins would still be a bit of a disappointment in the sense that we are not getting a proportionate return on the talent we have. I know we're not where Frost would like us to go as far as the roster, but we've got the roster to be a legitimate contender for the West and it's time to start seeing the product on the field reflect that. 

Our recruiting classes have always been ranked higher than our divisional opponents, but we have lost so many guys to attrition, that what we have been left with isn't so.  We lost half of our first class under Frost.  Many guys off of our last couple Riley classes.  We don't have that many good players left from the 16' 17' and 18' classes.  

4 hours ago, ColoradoHusk said:

You are making more and more sense as your time here goes on.  We may disagree on Adrian, but this post makes sense.

I was drunk when i created my profile.  I say some dumb stuff sometimes just to make a point.  Also noticed your name....I lived in Steamboat for 2 years.

I want to add, we got some solid and a few great football players in the last 2 years. Frost's first class was last minute, put together like a band-aid, and no better than any of our previous classes.  Most of his guys and our best players are freshman, redshirt freshman, or true sophmores next year.  I'm not saying Riley left us nothing.  We have an experienced OL, a few DB's and some TE's.  What i am saying is we should only get better over the next 3 years.  Next year is by no means when our talent is ready.  We have enough to make a bowl, and hopefully the young guys are good enough to contribute, but i like our last 2 classes.  What I'm saying is this may take one more year,  but at the same time, next year will show us alot about what Frost's staff can do with average talent.  If he can win 7 games or so that will be a good sign.  If he only wins 5, it will say to me that Frost can only win with better talent than his opposotion.

17 minutes ago, Huskers93-97 said:

2 pieces to my response. 

 

1. Whether Frost is the "right" coach or not. That doesnt determine if Nebraska will eventually make the right hire and get back. All former powers who have lost their way are in the same hire/fire cycle we are in. 

 

2. I believe Frost is the right guy for a few reasons. 

A. He has done a phenomenal job recruiting so far with no recent results to sell. This should only improve with better seasons. 

B. He was a great play caller at Oregon and UCF he did an amazing job- so he has a history of doing well. Not at the P5 level as HC- but there are some results to point to. 

C. It is not just Husker hype about Frost. The national media, other coaches and people in the industry seem to think the of world of Frost and think he could be the next "IT" coach. 

D. For the first time since 2003 when we fired Solich, everyone in the state, in the program and at the university is rowing the boat in the same direction and no longer looking back at past wrongs and picking sides. Everyone is in on Frost. The last time we had that was when Osborne was here and the early Solich years. 

E. I think you could the second half of the first year what things could look like with talent. This last year I dont know what happened and I dont want to pretend to know. I just know his time at UCF and the second half of his first year looked great. I can only imagine when he has a bunch of 4 star talent running around to work with. He has not had that since Oregon. 

F. He actually gives a s#!t about the success of Nebraska and will work his a$$ off until it happens. Without Nebraska roots I dont think we could have made a hire that would have worked as hard as him at making it happen. Then once he does make it happen- actually stick around and not bolt for another job. 

 

Preach brother.  I get upset with the playcalling and decision making as much as anyone.  I was one of the most pissed off at Frost for taking Luke out of the Iowa game. But despite what i perceive as mistakes Frost made, i believe very strongly he is our guy.  Not in a we are stuck with him sense, but in a he is the best guy for Nebraska sense.  

When we get upset at how things are going i like to look into the future.  Lets just say we all got pissed at Frost and fired him.  Whoever replaced him would not be the same.  Even if he was a good coach, he wouldnt bleed Nebraska.  If he did good here, he would leave for Florida or Ohio State, hell he may leave for Arkansas cause it's in the SEC.  Even if he did well, Nebraska would be right back where we are now once he left for an easier job.  Nebraska is NOT an easy place to win. It is doable but it is not easy.  Also i have a feeling at SOME POINT Frost will be one of the best coaches in the game. Period. If we fired him, then 10 years down the road when he wins a championship at Florida or USC, we will all be talking about how stupid we were for letting him get away.  He is good, but very young.  There is no doubt in my mind, at this point, that he is the best guy FOR US, long term, possibly in the entire country.  

The way i see it.  Just as Freshman, and young athletes have growing pains.  Frost is a Freshman coach.  We had some serious growing pains this year.  But Frost is gonna be a good one at some point. He has been given some humility...frankly more than anyone would have imagined.  Like Paul from 2,000 years ago.  He bit off a lil more than he could chew.  But he has shown the humility to admit it to a degree.  Yes he makes some excuses, but you can tell he was humbled deep down.  Shows he is learning.  IMO one of the buggest reasons we underperformed this year was the QB Frost is so loyal to.  If AM had a good year, we would be 8-4 or so and everyone would be talking about how we are almost back.  Maybe his loyalty comes at a cost.  Maybe he takes it too far.  In his offense their is nothing that has more effect than a QB like Milton who is a winner and knows how to put the team on his back. If Luke or Smothers, or even AM comes back from the grave, we will compete and win lots of games as our defense slowly builds with each recruiting class.

3 hours ago, ReddyRed said:

Yeah, but one-time powers can fall and not come back – Miami, USC, etc. But giving you the benefit of the doubt, the Berlin Wall came down and Kansas State became good in football. So I guess anything's possible.

Nothing is guaranteed.  Yes, its possible Nebraska becomes Minnesota.  However thats very unlikely with our fan base and how much we care here.  Miami, USC, dont care as much as Nebraska.  Now 10 years from now that could be different.  Another 10 years of irrelevance, Frost failing, and the generation of Nebraskans having never witnessed a nationally significant team, ever growing.  A program can fall and not come back, but we arent there yet.  Right now anyone under the age of 25 has no memory of Nebraska ever being in the hunt for a Championship, the younger generation of Nebraskans doesnt care the way the rest of us do.  If Frost cant get it done in the next 10 years, then i will start worrying about us veing gone for good.

3 hours ago, WyoHusker56 said:

I found this today and thought it was interesting. Going into fall camp in 2017 his third year Riley only had 77 scholarships filled and 14 offensive lineman on scholarship. As well as only 7 scholarship wide receivers. We essentially had a self imposed 8 scholarship penalty. 

 

Things will change before fall camp, but Frost currently has 88 scholarships (planning for attrition) as well as 18 scholarship lineman and 11 scholarship wide receivers. 

 

It's amazing how badly Riley mismanaged the roster and it's taking time for Frost to rebuild it. 

 

Next year will tell us what we need to know about Frost.  We are not quite there, as our talent he recruited is mostly freshman and sophmores, but if we go 5-7 i will lose most my faith in him.  7-5 or better i will feel pretty good about Frost.

3 hours ago, lo country said:

Watching Wisky v Oregon and Kirk/Fowler showed Alvarez at the game.  Mentioned when he went to Wisky he introduced the DNA they still have today.  Stayed through Barry, Bret, and now Chryst....  Tough physical play and developing guys into stars......When people talk about NU identity, that's what it was.  For years. I am hoping that is what Frost is striving for.  Regardless of scheme, that IDENTITY wins games.  

 

Again, a lot of big boy football being played on some of these bowl games....3 year drought SUCKS!

Certainly does suck.  Im not giving up on Frost yet though.  If we dont make a bowl next year i might lose hope.

1 minute ago, Huskers93-97 said:

I understand where things are today. My point is how can you say we should expect 6-7 with a great 9 nine year as a outlier season from time to time when Wisconsin who has less advantages than Nebraska? Yet they routinely win 10-11. We should be able to match and exceed their ceiling. Historically we have. We are a top 5 all time team. Or does the first 100+ years not matter just the last 10-15? I would side with the 90% to define NU football not the 10% even though it is the most recent. 

4 hours ago, Dogs In A Pile said:

 

This pretty well sums up where I'm at and have been for the last few years. I feel lucky to have been able to witness / cheer for NU during its glory days, 5 NC, countless conf. championships, endless all-americans, many top bowl appearances and top notch play on the field over many decades. But, those days have become ancient history and won't be coming back again. Watching the games last Saturday as objectively as I could and realizing those teams are an order of magnitude or two above DONU truly saddens me but it is a fact. I don't realistically see any chance of NU winning a NC or even making the playoffs in my lifetime. I honestly don't see much chance of even getting back to the conf. championship game to get our butts kicked again more than once or twice a decade at best. And while the division might be obtainable it isn't going to happen very often. Next year, I'm thinking 6-6 would be a very successful season but think 5-7 or even worse is a more probable outcome. And I'd be pretty happy with 6-6.

Couple things here.  The times are different than in the 90's when we were one of a handful of teams consistently on television.  We probably will never be the dominant team of the 90's.  But at the same time saying Nebraska can't consistently be in the BIG Title game is equally off.  We recruit better than any team in the West Division, and that is true even after 3 losing seasons.  Our fan base/support does seperate us from the rest of the West to some degree.  Now we only have 5-10 years of that same fan support if we continue to struggle.  I think we CAN be in the BIG Title game on a consistent basis and maybe make the playoffs if we pull one out in a few of those Title games.  I know times have been hard, but lets not completely lose perspective and say we cant be a top 15 team and the best in the BIG West more than anyone else.

OSU got hosed.  They should be playing LSU

3 hours ago, Undone said:

 

I would honestly rank both poor special teams play and poor linebacker play ahead of bad QB play. And in that order, too.

Fair enough.  We all share our opinions, and dont have to agree to get along.  But as to yours, i can see why either good S.T. or good Linebacker play may have also made the difference between 5-7 and 9-3.  But good LB play involves 4 players doing better as a unit, S.T.  involves a group of players.  QB may have just as much impact and it is only 1 player.  

The larger point is that it doesn't take much to go from 5-7 to 9-3.  Atleast this year.  

2 hours ago, Landlord said:

Question:

 

If Martinez is hesitant throwing the ball on a pass play because all of the receivers are covered, is that.....bad? 

 

 

Were all the receivers covered? Or did he not see them when they were open?

14 hours ago, ColoradoHusk said:

I know a good QB is a significant difference maker for a team’s success. It’s very possible that Burrow could have gotten NU to 7-5, 8-4, or 9-3. However, I think you are mistaken on how badly Martinez played this year. You seem to focus only on the negatives Martinez brought in each game. Yes, he did struggle in games, but he also made significant positive plays in those same games.

 

I think it’s laughable that you think Vedral would have done better than Martinez at QB. NU was 0-2 with Vedral at starter. Vedral made a back breaking mistake against Indiana, yet you give him the benefit of the doubt, and think he’s better than Martinez.

 

You seem to have a personal agenda against Adrian, and your posts for the past number of weeks have had the same tone.  You make wide, negative comments about the guy, and think he is the sole reason for NU’s struggles. Yes, Martinez could have played better in 2019, but the same could be said for the entire team. I don’t know if you are one of those small town Nebraskans who simply don’t like Martinez because of his last name or skin-tone, but you make it easy to make that assumption. 

A couple things.  I admit that i have been beating this drum about Martinez for a while now.  The reason for it is that i believe very strongly that, although their were many reasons we are 5-7, the single biggest reason was our QB play.   The QB has more effect on the outcome of a game than any other single player on a team, not just for Nebraska.  

To point out how big of a difference the QB can make, with Burrow at QB we dont lose to Colorado, Indiana, Purdue, or Iowa.  That puts us at 9-3.  As good as Burrow or Fields are, we may even have beaten Wiscy.  Like i said its not personal its just sports.  Martinez seems like a great guy, someone id be proud of as a friend or son or brother.  But on the football field he was really bad, and it was more on the mental side of things, so i dont think the injuries had much to do with it.  Maybe things will click mentally and he will be very good next year.  If not i hope Luke is playing.   Adrian certainly has potential, and can take contact.  He has alot of talent thats for sure.  For the record his ethnicity has nothing to do with the fact i think he was a bad quarterback this year.  

4 hours ago, ColoradoHusk said:

I know it’s popular to bash Frost for not trying to bring in Burrow, and that makes people doubt Frost’s ability to evaluate QB’s. However, Burrow was rated as a 5th-7th round draft pick before this season. Let’s not act like Frost is the only one who “misjudged” Burrow. I have never seen a 1-year improvement by a QB in my near 40 years of following college football like Burrow has. 

I think the frustration has less to do with how good Burrow is, and more to do with how bad Adrian is (now).  At the time of Frosts decision it seemed to be the right one. But mentally Burrow is on a completely different level than Adrian right now.  

You cant blame his shoulder injury on his NON-THROWING shoulder past the halfway point in the season.   If im honest, and not trying to spare someones feelings, AM is as off mentally as i have EVER seen a starting QB.  You could heal all his injuries, put LSU's offensive line in front of him, give him LSU's receivers, and he STILL will not time the throws right, not see open guys, hesitate on his decisions, and often miss open receivers even when he DOES see them, including simple screen passes that will not hit the runner in stride.  

I dont know what the kid is going through, and its nothing about Character, but even with plenty of fans admitting how off Martinez was this entire year, overall i dont think most of our fan base on here at least realizes just how bad he was.  It amazes me how many people will blame the OL, the Receivers, and the defense more than the QB, or blame injuries, some phantom sophmore slump theory, anything other than how mentally god aweful he was.  Its just the truth.

Someone mentioned how much of a difference 1 really good player makes.  Especially at QB.  With a healthy Vedral (a halfway decent QB) we are 7-5 this year instead of 5-7.  With a Joe Burrow level QB (and dont tell me Adrian was much faster than burrow or could buy any more time than Burrow with his legs this year) even if he is not a supposed dual threat QB, we are 9-3 this year.  Thats how much difference a very good QB vs a bad QB can make.

6 hours ago, Mavric said:

Talk about going from the penthouse to the outhouse....

 

 

Ohio State will slowly take a step back over the next couple years.  I just dont see Day sustaining Urban Meyer level football forever.  Its easy the first year you come into a house with that solid of a foundation.  Another reason Solich's quick decline was fire-worthy imo.  Nebraska had such a solid foundation that Mike Riley could have done as well as Solich for a couple years.  Our mistake was the next hire.

13 minutes ago, HuskerNBigD said:

While I don't think we've had issues recruiting for a divisional title, I was thinking a bit more ambitiously (conference and national title contender). I'd agree we have the talent to win the West, just need development and fine-tuning of coaching, both of which are definitely obtainable.

I understand where your coming from.  But i think if we were winning on the level of Wisconsin or even Iowa lately, which we should have been doing based on the recruiting ability we already have, we would be recruiting in the 10-20 range instead of the 17-30 range.  Bo wasnt big into recruiting and still got 25ish ranked classes.  Scott has been getting 17-20 ranked classes at a program not making bowl games and is nationally irrelevant at the moment.  If we went 8-4 the last 3 years i bet his classes would have been ranked around 12-15 instead of 17-22. 

To your point i guess upping the bagman game could move us even higher, but then we're Ole Miss...

Also if this program takes off like Scott thinks it will, and we're all of a sudden a playoff contender and getting top 5-10 classes in the middle of the northern plains, that will attract alot of attention, and eventually we would be caught if we're doing a high level of that kinda stuff

2 hours ago, CalhounHusker said:

I would mostly agree with this list, but Sevion. Scott looks a lot more physically ready. I saw a picture of Sevion and looked like he needed a year of nutrition, but I guess a lot of people said the same about Mo.

My mistake i thought Sevion was the strong one.  I hope between him and Scott one of them turns out.  

I didnt vote, but a few thoughts:

Coming off of 3 straight losing seasons, the next 2 years are so crucial to our future, so the top 6 that will have the most immediate impact are my top 6

-Corcoran , he is good enough to start his 2nd year.  And we need an OL like him.

-Keyshawn Greene, same as above but at the LB spot

-Omar Manning, immediate top level receiver 

-Va Mauga-Clements, this defense needs playmakers at LB and he will contribute immediately

-Zavier Betts, he is just that good he will be a big contributor by his 2nd year if not this year

-Sevion, because he is already physically ready and we need another RB 

I really hope Sevion is the real deal, It has been a while since Nebraska had a stud RB and we need one.  Im talking Burkhead/Abdullah level good.  I think Mills is better than he is given credit for, but our young RBs didnt impress me last year and some of them are injury-hampered. 

51 minutes ago, HuskerNBigD said:

I'll go ahead and say it, I believe we're at a point in time where having a bag man, or handler, is just the norm. Whether it is right or wrong is another debate and one that I really don't want to delve into, but if we're to be competitive in the recruiting process we need to be willing to play the game.

I dont think recruiting has been our problem.  Despite not winning anything of national significance in 15 years, we consistently pull higher sought after recruits than anyone in our division.  Start winning, and we will get a few more studs.  We already get enough that we should be winning our division half the time.

43 minutes ago, Skeeball said:

Can we all agree that we need to find a way to get this kid on the field more than a handful of plays over the course of the next season.  He has all the indications of being a gamer who makes positive things happen and elevates the plays of those around him.  The same could be said of the 2018 Martinez.

I have a feeling that if he truly is the gamer people like you and I think he is, he will show it this offseason to the point the team wont be able to deny he needs to be the starter.  I know its different when your playing 2 hand touch on the QB but he can still show it.

51 minutes ago, Nebfanatic said:

Ehh. I'm of the mind if you have 2 loses you don't deserve a chance at a national title.

Yea hearing Bama kinda put me off to the idea.  I think 4 is enough, but i wouldnt have a problem with 8.  Would be exciting at least.  Just would hate to see a scenario where an LSU has to beat a Bama twice.  Could even be 3 times in some scenarios with Conference Championship games.

I think we will see a rise into competitiveness again, meaning 9-10 win seasons, BIG Championship games, and if we are lucky, a playoff birth or 2.  But that is why they play the games, who really knows.

One thing seems fairly certain, we will live or die with Scott.