Pedersen

[StuckinChicago]

Indiana, please tell me what you think that facts are, because I keep giving what most would call facts, but apparantly you dont consider them to be. I told you how recruiting services, both very recongnizable ones, rated the players we recruited, i mentioned what sports center, a nationally recognized tv station, says all of the time, I mentioned what schools specifically had made coaching changes, passing a very available Frank, who was searching for a job, by. I have given the name of specific schools that have been successful recently, and if you dont believe me, please refer to earth, and have said that they can both run and pass the ball. If you dont believe me on that one, see last reference. I have given the name of specific Nebraska recruits who have done well. I have looked up and informed you of what "highly regarded recruits" that you mentioned were rated, and I have said that Devaney took a poor football team with no talent or tradition and taken them to the promise land in eleven years of coaching. Stat- championships before Devaney-0 After-2. I have said that frank took a team loaded with talent and tradition, and made them a mediocre program. Stat- championships in the 4 years before frank-3 after-0. I have given a specific stat, 16-10 that says that Frank lost lots of games after he lost TO's recruits. I have mentioned that the big twelve north was weak and that we played a weak schedule in franks last year. we played a struggling penn state team that did not make a bowl. we played utah state, we played a relatively tough southern miss. i guess that was Franks "big win" we played a texas A&M that struggled. We played an Oklahoma State team that underacheived. We got beat to a pulp by Texas, Kansas State at home, and a decent but not great missouri team. We then preceded to beat up on the cannon fodder that is the rest of the big twelve north, who couldnt beat a single big twelve south team except baylor this year. Facts, Facts, Facts.

[indianahusker]

Indiana, please tell me what you think that facts are, because I keep giving what most would call facts, but apparantly you dont consider them to be.

 

This is conjecture. An example of a non-fact. You have no numbers to back it up. Your statement gives no specifics. Using terms like "what most people would call" but you have nothing to back that up.

 

I told you how recruiting services, both very recongnizable ones, rated the players we recruited,

No, you quoted one rating of one player. We both agree then, that Frank had several top-25 classes?

i mentioned what sports center, a nationally recognized tv station, says all of the time,

This is heresay. I didn't hear some of these things. That doesn't mean they didn't happen. Perhaps if you give me the times when they happened or articles about them...But when I post things, I don't just say "he said, she said". I quote the exact facts. You don't.

 

I mentioned what schools specifically had made coaching changes, passing a very available Frank, who was searching for a job, by. I have given the name of specific schools that have been successful recently, and if you dont believe me, please refer to earth, and have said that they can both run and pass the ball. If you dont believe me on that one, see last reference.

My high school had an opening last year, but they didn't pick me. This proves nothing to me, unless you can prove to me they actively said "We don't want Frank Solich". I suppose it's semantics again. And I think we all know what schools have been successful lately, so there's no news there.

 

I have given the name of specific Nebraska recruits who have done well.

I must've missed that one.

 

I have looked up and informed you of what "highly regarded recruits" that you mentioned were rated,

Generally "recruits" means more than one...you only provided one.

 

and I have said that Devaney took a poor football team with no talent or tradition and taken them to the promise land in eleven years of coaching.

A valid point.

 

Stat- championships before Devaney-0 After-2.

Let's compare apples to apples...Stat--Solich in his first 6 years--58 wins. Devaney in his first 6 years--53 wins (although Devaney had a better winning percentage, I'll give ya that). Stat--Solich's last year 9-3, Devaney 6-4. Devaney went on to win 2 championships...after two 6-4 years. He made changes and was successful. Solich made changes, went from 7-7 to 9-3 after his changes and was fired. I should think even a third grader would be able to see the parallels.

 

 

I have said that frank took a team loaded with talent and tradition, and made them a mediocre program. Stat- championships in the 4 years before frank-3 after-0.

Stat--National championships in the six years after Devaney-0. National championships 20 years after Devaney--0. With your logic NU shoulda fired TO long before he retired.

 

I have given a specific stat, 16-10 that says that Frank lost lots of games after he lost TO's recruits.

Devaney went 21-10 the three years after he lost Jennings' recruits

 

I have mentioned that the big twelve north was weak and that we played a weak schedule in franks last year. we played a struggling penn state team that did not make a bowl. we played utah state, we played a relatively tough southern miss. i guess that was Franks "big win" we played a texas A&M that struggled. We played an Oklahoma State team that underacheived. We got beat to a pulp by Texas, Kansas State at home, and a decent but not great missouri team. We then preceded to beat up on the cannon fodder that is the rest of the big twelve north, who couldnt beat a single big twelve south team except baylor this year.

Fact--NU went 5-6 with an even easier schedule last fall. Perhaps you would rather have that than 9-3. Osborne had a handful of 9-3 seasons where he couldn't beat good teams on his schedule, even mediocre ones. But he only lost to a team with a losing record ONCE in his career...I'll bet you were someone calling for TO's head when he couldn't beat OU. Probably would have signed the petition to fire Devaney after he went 6-4 two years in a row, too.

 

I guess the point I'm making is, I am quoting numbers, not heresay. You do quote some numbers, but not very darn many. Any way you try to spin this, Frank did not deserve the treatment he got, IMO, and there are a LOT of people that think that...sorry, I quoted heresay.

[DaveH]

Fact--NU went 5-6 with an even easier schedule last fall.

I don't know if that is a fact. It's debatable and depends on who you ask as to the strength of a schedule. Me, I don't think that the 04 schedule was easier than 03.

[StuckinChicago]

Semantics!? What, so are you saying that you were a viable candidated for your high schools coaching job? Are you saying that these schools, by not saying we dont want Frank Solich, in some way means that Solich was the best coach out there, but they wanted the second best. He coaches at OHIO!!!!!!!! I told you that all of those recruits you listed in a prior agrument, the one where you said Josh Mueller was the ninth rated tight end, and listed a bunch of other ones, were three star recruits, with a couple of exceptions, and that their position rankings were evidence of a weak recruiting year at that position, not how good they are. How can you not understand that Devaney took a team that had three wins the year before he got there, and got consistantly BETTER! where as Frank's teams got consistantly WORSE. Its like you dont understand simple concepts. Devaney took over what is the equivelent of a Kansas right now, and Solich took over fricken national champions!!!!! It's not the same!!!!! These are simple elementry school patterns. And I cannot believe you want me to give you the specific Sports Center where they mention schools pursuing coaches. Do you live in a hole or something.

[indianahusker]

Semantics!? What, so are you saying that you were a viable candidated for your high schools coaching job? Are you saying that these schools, by not saying we dont want Frank Solich, in some way means that Solich was the best coach out there, but they wanted the second best.

Actually, yes I was viableand no, I wasn't saying that. If you would re-read my post, you would see that I never said that. There are certainly circumstances that happen every day at every school. Until you are or have been an administrator at a DI school, your opinion is just that, an opinion. Stop stating your opinion as fact. A third grader knows the difference there.

 

He coaches at OHIO!!!!!!!! I told you that all of those recruits you listed in a prior agrument, the one where you said Josh Mueller was the ninth rated tight end, and listed a bunch of other ones, were three star recruits, with a couple of exceptions, and that their position rankings were evidence of a weak recruiting year at that position, not how good they are.

Um, no, you only said Joe Dailey was a three star...unless I missed it, which may have happened. Again, saying it was a weak year is your opinion. NOT a fact. Unless you are a college scout, your opinion is just that...an OPINION. Maybe if you go to dictionary.com, it may help

 

How can you not understand that Devaney took a team that had three wins the year before he got there, and got consistantly BETTER!

Going from 9-2 in 1967 to 6-4 in '68 and 6-4 in '69 was getting better? Hmmm...this argument continues to leak

 

where as Frank's teams got consistantly WORSE.

They did? 9-4 his first year to 12-1 his second was worse? 7-7 to 9-3 is getting worse? A KINDERGARTNER knows that one.

 

Its like you dont understand simple concepts. Devaney took over what is the equivelent of a Kansas right now, and Solich took over fricken national champions!!!!! It's not the same!!!!!

If you would read my post instead of getting so upset, you would see that I conceded that point. However, with your logic, NU should have fired TO...he took over a program that had won two national championships in three years, and didn't win another one for 24 years.

 

These are simple elementry school patterns.

Then why can't you see them? Dude, you gotta stop getting so mad at my posts. I doubt I'm going to change your mind, and you certainly aren't going to change mine. Again, though, you use heresay, I use numbers and facts.

 

And I cannot believe you want me to give you the specific Sports Center where they mention schools pursuing coaches. Do you live in a hole or something.

As a matter of fact, it seems like it! I live in Muncie, IN, which is just like a hole. My point about the SportsCenter thing is that I didn't hear it. Re-read my post. I said that doesn't mean it didn't happen. I just didn't hear it, so to me it was hearsay.

 

Do you not see how I take your statements, and refute them with NUMBERS and FACTS? I don't make generalizations...the times you have actually backed up your opinion with fact, I have conceded the point. However, those have been very few and far between. I think like someone else said on another thread...You're like two teepees...too tense! It ain't that serious, dude! It's football!

[StuckinChicago]

Lol..... Facts Indiana. I laugh. You make the most rediculus arguments I have ever heard. You make sweeping broad generalizations such as that Solich is comparable to Devaney, and when I give you facts, you call it hearsay. I dont have to be a division 1 coach or administrator, or whatever you want me to be to ask simple questions to myself, such as why didnt Florida, or South Carolina, or Washington, or Notre Dame, or Arizona, or Army hire Frank. It is not hearsay or conjecture or opinion to state that these places passed on Frank in favor of someone they thought was better. What, are you asking me to believe that these programs dont hire the best possible coach, in their opinion. What criteria do you think they hire on, an anti-Frank criteria, because that is what you are saying.

[indianahusker]

And now a word from our sponsor:

 

Go Big Red! We're all on the same side here! We all want the same thing!

 

Now back to our regularly scheduled program:

 

I'm not going to argue with you anymore. You're right. I'm right. We are both entitled to our opinions. I'm glad you're a passionate fan!!! I really respect that.

So where do we go from here? We agree to disagree, and both look forward to the future. I think we can be friends, even though I'm kind of a jerk!

I think the Huskers will win it all inside of 5 years!!!!!

[IndyHusker]

DaveH Posted on May 17 2005, 01:21 PM

  QUOTE (indianahusker @ May 17 2005, 02:17 PM)

Fact--NU went 5-6 with an even easier schedule last fall. 

 

 

I don't know if that is a fact. It's debatable and depends on who you ask as to the strength of a schedule. Me, I don't think that the 04 schedule was easier than 03. 

 

i personally dont think NU had really strong schedules even when TO was there, never really has always seemed like they didnt get any real competition till the middle of the season, i.e. big 8, big 12. i remeber that being a big deal when they were being ranked, hearing people on ESPN talk about how they couldnt play with the FSU's, Miami's and UF teams. please dont ask me for facts, cause im just wingin it, and i think that whole scene is gettin kinda played out to the max...........