Just got back from a dinner with Osborne..

[NEBRASKANHEAT]

Yeah, clearly you weren't trying to turn this political from the beginning.

 

 

Who said I wasn't trying to turn it political? It was meant as a political post. Is that not ok with you?

[ray233]

Tom Osborne is a Christian and if he's doctrinally sound, he's discussing the 'bigger picture' here. His views about greed, the poor and the like, are right in line with Christian doctrine. Investing personal/spiritual value into people in need, rather than material things is the true value of wealth. Christ teaches us to take care of the widows and the orphans as a priority, not after we get done making our Lexus payments.

 

I think spiritually and as a culture, he's exactly right. Al Qaeda is no threat to our relationship with God; quite the contrary. However, our greed and materialistic values certainly can and will be threats to the fabric of our culture and personal salvation. It's the internal obstacles that truly threaten us in the bigger picture.

 

In the realm of relative 'truth', it all depends on what you believe in. If it's the Trinitarian God of the Holy Bible...I think Osborne is right on track. If it's another god or some 'God' we made up (usually some concoction of generic right/wrong and our own opinions and political views)....he could be way off base.

 

--Cheers

[WYHusk]

 

Quote from Thomas Jefferson says it better than I ever could.

 

"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them."

This thread probably is going to get out of hand, so I'm not hanging around, but TJ did not say that. That is a badly paraphrased version of this:

 

If we can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people, under the pretence of taking care of them, they must become happy.

 

Not quite the same thing.

 

Link

[carlfense]

(sorry mods, I can't find a place where this thread belongs. But feel free to move it.)

 

 

 

Was at a dinner tonight, will spare you the details but T.O. was the speaker.. He touched on so many different issues from Tony Blair, Al Qaeda (sp?)to Lou Holtz to Scott Frost, but the one thing that stuck out to me was..

 

 

If you didn't know better, you'd think he was anti capitalaism- a communist-socialist- slash whatever you people call Democrats these days.

 

 

The vast majority of his speech was about how he grew up believing a mans worth was valued in his character, not in his clothes, or the size of his house, or the car he drove. But how a man's life was valued in the way he treated the poor. The steps they took to share their wealth with the less fortunate etc.etc..

 

 

It was a great speech from a legend. I was honored to hear it. But it got me thinking. If anyone, lets say, the President, made this exact same speech, it would be all over the internet as proof he was trying to destroy America.. Just saying.

Exactly. Much of our politics is dominated by strong personal feelings about the PERSON . . . and not so much about their beliefs. I know people from English classes years ago who would object to George W. Bush saying that we shouldn't let babies starve to death. My own father admits that he is angered just by the sight of Barack Obama. Neither reaction is rational. Unfortunately, rational thought looks more rare each and every day.

[NEBRASKANHEAT]

(sorry mods, I can't find a place where this thread belongs. But feel free to move it.)

 

 

 

Was at a dinner tonight, will spare you the details but T.O. was the speaker.. He touched on so many different issues from Tony Blair, Al Qaeda (sp?)to Lou Holtz to Scott Frost, but the one thing that stuck out to me was..

 

 

If you didn't know better, you'd think he was anti capitalaism- a communist-socialist- slash whatever you people call Democrats these days.

 

 

The vast majority of his speech was about how he grew up believing a mans worth was valued in his character, not in his clothes, or the size of his house, or the car he drove. But how a man's life was valued in the way he treated the poor. The steps they took to share their wealth with the less fortunate etc.etc..

 

 

It was a great speech from a legend. I was honored to hear it. But it got me thinking. If anyone, lets say, the President, made this exact same speech, it would be all over the internet as proof he was trying to destroy America.. Just saying.

Exactly. Much of our politics is dominated by strong personal feelings about the PERSON . . . and not so much about their beliefs. I know people from English classes years ago who would object to George W. Bush saying that we shouldn't let babies starve to death. My own father admits that he is angered just by the sight of Barack Obama. Neither reaction is rational. Unfortunately, rational thought looks more rare each and every day.

 

 

 

 

 

Well said. It just hit me as I was listening to him talk that if I had a cell phone camera and recorded it, then picked out the soundbytes I wanted to and posted them on here under the heading "Obama supporter talks about what's wrong with America" there would be a ton of "pinko liberal, socialist, marxist," type comments..

 

 

Of course now that we know it was Osborne talking, it's just a great man being lead by a higher calling trying to teach accountability to our fellow man..

 

 

(And btw, there were kids in the room. Could you imagine what people would do with a video of Obama talking in front of kids about how greed is what's wrong with this country and how we need to care less about material goods? Glen Beck's head would explode.)

[Malth]

(And btw, there were kids in the room. Could you imagine what people would do with a video of Obama talking in front of kids about how greed is what's wrong with this country and how we need to care less about material goods? Glen Beck's head would explode.)

 

blatant child indoctrination

[Hingle McCringleberry]

(sorry mods, I can't find a place where this thread belongs. But feel free to move it.)

 

 

 

Was at a dinner tonight, will spare you the details but T.O. was the speaker.. He touched on so many different issues from Tony Blair, Al Qaeda (sp?)to Lou Holtz to Scott Frost, but the one thing that stuck out to me was..

 

 

If you didn't know better, you'd think he was anti capitalaism- a communist-socialist- slash whatever you people call Democrats these days.

 

 

The vast majority of his speech was about how he grew up believing a mans worth was valued in his character, not in his clothes, or the size of his house, or the car he drove. But how a man's life was valued in the way he treated the poor. The steps they took to share their wealth with the less fortunate etc.etc..

 

 

It was a great speech from a legend. I was honored to hear it. But it got me thinking. If anyone, lets say, the President, made this exact same speech, it would be all over the internet as proof he was trying to destroy America.. Just saying.

Exactly. Much of our politics is dominated by strong personal feelings about the PERSON . . . and not so much about their beliefs. I know people from English classes years ago who would object to George W. Bush saying that we shouldn't let babies starve to death. My own father admits that he is angered just by the sight of Barack Obama. Neither reaction is rational. Unfortunately, rational thought looks more rare each and every day.

 

 

 

 

 

Well said. It just hit me as I was listening to him talk that if I had a cell phone camera and recorded it, then picked out the soundbytes I wanted to and posted them on here under the heading "Obama supporter talks about what's wrong with America" there would be a ton of "pinko liberal, socialist, marxist," type comments..

 

 

Of course now that we know it was Osborne talking, it's just a great man being lead by a higher calling trying to teach accountability to our fellow man..

 

 

(And btw, there were kids in the room. Could you imagine what people would do with a video of Obama talking in front of kids about how greed is what's wrong with this country and how we need to care less about material goods? Glen Beck's head would explode.)

 

I think the big difference is Obama has made statements that show he favors wealth redistribution and social programs, TO on the other hand, voted, and speaks more towards hard work, and helping your fellow man through charities, Church and volunteerism. These statements are not made in a vacuum, so their political and social views would rightly be applied. I think both Obama and TO are right about greed affecting our country, how we solve the issue is where they differ. Obama favors taking the money from people he thinks have to "much" (how much is to much by the way) and giving it to the poor, while TO seems to think you should willing give it to help others, through local services etc.

[carlfense]

(sorry mods, I can't find a place where this thread belongs. But feel free to move it.)

 

 

 

Was at a dinner tonight, will spare you the details but T.O. was the speaker.. He touched on so many different issues from Tony Blair, Al Qaeda (sp?)to Lou Holtz to Scott Frost, but the one thing that stuck out to me was..

 

 

If you didn't know better, you'd think he was anti capitalaism- a communist-socialist- slash whatever you people call Democrats these days.

 

 

The vast majority of his speech was about how he grew up believing a mans worth was valued in his character, not in his clothes, or the size of his house, or the car he drove. But how a man's life was valued in the way he treated the poor. The steps they took to share their wealth with the less fortunate etc.etc..

 

 

It was a great speech from a legend. I was honored to hear it. But it got me thinking. If anyone, lets say, the President, made this exact same speech, it would be all over the internet as proof he was trying to destroy America.. Just saying.

Exactly. Much of our politics is dominated by strong personal feelings about the PERSON . . . and not so much about their beliefs. I know people from English classes years ago who would object to George W. Bush saying that we shouldn't let babies starve to death. My own father admits that he is angered just by the sight of Barack Obama. Neither reaction is rational. Unfortunately, rational thought looks more rare each and every day.

 

 

 

 

 

Well said. It just hit me as I was listening to him talk that if I had a cell phone camera and recorded it, then picked out the soundbytes I wanted to and posted them on here under the heading "Obama supporter talks about what's wrong with America" there would be a ton of "pinko liberal, socialist, marxist," type comments..

 

 

Of course now that we know it was Osborne talking, it's just a great man being lead by a higher calling trying to teach accountability to our fellow man..

 

 

(And btw, there were kids in the room. Could you imagine what people would do with a video of Obama talking in front of kids about how greed is what's wrong with this country and how we need to care less about material goods? Glen Beck's head would explode.)

 

I think the big difference is Obama has made statements that show he favors wealth redistribution and social programs, TO on the other hand, voted, and speaks more towards hard work, and helping your fellow man through charities, Church and volunteerism. These statements are not made in a vacuum, so their political and social views would rightly be applied. I think both Obama and TO are right about greed affecting our country, how we solve the issue is where they differ. Obama favors taking the money from people he thinks have to "much" (how much is to much by the way) and giving it to the poor, while TO seems to think you should willing give it to help others, through local services etc.

 

Your post isn't entirely accurate. You make it seem like Obama is exceptional in his politics . . . and I hate to break it to people but he is largely left-center. He is not a radical by any means.

 

Any politician who has voted yes on a federal budget in the last 50+ years is in favor of "wealth-redistribution." That's basically what a progressive tax structure is. Take more from those who have more . . . and the poor tend to benefit disproportionately from social programs.

 

It just annoys the hell out of me when people talk like this is a new or radical idea. It's not. Claiming otherwise is a damned lie.

[Hingle McCringleberry]

(sorry mods, I can't find a place where this thread belongs. But feel free to move it.)

 

 

 

Was at a dinner tonight, will spare you the details but T.O. was the speaker.. He touched on so many different issues from Tony Blair, Al Qaeda (sp?)to Lou Holtz to Scott Frost, but the one thing that stuck out to me was..

 

 

If you didn't know better, you'd think he was anti capitalaism- a communist-socialist- slash whatever you people call Democrats these days.

 

 

The vast majority of his speech was about how he grew up believing a mans worth was valued in his character, not in his clothes, or the size of his house, or the car he drove. But how a man's life was valued in the way he treated the poor. The steps they took to share their wealth with the less fortunate etc.etc..

 

 

It was a great speech from a legend. I was honored to hear it. But it got me thinking. If anyone, lets say, the President, made this exact same speech, it would be all over the internet as proof he was trying to destroy America.. Just saying.

Exactly. Much of our politics is dominated by strong personal feelings about the PERSON . . . and not so much about their beliefs. I know people from English classes years ago who would object to George W. Bush saying that we shouldn't let babies starve to death. My own father admits that he is angered just by the sight of Barack Obama. Neither reaction is rational. Unfortunately, rational thought looks more rare each and every day.

 

 

 

 

 

Well said. It just hit me as I was listening to him talk that if I had a cell phone camera and recorded it, then picked out the soundbytes I wanted to and posted them on here under the heading "Obama supporter talks about what's wrong with America" there would be a ton of "pinko liberal, socialist, marxist," type comments..

 

 

Of course now that we know it was Osborne talking, it's just a great man being lead by a higher calling trying to teach accountability to our fellow man..

 

 

(And btw, there were kids in the room. Could you imagine what people would do with a video of Obama talking in front of kids about how greed is what's wrong with this country and how we need to care less about material goods? Glen Beck's head would explode.)

 

I think the big difference is Obama has made statements that show he favors wealth redistribution and social programs, TO on the other hand, voted, and speaks more towards hard work, and helping your fellow man through charities, Church and volunteerism. These statements are not made in a vacuum, so their political and social views would rightly be applied. I think both Obama and TO are right about greed affecting our country, how we solve the issue is where they differ. Obama favors taking the money from people he thinks have to "much" (how much is to much by the way) and giving it to the poor, while TO seems to think you should willing give it to help others, through local services etc.

 

Your post isn't entirely accurate. You make it seem like Obama is exceptional in his politics . . . and I hate to break it to people but he is largely left-center. He is not a radical by any means.

 

Any politician who has voted yes on a federal budget in the last 50+ years is in favor of "wealth-redistribution." That's basically what a progressive tax structure is. Take more from those who have more . . . and the poor tend to benefit disproportionately from social programs.

 

It just annoys the hell out of me when people talk like this is a new or radical idea. It's not. Claiming otherwise is a damned lie.

 

I dont get where you are coming from. I pointed out that Obama and TO have different political and philosophical ideals. Obama has made many statements to show that, so has TO. I never said Obamas ideas where new, they are not. The op was stating if you were to credit TO's quotes to Obama people whould say he is a socialist or something, and I agree. Just as everything W said proved he was nothing more than a warmongering, ultra-conservative, illiterate jack hole, Obama has now been pigeon holed as a quasi Socialist.

[NEBRASKANHEAT]

(sorry mods, I can't find a place where this thread belongs. But feel free to move it.)

 

 

 

Was at a dinner tonight, will spare you the details but T.O. was the speaker.. He touched on so many different issues from Tony Blair, Al Qaeda (sp?)to Lou Holtz to Scott Frost, but the one thing that stuck out to me was..

 

 

If you didn't know better, you'd think he was anti capitalaism- a communist-socialist- slash whatever you people call Democrats these days.

 

 

The vast majority of his speech was about how he grew up believing a mans worth was valued in his character, not in his clothes, or the size of his house, or the car he drove. But how a man's life was valued in the way he treated the poor. The steps they took to share their wealth with the less fortunate etc.etc..

 

 

It was a great speech from a legend. I was honored to hear it. But it got me thinking. If anyone, lets say, the President, made this exact same speech, it would be all over the internet as proof he was trying to destroy America.. Just saying.

Exactly. Much of our politics is dominated by strong personal feelings about the PERSON . . . and not so much about their beliefs. I know people from English classes years ago who would object to George W. Bush saying that we shouldn't let babies starve to death. My own father admits that he is angered just by the sight of Barack Obama. Neither reaction is rational. Unfortunately, rational thought looks more rare each and every day.

 

 

 

 

 

Well said. It just hit me as I was listening to him talk that if I had a cell phone camera and recorded it, then picked out the soundbytes I wanted to and posted them on here under the heading "Obama supporter talks about what's wrong with America" there would be a ton of "pinko liberal, socialist, marxist," type comments..

 

 

Of course now that we know it was Osborne talking, it's just a great man being lead by a higher calling trying to teach accountability to our fellow man..

 

 

(And btw, there were kids in the room. Could you imagine what people would do with a video of Obama talking in front of kids about how greed is what's wrong with this country and how we need to care less about material goods? Glen Beck's head would explode.)

 

I think the big difference is Obama has made statements that show he favors wealth redistribution and social programs, TO on the other hand, voted, and speaks more towards hard work, and helping your fellow man through charities, Church and volunteerism. These statements are not made in a vacuum, so their political and social views would rightly be applied. I think both Obama and TO are right about greed affecting our country, how we solve the issue is where they differ. Obama favors taking the money from people he thinks have to "much" (how much is to much by the way) and giving it to the poor, while TO seems to think you should willing give it to help others, through local services etc.

 

Your post isn't entirely accurate. You make it seem like Obama is exceptional in his politics . . . and I hate to break it to people but he is largely left-center. He is not a radical by any means.

 

Any politician who has voted yes on a federal budget in the last 50+ years is in favor of "wealth-redistribution." That's basically what a progressive tax structure is. Take more from those who have more . . . and the poor tend to benefit disproportionately from social programs.

 

It just annoys the hell out of me when people talk like this is a new or radical idea. It's not. Claiming otherwise is a damned lie.

 

I dont get where you are coming from. I pointed out that Obama and TO have different political and philosophical ideals. Obama has made many statements to show that, so has TO. I never said Obamas ideas where new, they are not. The op was stating if you were to credit TO's quotes to Obama people whould say he is a socialist or something, and I agree. Just as everything W said proved he was nothing more than a warmongering, ultra-conservative, illiterate jack hole, Obama has now been pigeon holed as a quasi Socialist.

 

 

 

Fair enough. Really, I was more trying to point out how the modern "sound byte" and as you say "pigeon holed" media can make anything look anti or pro American.

 

 

I'm not Obama groupie and didn't like Bush either. I just can't stand the way either side can take someones words and manipulate them totally out of context to favor their hate for the speaker...

 

 

I don't pretend to be an economics proffesor and really don't have any clue on the best way to tax-redistribute or generally help this economy. I've heard some really smart guys with some really serious degrees argue on both sides. Who am I to say who's right?

 

I do know though that neither "side" really has fixing the situation as a priority and are more than happy to watch us all burn if it means they can get elected by promosing to pee on us and put the fire out.