Is the Ohio State situation worse than NU in 2007?

[knapplc]

Look at USC last year. I can't remember if they were ranked, but if they were, it was higher then 20. I can see OSU doing the same.

Last year wasn't a good indicator of the impact of the penalty. You won't really see that for a couple of years, maybe five or so. They're still playing with Carroll's Criminals out there. Wait until they're playing with the leftovers Kiffin can grab after his schollies are used up, and see where that gets him. He's going to have a hard time convincing top QBs to come play behind a makeshift line of walk-ons. Or maybe he cuts his losses on skill positions, or special teams guys, or in the secondary. That team is going to be sputtering for a while.

Same goes for Ohio State. They'll have nearly the same team this year that they had last year, with reasonable losses to graduation/Tattoo-gate. Five years from now, after another recruiting cycle has passed, is when they're going to be relying on walk-ons. That's your true impact.

On top of that, who do you convince to come coach for you when you're going to hire a guy who's walking in the door down 30-40 scholarships? You're going to have to throw a TON of cash at a coach to get him to come and not play in a bowl game, and recruit against those penalties.

The post-season ban is huge, too. That's another few weeks of practice per year you don't get - and you probably remember how that affected Nebraska when we didn't make bowls during the Callahan era.

I don't think people get how big of a deal this is. OSU is set for a pretty hefty penalty here. This is not remotely like the few months of upheaval you have when you fire a coach. It's like the Callahan Era with zero chance of bowls and 1/3 as good of players. No Suh, no Ganz, no Helu, no BK, because none of these guys are going to play for a team that can't showcase them.

 

[Creed]

I also think the criticism directed at the NCAA back in December for being soft on OSU (allowing players to play in bowl game) and the Cam Newton debacle will come into play. They are going to drop the hammer.

A 4 year bowl ban would suck. I could live with one and possible two - but 4 would absolutely suck. Again, I think they make an example out of OSU.

 

[NUance]

On top of that, who do you convince to come coach for you when you're going to hire a guy who's walking in the door down 30-40 scholarships?

Lane Kiffin may be available again in a year or so. Or Zippy Neuheisel. otoh, Rich Rod would be an intriguing hire. /jk

 

[knapplc]

Again, I think they make an example out of OSU.

I agree, and it sucks.

The good news is, Ohio State is a pillar program not because of the coaches or players alone, but because of their great fan base. That's not going to go away no matter how stiff the penalty, and eventually they'll be back atop the Big Ten and in the national scene. Decades and decades of success won't be erased by five years of mediocrity.

 

[knapplc]

On top of that, who do you convince to come coach for you when you're going to hire a guy who's walking in the door down 30-40 scholarships?

Lane Kiffin may be available again in a year or so. Or Zippy Neuheisel. otoh, Rich Rod would be an intriguing hire. /jk

I think you may be right. I know Kiffin gushed about how USC was his dream job, but that massive salary they threw at him didn't hurt, either. I don't for one second think he won't leave USC if a better offer came along, and I doubt sincerely that he's in it for the long haul there with those sanctions in place. Like I said, he's still playing with Carroll's recruits right now. When he has to rely on the dregs he can get in the face of these sanctions, I won't be shocked if he jumps ship.

 

[walksalone]

I'm torn, Tressel can coach, where Bill Callahan looked like Abe Simpson with a headset.

But the fact that there are gonna be more violations than a crack bus full of underaged mexican hookers, kinda trumps that...

 

[NUance]

I'm torn, Tressel can coach, where Bill Callahan looked like Abe Simpson with a headset.

But the fact that there are gonna be more violations than a crack bus full of underaged mexican hookers, kinda trumps that...

Ha ha! This pretty much sums it all up. :lol:

 

[walksalone]

Looking back, I voted way too soon. It is too soon to tell. We may not know how boned they really are for a couple months, or a couple years.

 

[Enhance]

If tOSU gets hit as hard as USC, then they may end up worse off than I first thought. 10 ships down for each of three years--that's 40% of their scholarships. Almost no way they could stay in the top-20 with those sanctions. If it ends up being half that amount, total of 15 schollies, then they might keep the ship righted. Mostly.

Conclusion: It sucks to be a Buckeye right now.

The one thing OSU has going for it though is that it's the premier program in the state. USC consistently battles with UCLA, Stanford and Cal for the top recruits in state. Add in the fact that USC is down 30 scholarships and that makes recruiting astronomically tougher for USC. Ohio State is still going to grab top in-state recruiting prospects. They probably won't get as many as previous years, but they'll get some.

 

[skersfan]

I have not read the whole thread, so here is my take.

I do not believe this is a big deal. The cover up is by far the worst part of this. And as to the cars, I think it goes on everywhere.. one way or another.

I do not think they will miss the 5-6 players that much if they all leave. They will get a good coach to come in and right the ship. Too much money, winning too long and dominating the Big Ten will help them for future recruits. I really do not think they will lose more than this year to a bowl ban, just to make up for the Sugar.

The head was cut off as far as the NCAA is concerned, more parts may fall, but they will not hold the University at random over it. If Tressel had stayed then possibly so. Coming clean or at least it looks like that, will lessen the blow I think.

My guess is it will affect them this year and maybe next, but after that Urban will have them winning again. My guess the worst thing that will happen is they will not be eligible for the conference championship game. But it will have little affect on their recruiting, SC is not having it that bad and I think SC was a much worse situation.

And that is exactly what I want to happen, I want them strong and a viable opponent as soon as possible. We need them for our program to get the credibility in the conference.

Again I am sorry to see Coach Tressel leave, I think the initial charges are a joke and my guess is it could be found everywhere if the dig deep enough, I know I ended up with a 1964 Poggemeyer jersey years ago.

We need them to bounce back quickly, the conference needs it and so does the NCAA.

 

[skersfan]

I get the SC recuiting information, and they are still getting top kids, just got a five star last week I think. Kiffen will be there as long as he wins, way too much money for the level of coach that he is. And Ohio State will pay that to get Urban or Stoops there. It is about the money right now. Who ever takes it, if name brand will be the highest paid coach in America is my guess.

Kids fromt he Big Ten area do not leave the Big Ten, it may help our recruiting some, but most will belly up to the bar and stand by Ohio State, they are just like Nebraska years ago, you live there you want to play there, it is a very strong fan base that bleeds Ohio State or family wars and goes to Michigan.

 

[Enhance]

The issue with the cars is a good point, skersfan. I would venture to say it happens almost everywhere.

I know a former player had a pretty flashy car when he was here this decade (don't want to get too specific). In no way shape or form am I saying this kid maybe didn't pay for it, or didn't have his parents pay for it, but these types of things will get people to stop and think every now and then.

 

[Scarlet Overkill]

I was one of the only 2 that voted that they are in better shape. Their roster is loaded and will likely continue to be that way. True that Tressel's attempted cover-up is what will bring the hammer down, but there are kids who will still bleed to play on the team, regardless. The only way this will have a huge impact is if the next coaching staff is sub-par.

You know, like Kiffin at USC. They are still pulling in highly regarded kids with the scholarships they have, and if I recall correctly, they "lose" 10 per year, but still allowed to have 75 scholarship players on the roster at any given time. To me, that really boils down to 10 scholarships missing... unless i am way off base. Teams that can pull in the highly regarded players are fine, as long as they get proper coaching. Unfortunately, it takes extra work to convince a kid to come to a bad situation at Nebraska than it does to somewhere else with a "bad situation", like OSU or USC.

Please school me if I have misunderstood the scholarship situation.

 

[Enhance]

I was one of the only 2 that voted that they are in better shape. Their roster is loaded and will likely continue to be that way. True that Tressel's attempted cover-up is what will bring the hammer down, but there are kids who will still bleed to play on the team, regardless. The only way this will have a huge impact is if the next coaching staff is sub-par.

You know, like Kiffin at USC. They are still pulling in highly regarded kids with the scholarships they have, and if I recall correctly, they "lose" 10 per year, but still allowed to have 75 scholarship players on the roster at any given time. To me, that really boils down to 10 scholarships missing... unless i am way off base. Teams that can pull in the highly regarded players are fine, as long as they get proper coaching. Unfortunately, it takes extra work to convince a kid to come to a bad situation at Nebraska than it does to somewhere else with a "bad situation", like OSU or USC.

Please school me if I have misunderstood the scholarship situation.

This might clear it up, because you're right in one sense and wrong in the other.

They lose 30 scholarships over three years, or essentially 10 every year. Because you can only have 85 scholarship players on a normal team, it still boils down to them only being allowed to have 75 total scholarship players every year. Any more than that and they've breached the NCAA sanctions.

You are right that some of these kids will still go to USC, OSU, etc., regardless of the situation. At the same time, however, they now won't be able to get 10 kids they would have theoretically been able to get otherwise.

 

[skersfan]

It just makes them more selective, SC has kids lined up to attend that crap hole. Ohio State will not suffer much and they are in a way better situation than we were. They have not lost every record they ever had in a span of 5 years. We circled the barrel for quite awhile, they will never sniff lower than the top of it is my guess.

I believe the kids that do the crime should suffer, not the ones that show up later, the coach should carry the deed with him where ever he goes, and the NFL should line up and do things right, see Pete Carol.

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I hope they show up here ready to play and I am hoping they are undefeated when they hit memorial stadium.