307husker

Disappointing if true.

On 3/9/2018 at 6:02 PM, jsneb83 said:

Is that how you are supposed to power clean? We always brought it down to the rest position like hang cleans, and the lower it to the floor and power clean

A power clean is just an indication that the hips don't descend below the knees during the lift.  Full clean (from the floor), hang cleans (high hang, low hang, pocket, etc), and box cleans, among others could all be done "power" or full (squat cleans isn't a term used outside of CrossFit).

I wonder if these guys are squatting high bar or low bar in the back squat.  If they have been using front squat for a couple of years and switch to a low bar back squat, the numbers they're lifting are going to go up by a very large amount regardless of whether they are actually stronger.  I actually think the front squat translates to football better than a back squat.

I really can't see a reason to have football players snatch at any significant level of effort.  That's an incredibly technical lift for barbell athletes and would have a lot of injury potential for most football players.

On 2/27/2018 at 10:24 AM, HS_Coach_C said:

 

This had to hurt.  I wonder how it happened.  Hopefully he can have a quick and full recovery.

My guess is that he got it caught between the bar and the rack after a squat if he's grabbing outside of the hooks, which is likely for guys that size..  That would hurt.  I've always been paranoid about that when re-racking weights.

I'm guessing he got it caught between the bar and the rack during squats, which would suck.  Can't really imagine how else this would happen.

It's tacky.  

But...

kids...

This young man seems to have some personality and maybe just a bit of that ever important confidence.  I sincerely hope that he can back it up.

Really hoping to hear on this guy soon.

52 minutes ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

I have never seen so many Reputation Points awarded in a single thread, so I assumed it was full of awesome posts on a really controversial subject.

 

It's not and it's not.

 

Weird.

 

+1 if you agree. 

Begging is so unbecoming

15 minutes ago, HANC said:

UNLESS YOU ARE THE TYPE OF PERSON WHO LIVES FOR FINGER POINTING.

This has become the new norm.  Nothing happens unless it's someone's fault and there will be accusations (and lawsuits).

1 hour ago, DaveH said:

 

I generally agree, but I think maybe they found a hint where this line lies for some. I hope they have some copious notes with regard to what led up to this.

 

That being said, I don't think productive training requires knowing where this line is. I have a feeling that approaching this line doesn't really help elicit the adaptation you're looking for and more than staying a good distance away.

 

I'd only additionally mention that while yes, some muscle damage is a result of productive training, muscle destruction is not. The -lysis in Rhabdomyolysis almost literally means death or at least leading to cell death. It would be good to stay away from that  

Damage and destruction are not clinical terms and have little value in differentiating between what would be expected with high intensity training and the medical condition of Rhabdomyolisis.  Eccentric contraction, resistance exercise used to develop strength, and speed-strength training methods, are all associated with rhabdo.  I don't think you can train an elite (hopefully) Division I football team without some risk of this situation.  Reasonable caution should be exerrcised, and it sounds like it was.

Football training isn't worth developing rhabdomyolysis, but, IMO, the nature of football training at a high level necessitates risking developing rhabdomyolysis...  

I sort of wonder if there was some degree of pressure from the new staff to make this decision.  It opens up a valuable scholarship and we aren't in the luxurious position of being able to use them for (relatively) non productive members of the team.

1 minute ago, Enhance said:

Precisely. I don't understand why it's difficult to acknowledge this situation is unacceptable, regardless of who deserves the blame. It shouldn't happen. It shouldn't happen even if the previous coaches didn't hold players accountable. It shouldn't happen if a player slacked off on holiday workouts. It shouldn't happen based on a prescribed workout regimen.

 

Without all the facts and first hand knowledge, all we can really do is accept their words that they're taking this very seriously.

I don't understand your perspective fully.  The only way to guarantee that rhabdo does not occur would be to avoid vigorous physical conditioning.  

There is no way for either the staff or the athletes to know where the line is between good hard work, and overwork...

ALL physical training causes some degree of muscle fiber damage.  It's simply a matter of how much is done and whether the body can respond productively to that damage.  Rhabdo isn't really a binary diagnosis.  There are highly variable levels of CK levels in the blood signifying muscle breakdown.  At some point the number on the lab chart reaches the threshold to officially dx Rhabdomyolysis and significant concern for kidney function becomes the overwhelming priority for the health care providers.

14 minutes ago, Hedley Lamarr said:

Sounds easy compared to my days at Ft Benning 

Old Man Syndrome.

3 minutes ago, Comfortably Numb said:

 

 

I'm curious about a few things because I really don't know squat about training at this level.

 

We all know these guys have to push themselves to see results. Seems like there could be lots of possible contributing factors.

A) pre-existing poor conditioning.

B) a player knowingly going beyond their limits or accidently doing so in an effort to make an impression.

C) poor programming or an underestimation at how slowly they may need to wean these particular kids into things.

D) poor supervision or an overestimation of what they can expect from these guys already. 

 

I guess my gut feeling, looking in from the outside, is that it is likely due to some combination of all these factors.  And I'm very hesitant to blame the coaches or S&C staff considering their past track record, awards etc.  My questions;

 

1- Isn't this pretty much a line they have to flirt with to get where they're going?

2- What exactly can the staff do to 100% prevent this and still get results?

3- I realize this is not what anybody wants to happen but couldn't it be a pretty innocent occurrence in this particular case where I think we all suspect not enough work has been going on in this program for quite awhile?

^^^^^^ Nailed it!

Along with a bunch of individual factors for each athlete, some physical, some mental.  The athletes themselves can't really know when they're over the line either.  What feels like good hard conditioning one time can be enough to put you in the hospital the next.

I am thankful for my weak mental fortitude.  It has protected me from rhabdo my entire life... 

1 minute ago, Cdog923 said:

 

I understand; I'm just searching for a causation = correlation type of scenario here. I'm honestly thinking it's a mixture of 1. the previous staff not doing a good job and B. the kids taking a full month off of training. 

Those may be valid points, along with the psychological drive to "prove yourself" to a new staff and quite possibly take the sting out of a failed season from last year.

I'm sure there were a lot of factors involved.  It will certainly serve as a reminder to all involved that Rome wasn't/can't be build in a day.

ScottyIce;

Well, fill out the FAFSA, enroll, and then we'll get to work. 

My tuition plan is affordable for most, but the acceptance rate is pretty low (mostly due to laziness rather than selectivity).

1 minute ago, DaveH said:

 

I'm not trying to kick the guys out of town. I just hope they take this as seriously as they should. Not only is this a bad look, it could be indicative of bad programming.

It could, or it could be problems with a couple of individuals.  I'm sure that they're taking it very seriously.  Being hooked up to IV's for a couple of days, or having your players hooked up to IV's isn't something that a person brushes off without due consideration.  

 

Performance athletics isn't always healthy and rhabdo is a tricky thing.  Unfortunately, there isn't always a clear line between working hard and working too hard, especially in a group environment with highly competitive and "invincible" college age athletes.  

The pitchforks and feathers need to be put away IMO, Duval, Frost and Co. hopefully learn a bit from this and are better for it in the future. 

I like the fact that recovery, nutrition, and focus on the applicable energy systems for football will be stressed.

Any idiot can make strength and conditioning "hard".  Players puking in buckets is hardly the mark of excellence.

I'd like to hear more about the aerobic/anaerobic training during different phases, types of lifts emphasized, strength vs. power strategies.  

It sounds like there has been a positive synergy between Frost and Duval and I'm happy Nebraska was able to bring a "system" to UNL rather than a bunch of individual parts which don't necessarily complement each other.

On 1/20/2018 at 10:16 AM, GBRFAN said:

 

I hope you aren't hiring 18 year old kids and offering them a four year deal.  If so hope you have a good lawyer.

Does the US Military have a good lawyer?  Sounds like exactly what they do.

4 year scholar ships must be a new thing.  I was under the impression that they were 1 year renewable deals.

If it's an NCAA rule, then it would have to change for all sports.

That would be huge.  It would also reduce the total number of athletes that compete at the NCAA level.

If this is an NCAA rule change, I want my additional year of eligibility. 

College was fun and I'd appreciate it much more now that I know what being an adult is really like.

A college degree means very little in 2017 outside of a few degree fields.

Engineering, computer science, etc...

Criminal justice is not one of those highly valuable undergrad degrees.

2 hours ago, Keith.Wassung said:

Imagine this scenario, 

Your child is a junior at Stanford. Top of their class. One day Bill Gates walks into the class and extends his hand to your child and says 'I want you to come work for me. I will pay you 3 million a year with a guaranteed 4 year contract, but you would have to start in 30 days. 

Would ANYONE in the world advise them to stay in school and finish their degree?  (not a chance)

You attend college to improve your economic income producing potential (a couple of exceptions) 

The only decision that a college player with professional potential needs to make is whether staying would dramatically increase the income potential after that year. "

Plenty of time to attend school and get the degree later. 

This is exactly correct IMO. 

A college degree is a dime a dozen.  Most of them are fairly worthless (I have 2!).  If he needs another year to improve his positioning for an NFL contract, I completely agree with the decision to come back. 

If it's for the criminal justice degree, he is receiving bad advice, but I highly doubt that this would be the case despite what the press release may say.