Jim Hammer

If everyone agreed with the message there would be no need to protest

No, I act as if the end in mind is for the betterment and propping up of a minority people group. Ron Brown's end in mind was legal discrimination against minority people groups. And. Again. Ron Brown is a great dude. Love him, have had plenty of conversations about him. He's absolutely allowed to do whatever he wants with no argument from me, but he presented himself as a representative of the university instead of as Ron Brown the person, the private citizen. Do you agree with the BLM demands which is an end in mind from many of those protesting? I didn't agree with the Black Panthers manifesto, either, a small subset of a much larger civil rights movement. Do you agree with Donald Trump and the end he has in mind? Cause that fu&*#r is selling crap right out of the fascist handbook. Pretty sure there are plenty of people who disagree with the BLM demands and have enough room left over in their brain to disagree with you. You didn't answer the question. The BLM movement is driving the current protests, and to counter the last point LOMS made, there are people who are being harmed by the persistent anti-cop sentiment that is rooted in BLM and these protests. The rhetoric is so heated right now (on both sides). I have never seen more police officers being killed and targeted in my life than in the past couple years, and FBI data shows that blacks are more likely to kill cops than be killed by cops. So suggesting nobody is being harmed by these protests is misleading, as it continues the anti-cop narrative that has been pushed the past few years. Uh. no. http://www.factcheck.org/2016/07/killed-in-the-line-of-duty/ http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/black-people-killed-by-police-america_us_577da633e4b0c590f7e7fb17 Hmm... 5. Blacks are more likely to kill cops than be killed by cops. This is according to FBI data, which also found that 40 percent of cop killers are black. According to Mac Donald, the police officer is 18.5 times more likely to be killed by a black than a cop killing an unarmed black person. Despite the facts, the anti-police rhetoric of Black Lives Matter and their leftist sympathizers have resulted in what Mac Donald calls the "Ferguson Effect," as murders have spiked by 17 percent among the 50 biggest cities in the U.S. as a result of cops being more reluctant to police neighborhoods out of fear of being labeled as racists. Additionally, there have been over twice as many cops victimized by fatal shootings in the first three months of 2016. Anti-police rhetoric has deadly consequences. http://www.dailywire.com/news/7264/5-statistics-you-need-know-about-cops-killing-aaron-bandler# False. Going to the source of their "numbers", in 2015, 258 blacks were killed by police. 123 officers were killed total. Check your math. 258 unarmed blacks who were not trying to attack an officer were killed in 2015? That's not what I have seen on some sites. Also, there are several other valid points in the link I provided, as well as a Post article I provided showing twice as many cops were killed in Q1, 2016 relative to Q1, 2015. This is what you said: False Quit moving the goal posts. It's not false....if you think that it makes no difference if someone attacking the police is armed makes a difference, then it's pointless to discuss this with you any further. Police Officers are here to protect our communities, and face unknown risks everyday on the job. There should never be a situation where someone that is armed should be approaching or attacking a police officer, and the definition of armed is pretty strict as the author points out as it doesn't include situations where an attacker grabs the officers gun to use it as a weapon. Listen... If you are going to use stats to support your argument, use them correctly. You said, and I quote, "Blacks are more likely to kill cops than be killed by cops." That is false and I gave you numbers to prove it. I am pro-cop. I don't want them to die in the line of duty. I understand that the vast majority of cops do a great job. But lately, the times they mess up had been captured on video and are broadcast all over. This is a tiny fraction of all of the interactions that the police are involved with, but some people have died who didn't need to. Those responsible need to be held accountable. And it pisses people off that while they are being investigated, they are on paid leave. I think CK's initial protest which (I think) was strictly about cops killing unarmed black men, was misguided. Although each time is a tragedy, it's not some national epidemic. What he did accomplish and I home what MRI's has done, is call attention to systemic racism in this country. And that is a big problem. I feel what we as a country need to do is to work to end the cycle of poverty in our inner cities and provide better education for those growing up there. We need to create more opportunities for those less fortunate. We need to figure out how to redistribute the wealth in this country. Less going to the top 1% and more going to the bottom 50%.

No, I act as if the end in mind is for the betterment and propping up of a minority people group. Ron Brown's end in mind was legal discrimination against minority people groups. And. Again. Ron Brown is a great dude. Love him, have had plenty of conversations about him. He's absolutely allowed to do whatever he wants with no argument from me, but he presented himself as a representative of the university instead of as Ron Brown the person, the private citizen. Do you agree with the BLM demands which is an end in mind from many of those protesting? I didn't agree with the Black Panthers manifesto, either, a small subset of a much larger civil rights movement. Do you agree with Donald Trump and the end he has in mind? Cause that fu&*#r is selling crap right out of the fascist handbook. Pretty sure there are plenty of people who disagree with the BLM demands and have enough room left over in their brain to disagree with you. You didn't answer the question. The BLM movement is driving the current protests, and to counter the last point LOMS made, there are people who are being harmed by the persistent anti-cop sentiment that is rooted in BLM and these protests. The rhetoric is so heated right now (on both sides). I have never seen more police officers being killed and targeted in my life than in the past couple years, and FBI data shows that blacks are more likely to kill cops than be killed by cops. So suggesting nobody is being harmed by these protests is misleading, as it continues the anti-cop narrative that has been pushed the past few years. Uh. no. http://www.factcheck.org/2016/07/killed-in-the-line-of-duty/ http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/black-people-killed-by-police-america_us_577da633e4b0c590f7e7fb17 Hmm... 5. Blacks are more likely to kill cops than be killed by cops. This is according to FBI data, which also found that 40 percent of cop killers are black. According to Mac Donald, the police officer is 18.5 times more likely to be killed by a black than a cop killing an unarmed black person. Despite the facts, the anti-police rhetoric of Black Lives Matter and their leftist sympathizers have resulted in what Mac Donald calls the "Ferguson Effect," as murders have spiked by 17 percent among the 50 biggest cities in the U.S. as a result of cops being more reluctant to police neighborhoods out of fear of being labeled as racists. Additionally, there have been over twice as many cops victimized by fatal shootings in the first three months of 2016. Anti-police rhetoric has deadly consequences. http://www.dailywire.com/news/7264/5-statistics-you-need-know-about-cops-killing-aaron-bandler# False. Going to the source of their "numbers", in 2015, 258 blacks were killed by police. 123 officers were killed total. Check your math. 258 unarmed blacks who were not trying to attack an officer were killed in 2015? That's not what I have seen on some sites. Also, there are several other valid points in the link I provided, as well as a Post article I provided showing twice as many cops were killed in Q1, 2016 relative to Q1, 2015. This is what you said: False Quit moving the goal posts.

https://www.odmp.org/search/year?year=2015 And a lot of those aren't even shootings. They count all deaths in the line of duty. So actually, 258 black people shot by police and 130 total deaths of police. That means it's twice as likely as a black person to be shot by a cop than it is for a cop to die by any means.

No, I act as if the end in mind is for the betterment and propping up of a minority people group. Ron Brown's end in mind was legal discrimination against minority people groups. And. Again. Ron Brown is a great dude. Love him, have had plenty of conversations about him. He's absolutely allowed to do whatever he wants with no argument from me, but he presented himself as a representative of the university instead of as Ron Brown the person, the private citizen. Do you agree with the BLM demands which is an end in mind from many of those protesting? I didn't agree with the Black Panthers manifesto, either, a small subset of a much larger civil rights movement. Do you agree with Donald Trump and the end he has in mind? Cause that fu&*#r is selling crap right out of the fascist handbook. Pretty sure there are plenty of people who disagree with the BLM demands and have enough room left over in their brain to disagree with you. You didn't answer the question. The BLM movement is driving the current protests, and to counter the last point LOMS made, there are people who are being harmed by the persistent anti-cop sentiment that is rooted in BLM and these protests. The rhetoric is so heated right now (on both sides). I have never seen more police officers being killed and targeted in my life than in the past couple years, and FBI data shows that blacks are more likely to kill cops than be killed by cops. So suggesting nobody is being harmed by these protests is misleading, as it continues the anti-cop narrative that has been pushed the past few years. Uh. no. http://www.factcheck.org/2016/07/killed-in-the-line-of-duty/ http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/black-people-killed-by-police-america_us_577da633e4b0c590f7e7fb17 Hmm... 5. Blacks are more likely to kill cops than be killed by cops. This is according to FBI data, which also found that 40 percent of cop killers are black. According to Mac Donald, the police officer is 18.5 times more likely to be killed by a black than a cop killing an unarmed black person. Despite the facts, the anti-police rhetoric of Black Lives Matter and their leftist sympathizers have resulted in what Mac Donald calls the "Ferguson Effect," as murders have spiked by 17 percent among the 50 biggest cities in the U.S. as a result of cops being more reluctant to police neighborhoods out of fear of being labeled as racists. Additionally, there have been over twice as many cops victimized by fatal shootings in the first three months of 2016. Anti-police rhetoric has deadly consequences. http://www.dailywire.com/news/7264/5-statistics-you-need-know-about-cops-killing-aaron-bandler# False. Going to the source of their "numbers", in 2015, 258 blacks were killed by police. 123 officers were killed total. Check your math.

No, I act as if the end in mind is for the betterment and propping up of a minority people group. Ron Brown's end in mind was legal discrimination against minority people groups. And. Again. Ron Brown is a great dude. Love him, have had plenty of conversations about him. He's absolutely allowed to do whatever he wants with no argument from me, but he presented himself as a representative of the university instead of as Ron Brown the person, the private citizen. Do you agree with the BLM demands which is an end in mind from many of those protesting? I didn't agree with the Black Panthers manifesto, either, a small subset of a much larger civil rights movement. Do you agree with Donald Trump and the end he has in mind? Cause that fu&*#r is selling crap right out of the fascist handbook. Pretty sure there are plenty of people who disagree with the BLM demands and have enough room left over in their brain to disagree with you. You didn't answer the question. The BLM movement is driving the current protests, and to counter the last point LOMS made, there are people who are being harmed by the persistent anti-cop sentiment that is rooted in BLM and these protests. The rhetoric is so heated right now (on both sides). I have never seen more police officers being killed and targeted in my life than in the past couple years, and FBI data shows that blacks are more likely to kill cops than be killed by cops. So suggesting nobody is being harmed by these protests is misleading, as it continues the anti-cop narrative that has been pushed the past few years. Uh. no. http://www.factcheck.org/2016/07/killed-in-the-line-of-duty/ http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/black-people-killed-by-police-america_us_577da633e4b0c590f7e7fb17

God forbid anyone does something that makes white people uncomfortable. I leave my sociopolitical convictions at home in respect of the tradition. Maybe it's time to start wielding them, I see others certainly do. Feel free to post them here. I am very curious as to what sociopolitical stances that you have.

God forbid anyone does something that makes white people uncomfortable.

He expressed here that the country as a whole is oppressing black people. Not that there are a few racist individuals out there. That the country is the reason why there are racist thoughts. The country with a black, and soon maybe female, president, is racist. You cannot generalize a country based on a minority of people, and that is what anthem protestors are doing. For all we know, Kaepernick may have just done this for personal attention because he is not a starter anymore. Judging by his past history, that could very well be the case. http://www.huskerboard.com/index.php?/topic/80494-drop-examples-of-indisputable-proof-that-systemic-racism-still-exists-in-here/ You might want to read a little more instead of just looking at the pictures. There's even a video with a cute girl to explain it to you.

Yes, it would. Provided the player followed the law and got the permits from the city of Lincoln and the school and whoever else might be required to issue a permit. In fact, it would be admirable. That flag is an ever-changing piece of CLOTH that holds no meaning except what people attach to it. I am a native american, a member of an Indian Tribe, the Rosebud Sioux of South Dakota. That flag is a symbol of repression and conquest, of ill deeds and immoral behavior, murder of children and elders. That flag represents the unwelcome conquest of nations and tribes from the East Coast to Hawaii. You stand there in your 'sacred ground' of worship for the US Government and tell me I am wrong. My people live on a reservation in South Dakota and are faced with 90% alcoholism, universal poverty, an unemployment rate of 80% and an average life span of 48. You tell me, you stupid son of a bitch. Is that flag sacred? It killed millions, and the survivors of that massacre in the 1800s and 1900s are still among you. How sacred is that damn piece of cloth? Go to Whiteclay Nebraska and plead your sorry-ass case to a bunch of drunk Indians who hate you. I fought for that damn flag. And I tell you. it is worth the white blood spilled in its name. But it takes no consideration for MY people or the other races that died to preserve the rights you have. We are many and we are invisible. Our contribution has been, will be forgotten. The nazis would most likely have exterminated the remaining native population had the white devil not turned Omaha beach red with their blood to protect said native Americans. Also, and maybe this is just my crazy coming out, but if I'm an alcoholic, blaming someone else for my excessive consumption of alcohol doesn't help much... Not your crazy, your ignorance. So explain to my ignorant self why it's the American flag's fault that, as Flood put it, 90% of Native Americans struggle with alcoholism. http://indianyouth.org/american-indian-life/poverty-cycle Maybe if we had treated them better, alcoholism wouldn't be so rampant.

You have no idea what their argument is and you've decided you don't care because they don't act the way you want them to act. Hopefully their message opens some minds and we can fix the problems with this country.

Yes, it would. Provided the player followed the law and got the permits from the city of Lincoln and the school and whoever else might be required to issue a permit. In fact, it would be admirable. That flag is an ever-changing piece of CLOTH that holds no meaning except what people attach to it. I am a native american, a member of an Indian Tribe, the Rosebud Sioux of South Dakota. That flag is a symbol of repression and conquest, of ill deeds and immoral behavior, murder of children and elders. That flag represents the unwelcome conquest of nations and tribes from the East Coast to Hawaii. You stand there in your 'sacred ground' of worship for the US Government and tell me I am wrong. My people live on a reservation in South Dakota and are faced with 90% alcoholism, universal poverty, an unemployment rate of 80% and an average life span of 48. You tell me, you stupid son of a bitch. Is that flag sacred? It killed millions, and the survivors of that massacre in the 1800s and 1900s are still among you. How sacred is that damn piece of cloth? Go to Whiteclay Nebraska and plead your sorry-ass case to a bunch of drunk Indians who hate you. I fought for that damn flag. And I tell you. it is worth the white blood spilled in its name. But it takes no consideration for MY people or the other races that died to preserve the rights you have. We are many and we are invisible. Our contribution has been, will be forgotten. The nazis would most likely have exterminated the remaining native population had the white devil not turned Omaha beach red with their blood to protect said native Americans. Also, and maybe this is just my crazy coming out, but if I'm an alcoholic, blaming someone else for my excessive consumption of alcohol doesn't help much... Not your crazy, your ignorance.

But you can love something and still disagree with it. Vehemently, even. Parents love their children, but arguing with your parents is almost a rite of passage amongst teens. It's so common as to be a trope on nearly every sitcom & teen movie ever made. Spouses love each other, but fights in marriage are as common as grains of sand on the seashore. Spouses argue vehemently about important and trivial things, make up & move on with life. Love is a wonderful thing, but love doesn't mean never disagreeing, or always seeing eye to eye. You can love something and be mad at it. You can love something and be wounded by it. Let's not pretend that love of country supersedes every other situation. There are times when country doesn't meet the legitimate expectations of our love. In those times, we're justified to demand better. We can even be angry. So does a good parent occasionally say "I disagree with you, I'm not going to do this parenting thing today" "I don't agree, I'm not going to do this American thing today" A good parent listens to their children, and if I had a child who wanted to do something like this, I'd listen to the reasons why they wanted to do it. And if the reasons they gave me were as well thought out and passionate as those put forth as MRI, I'd probably join them.

What is white privilege? https://www.deanza.edu/faculty/lewisjulie/White%20Priviledge%20Unpacking%20the%20Invisible%20Knapsack.pdf

The main argument of many who disagree with you is, name a single way to protest in a way that isn't disrespectful to a ton of people? That is part of the very nature and point of why people protest. Standing on the side of the street. Sure it wouldn't grab much national attention, but I don't get offended by those. As for one that would grab a ton of national attention, think of something unique, like Kaep did. Ok, you've got to be trolling now. Nobody is this dumb.

You say racism is a problem. But you have no idea how persuasive it is. You don't experience it and you have done little to understand. Lots of people in this thread have said they didn't like the protest, but understand they players have the right to do so. When you say the way they protest is just going to make things worse, how? By pushing racists farther away? No matter what they do, they aren't getting through to the close-minded bigots. The protest is for those who don't realize how deeply the system that supports the racism is. It's going to open their eyes and maybe those people will be part of the solution. Maybe young people will grow up to be less racist if they realize what's going on. And in the end, all the bigots will die and this country will be a better place.

Your first sentence is entirely false, and the second sentence in fact does have stats. I made a thread in P&R with indisputable proof of both of these things. I encourage you to go look. Okay, I read it. While those are some pretty good stats, why says that it was 100% because of race? Sure, race may cause some bias, but certainly race is not the only reason. Would that graph look different if this country had no racism? Maybe a bit, but I don't think it would change all that drastically. Now read this: https://www.deanza.edu/faculty/lewisjulie/White%20Priviledge%20Unpacking%20the%20Invisible%20Knapsack.pdf

It's their right to do so as guaranteed by the constitution of the United States. When I took an oath for service it was to defend the constitution of the United States. That means every veteran has a moral obligation to see protests as PROTECTED SPEECH that we should DEFEND. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Armed_Forces_oath_of_enlistment I do not need to be education on the oath, I lived it myself. It is not a protected speech burning a flag. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_v._Johnson

Maybe you should hang out with a more diverse group of people. Everyone I have talked to about it supports MRI. My more conservative friends I'll see tonight may have a different opinion, though. And of course you can't think of a better way to protest, you've never had anything to protest against. Do your text protest at Thanksgiving if your mom forgets to bring the canned cranberry sauce. I have black friends, and friends who are female. None of them support MRI. Once again, just because I don't believe what you do doesn't mean you have to lash out. GBR It's not the differences in belief. It's the denial of facts that pisses me off. I don't care if you believe in God, Allah, the Flying Spaghetti Monster, or Santa Claus. Your beliefs hurt no one. But denying the racism in this country hurts it immeasurably. I cannot count how many times I have said in this thread that there is racism. I have never said there is no racism. My posts go all the way back to page three if you care to do some reading. I gradually get more open about supporting protests, but at no point in this thread do I specifically say there is no racism. I gave you specific examples of racism and you denied them. You have no idea what racism is like in this country. You make no effort to learn about what the protest is about because you don't like the way they did it.

You are getting my ire because you are the only one posting right now and I really could care less if you post less nice. You say your only problem is with the way they protested, but then you go and say that their problems don't exist.

Maybe you should hang out with a more diverse group of people. Everyone I have talked to about it supports MRI. My more conservative friends I'll see tonight may have a different opinion, though. And of course you can't think of a better way to protest, you've never had anything to protest against. Do your text protest at Thanksgiving if your mom forgets to bring the canned cranberry sauce. I have black friends, and friends who are female. None of them support MRI. Once again, just because I don't believe what you do doesn't mean you have to lash out. GBR It's not the differences in belief. It's the denial of facts that pisses me off. I don't care if you believe in God, Allah, the Flying Spaghetti Monster, or Santa Claus. Your beliefs hurt no one. But denying the racism in this country hurts it immeasurably.

It's been 50 years since MLK. How much longer are these people supposed to wait? People live in poverty, are denied housing and jobs, and experience many other indignities that you and I never have to experience. You refuse to even learn about what systemic racism exists in this country because you didn't like the fact that they took a knee during the national anthem. You are what's wrong with this country. Oh great, another person insulting me because I don't believe what they do. They are in poverty because that is what they inherited. That has nothing to do with racism. I hope poverty ends certainly, but you cannot bring poverty into a thread like this. And nobody is denied housing because of race. Jobs, well I don't have stats to take a stance on that, but neither do you. Think about what you are typing before referring to me as "what's wrong with this country. Are you f****g kidding me with the bolded? You seriously have no clue. Donald Trump himself was prosecuted for his racist housing practices. I'll clarify my last statement: It's people like you who are ignorant to what is going in in this country are the problem. Before you post again about how nothing is wrong, educate yourself/

Maybe you should hang out with a more diverse group of people. Everyone I have talked to about it supports MRI. My more conservative friends I'll see tonight may have a different opinion, though. And of course you can't think of a better way to protest, you've never had anything to protest against. Do your text protest at Thanksgiving if your mom forgets to bring the canned cranberry sauce.

It's been 50 years since MLK. How much longer are these people supposed to wait? People live in poverty, are denied housing and jobs, and experience many other indignities that you and I never have to experience. You refuse to even learn about what systemic racism exists in this country because you didn't like the fact that they took a knee during the national anthem. You are what's wrong with this country.