kansas45

Thoughts and prayers, with a moment of silence at the next game. Because I doubt those like Hilltop would be willing to give up football even if a player died from COVID. Precisely. They will then argue that the statistics were so low that this has to be an outlier and say it was "one of those 1 in a million chances", and hope like hell that the wrongful death suit brought by the parents will not impact the athletic department.

EDIT: Not so fast my friend. https://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2020/6/29/21306134/college-athletes-football-season-sports-return-covid-deaths The pundits cry: “But they’re young!” No way young folks, especially ones in as great shape as athletes, would be vulnerable to COVID-19’s most destructive outcomes! Tell that to Cody Lyster’s parents: Lyster was a 21-year-old college athlete who, in early April, became the youngest person to die from COVID-19. His parents were also infected, and have recovered. Lyster was a baseball player at Colorado Mesa University with no pre-existing health conditions, but COVID-19 killed him in less than two weeks from contraction. But it is called clinical reasoning based on the best available data given the contagion's distinct affinity for internal organs and its affect on said internal organ physiology and the body's response to such. But then if there is no chance, as you say, because there has not been a severe case based on your clinical criteria, why were the workouts at Rutgers, Kansas State, Ohio St and others, put on pause? Can you tell me what your phone call would be to the parents of a student-athlete under your guidance would consist of? Lifelong Lung Damage: The Serious COVID-19 Complication That Can Hit People in Their 20s https://www.healthline.com/health-news/lifelong-lung-damage-the-serious-covid-19-complication-that-can-hit-people-in-their-20s Most recently, a 20-year-old COVID-19 survivor in Chicago was the recipient of a new set of lungs, due to a lung transplant that was necessary to treat a condition now being called post-COVID fibrosis. Since we do not have this data, another hypothetical is this one (and I would like your expert medical opinion on this), what if a student-athlete contracts the virus but passes it on to someone else, who could pass it on to another person, who may end up in your "severe" category who fits in your age criteria? You know it is going to be virtually impossible to "bubble" the team and the entire athletic staff and support personnel. But if we use your criteria of those who are over 35 stand a much higher chance of having severe reactions to this contagion, this would logically mean that coaches should NOT be coaching as a very strong majority of the coaches on the Husker staff are over the age of 35. Can we have the players suit and play without a coach? But I guess you could counter that with PPE of the coaches and periodic testing but how do you account for this aspect of your argument? Not necessarily; there is the liability issue that is predominant. Because you have failed to account for my earlier questions of why were the workouts at Rutgers, Kansas State, Ohio St and others, put on pause?" Can you please answer this fundamental question? But you leave out important factors and many variables to contend with and it cannot be based on "there are no severe cases as of yet impacting college aged students." I am surprised that you have not been called upon by the University of Nebraska's Athletic Medicine staff and been allowed to present this valuable, yet important data point, given your strong background in epidemiology, clinical medicine and infectious disease knowledge. You obviously have important medical data and a perfectly sound medical hypothesis based on zero cases of severe illness based on your severe case medical criteria. Can you explain why this one data point that you have has not been considered and that you have not been called upon to present this? I am sure you can put together a powerpoint lecture of two or three slides and that would convince all and leave no doubt as to your medically-backed opinion. Oh heck, just one slide will be sufficient and the medical experts can look at each other in pure astonishment and go "well, golly gee. We never thought of that. Shazam!!! What are we waiting for? Let's play!!!" And then we can fans who are college aged students in the stands because they are not likely to die and we can have the band in there as they are college aged students and Bill Moos can cut a deal with all the other University of Nebraska system colleges and they can busload all those other college students to fill the stadium because your data point is quite compelling. If you are under age 22, come on in and cheer on the Huskers. But to make sure we have your clinical criteria accurate: Severe=hospitalization and ventilator status; Moderate = not yet classified by you; Mild = not yet classified by you. You have also failed to answer this question: what will you do if one student-athlete develops a, let's say moderate, since you say "severe" is hospitalization and needing oxygen supplementation via a ventilator, and this student-athlete develops myocarditis? And what will be your response if in the event of a covid-related death of a student-athlete?

If baseball shuts down, I believe one can safely conclude that football will be shut down. A lot of these commissioners were going to watch and see what baseball did.

I agree we cannot simply stop society; but I have asked this question before with no answer from you or anyone: what do you say to the parent of a student-athlete if something occurs that was easily preventable by not playing? What does that phone conversation sound like? Yes, faculty are capable of wearing PPE; however, in higher education these people are a totally different bread of animal. Ok, so severe is only hospitalized and needing oxygen supplementation. So, a person who gets the virus but they develop myocarditis is not considered severe and that prevents them from playing. Or the student-athlete that contracts the virus and they happen to have sickle cell anemia and that prevents them from playing. So, hypercoagulability is not a concern? If there are no confirmed cases of severe infections, why in the world did all those schools and conferences cancel their season? Why in the world did OhioSt and Rutgers and other schools put a halt to workouts? If the situation changes, you would re-evaluate. Ok, and what would this re-evaluation process look like? Cancel the season? Oh heaven's no, you would not do that to stop society over one little measly death or student-athlete on a ventilator. Postpone the games? Carry on as normal?

You are correct. We simply do not know if this is an acute case or will turn into a chronic case. We are talking about faculty here. They operate on a totally different mindset. Especially if they are in a union. Define what the term "severe" means; once we have established this, then we can begin the discussion. But we move forward because there has not been a "severe" case? And what do we do if a severe case emerges amongst a college football player? Or is transmitted to a person who is not an athlete? And because there has not been a severe case linked to a college student-athlete, does this fall in line with the paradigm of "the college student-athlete's health and safety is of supreme importance"? What do you propose we do if there is ONE severe case? This is where your definition of what constitutes severe is going to be important.

What did I tell you all about the media outrage machine getting warmed up? Another exhibit to present. CNN's Bob Costas: 'Unconscionable' for unpaid college football players to play during pandemic https://thehill.com/homenews/media/509931-cnns-bob-costas-unconscionable-for-unpaid-college-football-players-to-play

I'm married, I know nothing about this. But on to more important matters: football. I think you are all missing a key variable in having a football season. It is not just students that will be key; you also have faculty to contend with as well as staff. UNC System Faculty and Staff Prepare Lawsuit to Delay Opening https://www.chronicle.com/article/unc-system-faculty-and-staff-prepare-lawsuit-to-delay-opening Here is a timeline of events and updates that affects higher education. Remember, the University of Nebraska IS an institution of higher education not a football franchise. I think we all tend to forget this. https://www.chronicle.com/article/live-coronavirus-updates-heres-the-latest

You just described bodily reactions when we lose a game.

I just checked the county that I am from. I am surprised there is that many cases there since there is hardly anyone there in the first place. But you told us that we are ok on playing football and that we should consider all the information. What has changed?

I would read the letter. It does not sound like it is promising.

I just got my covid test today for work and I have to wait 5 to 7 business days to get the results but said they would contact me immediately if I test positive. Think of the logistics and the cost. 1. cannot come into stadium without mask; ticket? go out and scalp it but remain six feet apart; 2. station 1: register, show photo ID, and proof of health insurance and copay; if no insurance, pay total fee; Remember, stay where the red cone is at to insure six feet apart. 3. station 2: get temp checked; 4. station 3: get nickel and dimed with questions: shortness of breath? been in contact with anyone with covid? feeling sick? feverish? cough? been on a cruise? been out of the state since January? own your own home? want to refinance? 5. station 4: get nose swabbed by nurse in hazmat suit; 6. station 5: get results; 7. if negative, you may enter; 8. if positive, go to Soylent Green entry where it says Soylent Green; proud sponsor of Husker Athletics. Listen for our ads during the game when Greg Sharpe and Matt Davison talk about it during the game. Enjoy the great taste of Soylent Green and cheer on the Huskers with your favorite beverage. Or do our express lane ticket entry: 1. have mask; 2. show most recent covid results with doctor's signature; 3. if recent according to guidelines; you are in; 4. if not recent enough, go the line where covid check-in is at; Luxury suite owner? Come right on in. No need for the above. But I hope this is not considered political but this just came out: https://www.foxnews.com/health/different-types-covid-19-study Scientists identify six different ‘types’ of COVID-19 in new study

Wonder if the league will have any guidelines regarding this or if it will be up to each school. I have got a feeling that some local public health officials are simply losing their minds over this tweet as those "low" numbers can turn into "big" numbers in a real hurry. I do not know what Moos' calculus is on this. If the league deviates from the CDC, then the CDC is going to say "do what you want, don't blame us, I am sure your crack epidemiologists in the athletic department are smarter than us."

I love the meme/gif responses. Could be a whole different way in responding. Here is my response. Here is how we will proceed for the season before fire is set to it.

That story came out right before the Marlins story broke. Finebaum, if you listened to him today on his show and his opinion on ESPN the past two mornings is not as optimistic.

Is this a question or a statement? If you could clarify I would be most appreciative. Predictions is all about football. Don't we all predict if we are going to win or not? And then give reasons why we think we will win or lose? Their running game is much stronger, our passing game is better and so forth? If there was not this covid situation raging, we would all be talking about the starting lineup and predicting the depth chart, predicting the Purdue game, and predicting the entire season of wins and losses. Just think of this as college football vs covid and see who is going to win. https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/29559931/three-pro-bowl-lineman-lane-johnson-tests-positive-placed-reserve-covid-19-list-eagles Philadelphia Eagles right tackle Lane Johnson has tested positive for COVID-19, he announced Wednesday, but said he feels "strong and ready to go."Linebacker Nathan Gerry and tackle Jordan Mailata were also placed on the list, which was created for a player who either tests positive for COVID-19 or who has been in close contact with an infected person or persons. Chiefs RB Damien Williams opting out of 2020 season https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/29560047/chiefs-rb-damien-williams-opting-2020-season The Kansas City Chiefs had a second starter from their Super Bowl LIV victory opt out because of coronavirus concerns, as running back Damien Williams informed team officials he would sit out the 2020 season.

Since I am incoherent and a pessimist, here is some news for you all. In a reversal of an earlier announcement, Georgetown University announced Wednesday that classes for the fall 2020 semester will start online. https://wtop.com/coronavirus/2020/07/georgetown-university-to-begin-classes-online-in-fall/ Has nothing to do with Husker football? It gets better. Still, nothing to do with Husker football. Getting closer to Big 10 country.... The Illinois High School Association on Wednesday put the football season — at least in the traditional sense — on ice due to continuing concerns surrounding the coronavirus pandemic. According to a new plan introduced by the IHSA, there will be a streamlined football season from Feb. 15 to May 1. Girls volleyball and boys soccer have also been moved to that time frame. https://www.chicagotribune.com/suburbs/daily-southtown/sports/ct-sta-spt-ihsa-fall-sports-st-073020-20200729-m3hudrtmmrethcvrftoruh2tsy-story.html And now the parents: (found out about this on the Paul Finebaum Show today) https://www.sportscasting.com/retired-all-pro-chris-hinton-wants-a-voice-in-deciding-if-ncaa-football-gets-played/ To that end, Chris and Mya Hinton created College Football Parents 24/7, an advocacy group that the Chicago Tribune reports has grown to nearly 2,000 parents of athletes with a goal to keep pressure on the NCAA to adhere to smart and consistent guidelines for starting up the college football season. In looking up the term "wrongful death" "NCAA" I found this: https://alexanderlaw.com/blog/2018/12/wrongful-death-lawsuits-against-ncaa/ Just replace CTE with covid and you have a lawsuit. But other than that, I think we will have a college football season this year. There, is that positive or what?

Hilltop: Let me do something that simply irritates many here. Let's break this down. hahahahaha [I just think you are being a pessimist. I'll be hunting in Wyoming during the first 2 weeks of season and won't watch a couple in October for the same reasons. I love Husker football but my world doesn't revolve around it. ] Thank you. But actually I am the optimistic-pessimist. I am 100% positive that things are going to go horribly wrong. My family tree is one in which we have always relied on our unwavering faith that if things are going good, something bad is right around the corner. Let me give you an example: when we were cutting wheat, I asked what we are going to do if it hails? only to get the response "we aren't that lucky." My faith denomination strives for the ultimate in humility. But have fun hunting in Wyoming. [I truly believe the kids should be playing. I truly believe our media is preying on scared people. Yes the virus is real and should be a concern- especially for anyone over the age of 35. However the data suggests that is doesn't impact the young enough to really even be a concern imo. It certainly has less impact than the flu for them from everything we know now.] You can ride that crop duster all you want. It is not logic that I am willing to run on as the minute I start thinking things are going good, BOOM!!!, I'm am going to look like a fool. [But what about the UNKNOWNS??? That's just it, they don't know and I refuse to be scared of what might be.] I recall Luke Skywalker telling Yoda that he was not afraid only to have Yoda say "you will be." [I know, but what about the extreme case of (fill in the blank). There are extreme cases of just about everything. IMO, we can't live our lives worried about the small % chance that something bad will happen.] Like the small chance that the game you are hunting will pop up with an AK-47 to even the odds? But this is why you are able to enjoy your hunting because we have learned from the bad things that have happened to people to make it better and safer and more enjoyable. Sure, you could be out there waiting to bag that big prize and a meteor hit you. But you also have to consider all the safety variables that have come second nature to you with experience. In clinical science and teacher education and other things, we teach "what not to do" just as much as we teach "what to do." With so many unknowns, we have to strongly consider the unknowns as very real possibilities and be mindful of such in order to know "what to do". Since this is so new to all of us, we want to lessen the risk as much as possible and consider all the variables possible because we have no experience with this. But this is the clinical scientist in me speaking. I like pleasant surprises instead of "oh crap" surprises. [Our beliefs won't likely ever align and that's ok. Work is slow today and it has been fun to be on today. Especially with the thread Knap started about the Frankenstein schedule. I'm merely suggesting you consider there could be some positives if you look for them. ] I have considered them. Yet they do not make any sense. But please tell us, what are those positives? Maybe we are missing a key insight that you have.

Thank you. I also predict that: 1. I will continue to get on your nerves; 2. I will make predictions based on the best available evidence from multiple sources and extrapolate what that could mean; one can easily see trends occurring. 3. Chris Schmidt of Hail Varsity will continue to believe, to his dying day, that there will be football come hell or high water; I suggest you tune into his podcast to counter my rantings. There could be a nuclear holocaust going on and he will be asking "if there is no season could Nebraska go rogue and make their own schedule? I say we should as we need football." But you stated: I'm hopeful we some football in 4 weeks. Is this indicative of some doubt? I am not sad or negative, but I can see why you would have that perception, if you are basing all your hopes, dreams and desires on having a season and have your mind racing "we gotta have football" like it is some type of oxygen that you need to live your life whereas I am simply being a realist and pragmatist.

You aren't wrong but that makes things tricky for the season. If 1 or 2 do it it won't be that big of a deal but if multiple players from top teams decide to sit it will be interesting to see how things go. Clemson, OSU, Alabama don't want to give up their recruiting edge but at the same time what else do you do. They are gone either way I suppose. I believe we will start to the see more of this; I also believe there will be those players who will want to redshirt instead of burning a year on just what could be a suspended/cancelled season. Why play just 3 or 4 games or sit there and wait, and wait, and wait? I also predict that recruits will commit early so they get their NLI secured since there won't be any campus visits for games. These recruits do not have the luxury of waiting around and cause a suspense scene because the offer may not be there at a later time if someone jumps ahead of them. I also predict that there will be a mass team exodus as a protest, on some teams, mostly PAC 12 teams, that will, as a group, opt out of the season when they realize that they are being used for money when all the other sports are either cancelled, suspended by the NCAA AND that there are no students on campus. I see this at either California or Stanford or even Oregon State maybe even Oregon or Washington due to the unrest in Portland and Seattle possibly. They will clamor that the school is not making it safe for them when the argument that other students cannot be on campus because it is unsafe. I also predict that if another pro-athlete has tested positive and has complications, this is going to be a BIG domino.

This just in: https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/29559317/penn-state-reports-8-positive-athletes Penn State reported eight positive coronavirus tests on Wednesday. The athletic department conducted a total of 466 tests of student-athletes as of July 24, and there are still 66 results pending. The tests were for student-athletes only, not staff, and across all sports, according to a school spokesperson.

The brain fog yes and the concept of "happy hypoxia". https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20200622-the-long-term-effects-of-covid-19-infection Thank you for stimulating my curiosity on this. https://www.ajemjournal.com/article/S0735-6757(20)30364-8/fulltext https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamaneurology/fullarticle/2764549 https://www.healio.com/news/primary-care/20200612/qa-navigating-neurological-consequences-of-covid19 <--this one can explain things for the general public https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20200622-the-long-term-effects-of-covid-19-infection In Japan, researchers reported the case of a 24-year-old man who was found unconscious on the floor in a pool of his own vomit. He experienced generalised seizures while being rushed to hospital. An MRI scan of his brain revealed acute signs of viral meningitis (inflammation of the brain), and a lumbar puncture detected Sars-CoV-2 in his cerebrospinal fluid.

This had better get the covid minimalists some pause. I know some of you will think this is too much or incoherent. I happen to enjoy this pathophysiology. But it is relevant to this discussion on the decision of whether football players should be playing football this fall. This image reveals how the no symptoms and mild symptoms can lead to hypercoagulation which leads to vessel wall damage. images come from this study https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanres/article/PIIS2213-2600(20)30229-0/fulltext

You noted: I think it's crazy to not take all the information into account. You have ALL the information you need. And you made the solemn pledge that "student-athlete health and safety is paramount." You have to make a decision here and each of these levels are different with these three things: students, student-athletes, finances, liability, media, brand, fans, faculty, staff, parents and ethics. Your decision must accompany all of these things and be taken into consideration. Please be specific. Do not weasel out of this by saying "I am not in this position." I just put you in these positions and you have to make a decision and tell us your plan of action. 1. You are the President of the University of Nebraska system. What is your decision and what do you do? 2. You are the Superintendent of Schools in an area where there is an unusually high number of covid? What is your decision and what do you do? 3. You are Bill Moos. What is your decision and what do you do? 4. You are Scott Frost. What is your decision and what do you do? 5. You are the parent of a football playing student-athlete at Nebraska who has a chance at a pro-career. What is your decision and what do you do? 6. Your other child is a high school senior, not playing athletics. What is your decision and what do you do?