Perhaps the most glaring problem of all

[NUpolo8]

Cedeing the argument that teams like OU have incredibly better athletes and more talent than NU (and its getting pretty hard to argue otherwise), there are many things that simply should not be happening 10 weeks into the season.

 

I have never seen a D-1 school with a defense where so many players line up in the wrong spot, sprint as fast as they can across the field to recover from a shift, or miss so many assignments. This, as a best-case scenario, so far, ends with a burned TO and Pelini showing his swearing skills.

 

Also, last night there were 8 penalties again. Are these the lumps of a new coaching staff or are these players just that bad and that dim? If its the latter, I question how they could even make use of a free education if they can't the simple things right.

[go_huskers99]

That is the point guys, it does have to do with talent. It is not a coaching problem.

 

This coach has had fantastic defenses during his tours at Oklahoma and LSU. He has been in charge of them and made them work.

 

Talent is not limited to on field athletic ability. It is the ability to learn, adapt and understand their rolls, their limits. There is something missing there is no question, but it is not coaching in my mind.

 

If you were take all physical abilities into consideration, my guess is that we are on par with Baylor, Texas A&M, Colorado, Iowa State. Not close to Oklahoma, Texas, Tech, OK State, Missouri. Closer to Kansas than we think.

 

We are seeing the same problems we saw with the last defensive staff. Now we have had two defensive ideas and we are failing against top competition. We can blame the past staff, but it is becoming obvious that it was not just the past staffs problems. This is a talent issue period. You can only give them the tools, if they can not use them, well we see what is happening.

 

I think he summed it up pretty well

[huskergame]

Cedeing the argument that teams like OU have incredibly better athletes and more talent than NU (and its getting pretty hard to argue otherwise), there are many things that simply should not be happening 10 weeks into the season.

 

I have never seen a D-1 school with a defense where so many players line up in the wrong spot, sprint as fast as they can across the field to recover from a shift, or miss so many assignments. This, as a best-case scenario, so far, ends with a burned TO and Pelini showing his swearing skills.

 

Also, last night there were 8 penalties again. Are these the lumps of a new coaching staff or are these players just that bad and that dim? If its the latter, I question how they could even make use of a free education if they can't the simple things right.

I Fully agree that they are not playing that great at week 10. But WHO'S PLAYERS ARE THEY??? THEY ARE NOT BO'S, give him a couple of years and everything will be fine.

[zoogs]

WHOSE PLAYERS ARE THEY?

 

Bo's. Nebraska's. Ours.

 

Seriously. Lamest argument every. I'm sorry, but that's what it is. Wah wah, they're not "his" guys.

 

Things will take time but all these players are Huskers.

[Touchdown Tommie]

WHOSE PLAYERS ARE THEY?

 

Bo's. Nebraska's. Ours.

 

Seriously. Lamest argument every. I'm sorry, but that's what it is. Wah wah, they're not "his" guys.

 

Things will take time but all these players are Huskers.

 

They may be his players, but they are not his players for the system. There is no way you can expect O'Hanlon to have the speed that "his"players had at OU or LSU....it is just not going to happen. There are others than O'Hanlon, but he is the first that comes to mind.

You are right that they play for Nebraska and I hope they feel a little embarrassed by what happened last night, but they better get over it so they can win at least two games to become bowl eligible....that would be feat in itself for Bo.

[TMul]

This is a culmination effect on the defensive side.

 

New System/New Coaching staff.

Lack of speed/depth.

Playing 3-4 walk ons on defense that have never sniffed game activity prior (not bagging on walk ons, but they're not playing new mexico state).

Playing against the rush huddle offenses vs. OU/Mizzou/TT had their heads spinning/can't even line up for a snap. (In fact we played with 10 guys at the goal line vs. OU on the opening drive.)

This isn't playing defense against the Big 10, but playing against the most powerful offensive conference in the NCAA.

Practicing against big slow players on the offensive side of the ball. (Doesn't get you better)

 

And Yes, these are Pelini's players. He would never have it any other way. Like the rest of you, I get sick of seeing posts like this. Now maybe he didn't know exactly what he signed up for, but he's finding out now. The million dollar question is what does he do to fix both sides of the ball?? Yes I said both sides.

[melscott62]

guys this is a process. its not uncommon for players to struggle with a new system after a coaching change.

 

look at ou and alabama. 2 programs with similar tradition and similar problems. both teams brought in defensive minded coaches and both team were very mediocre in year one.

 

first OU

 

stoops took over a program that was totally trashed and went a very respectable 7-5 a year after being 5-6(sounds familiar huh?) http://www.gnextinc.com/ou/record9599.html

 

the next year they go undefeated.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Stoops 7-5 to 12-0. it just took time for stoops to get the kids to totally understand what he was trying to do.

 

same with alabama. he took over a team that was 6-7, http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/teams/schedu...3&year=2006 and went 6-6(including loosing the last 4 regular season games) they won the bowl game for a 7-6 year http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/teams/schedu...3&year=2007

 

now look how well they are playing this year in sabans 2nd year.

 

so what the point of all of this? 2 very good coaches taking over situations very similar to ours and they had 1st years very similar to Bo's. and they very next year with minimal additions they were much much better. it takes some time to get things turned around even with great coaching. keep in mind the examples I post are BEST CASE SCENARIOS!! can we TRY to be patient?

[TMul]

guys this is a process. its not uncommon for players to struggle with a new system after a coaching change.

 

look at ou and alabama. 2 programs with similar tradition and similar problems. both teams brought in defensive minded coaches and both team were very mediocre in year one.

 

first OU

 

stoops took over a program that was totally trashed and went a very respectable 7-5 a year after being 5-6(sounds familiar huh?) http://www.gnextinc.com/ou/record9599.html

 

the next year they go undefeated.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Stoops 7-5 to 12-0. it just took time for stoops to get the kids to totally understand what he was trying to do.

 

same with alabama. he took over a team that was 6-7, http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/teams/schedu...3&year=2006 and went 6-6(including loosing the last 4 regular season games) they won the bowl game for a 7-6 year http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/teams/schedu...3&year=2007

 

now look how well they are playing this year in sabans 2nd year.

 

so what the point of all of this? 2 very good coaches taking over situations very similar to ours and they had 1st years very similar to Bo's. and they very next year with minimal additions they were much much better. it takes some time to get things turned around even with great coaching. keep in mind the examples I post are BEST CASE SCENARIOS!! can we TRY to be patient?

 

I don't know quite as much about the Alabama Saban thing, but trying to compare Pelini/Stoops scenario is very dangerous. It's grasping at straws to say the least and HOPING. Hell I hope so to, BUT Stoops didn't do that all by him self. He hired a helluva staff with him (you don't win a MNC in 2 years without that and great talent left behind). Mangino, Leach, Stoops Brothers, all HCs now.

 

I'm not as worried about Pelini as I am about the staff he brought in with him/retained. Did he hire the best possible coaches/recruiters he could or were there too many buddy hires that will get you canned fast?? NU/Pelini needs the best possible staff available to get back. The best/most realistic offense for NU. Anything less and NU won't.

 

We all saw it with McCartney at Colorado and their MNC team. Loaded staff.

 

KSU with Snyder-CRAZY loaded staff to pull off what they did.

 

OU/Stoops and his staff.

[BigT2454]

guys this is a process. its not uncommon for players to struggle with a new system after a coaching change.

 

look at ou and alabama. 2 programs with similar tradition and similar problems. both teams brought in defensive minded coaches and both team were very mediocre in year one.

 

first OU

 

stoops took over a program that was totally trashed and went a very respectable 7-5 a year after being 5-6(sounds familiar huh?) http://www.gnextinc.com/ou/record9599.html

 

the next year they go undefeated.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Stoops 7-5 to 12-0. it just took time for stoops to get the kids to totally understand what he was trying to do.

 

same with alabama. he took over a team that was 6-7, http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/teams/schedu...3&year=2006 and went 6-6(including loosing the last 4 regular season games) they won the bowl game for a 7-6 year http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/teams/schedu...3&year=2007

 

now look how well they are playing this year in sabans 2nd year.

 

so what the point of all of this? 2 very good coaches taking over situations very similar to ours and they had 1st years very similar to Bo's. and they very next year with minimal additions they were much much better. it takes some time to get things turned around even with great coaching. keep in mind the examples I post are BEST CASE SCENARIOS!! can we TRY to be patient?

[melscott62]

guys this is a process. its not uncommon for players to struggle with a new system after a coaching change.

 

look at ou and alabama. 2 programs with similar tradition and similar problems. both teams brought in defensive minded coaches and both team were very mediocre in year one.

 

first OU

 

stoops took over a program that was totally trashed and went a very respectable 7-5 a year after being 5-6(sounds familiar huh?) http://www.gnextinc.com/ou/record9599.html

 

the next year they go undefeated.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Stoops 7-5 to 12-0. it just took time for stoops to get the kids to totally understand what he was trying to do.

 

same with alabama. he took over a team that was 6-7, http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/teams/schedu...3&year=2006 and went 6-6(including loosing the last 4 regular season games) they won the bowl game for a 7-6 year http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/teams/schedu...3&year=2007

 

now look how well they are playing this year in sabans 2nd year.

 

so what the point of all of this? 2 very good coaches taking over situations very similar to ours and they had 1st years very similar to Bo's. and they very next year with minimal additions they were much much better. it takes some time to get things turned around even with great coaching. keep in mind the examples I post are BEST CASE SCENARIOS!! can we TRY to be patient?

 

I don't know quite as much about the Alabama Saban thing, but trying to compare Pelini/Stoops scenario is very dangerous. It's grasping at straws to say the least and HOPING. Hell I hope so to, BUT Stoops didn't do that all by him self. He hired a helluva staff with him (you don't win a MNC in 2 years without that and great talent left behind). Mangino, Leach, Stoops Brothers, all HCs now.

 

I'm not as worried about Pelini as I am about the staff he brought in with him/retained. Did he hire the best possible coaches/recruiters he could or were there too many buddy hires that will get you canned fast?? NU/Pelini needs the best possible staff available to get back. The best/most realistic offense for NU. Anything less and NU won't.

 

We all saw it with McCartney at Colorado and their MNC team. Loaded staff.

 

KSU with Snyder-CRAZY loaded staff to pull off what they did.

 

OU/Stoops and his staff.

well I think you missed my point totally. as I said this is a best case scenario...

 

as for staffs.... I think that ours is pretty good. Our OC was good enough to get offered by saben. our WR/TE coach was part of a staff better than any you have mentioned before this one. 2 of our defensive coaches came from an LSU program coming off a national title, and carl pelini has roots in that kstate program you just mentioned. cotton, who many consider the weak link, has a great playing background and really has a decent coaching one http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barney_Cotton.

 

 

anyway my point is that even the best of turn around stories (stoops and saban) had their troubles in their first year... so why would we expect anything different?

[TMul]

Yes, I did miss your point and yes, that is the best case scenario. I was just stating that IMO NU needs that type of coaching staff to have success. Anything less won't cut it for Pelini. He needs the entire staff.

 

Still IMO if Snyder had the staff loyalty like TO did back in the day, I guarantee KSU has an MNC by now. It may piss some huskers off, The Wizard had the greatest coaching staff ever assembled in college football. You don't do something like that at K-State without that. Hopefully Pelini has something close to that??

[melscott62]

Yes, I did miss your point and yes, that is the best case scenario. I was just stating that IMO NU needs that type of coaching staff to have success. Anything less won't cut it for Pelini. He needs the entire staff.

 

Still IMO if Snyder had the staff loyalty like TO did back in the day, I guarantee KSU has an MNC by now. It may piss some huskers off, The Wizard had the greatest coaching staff ever assembled in college football. You don't do something like that at K-State without that. Hopefully Pelini has something close to that??

 

 

I'd say to's was better simply because they did stay together. KSU success was great, but to me as big of an accomplishment as it was what TO did with this school (esp in the 90's) is nothing short of amazing. I seriously doubt we will ever see a 5 year period that one team was so dominant

[TMul]

Yes, I did miss your point and yes, that is the best case scenario. I was just stating that IMO NU needs that type of coaching staff to have success. Anything less won't cut it for Pelini. He needs the entire staff.

 

Still IMO if Snyder had the staff loyalty like TO did back in the day, I guarantee KSU has an MNC by now. It may piss some huskers off, The Wizard had the greatest coaching staff ever assembled in college football. You don't do something like that at K-State without that. Hopefully Pelini has something close to that??

 

 

I'd say to's was better simply because they did stay together. KSU success was great, but to me as big of an accomplishment as it was what TO did with this school (esp in the 90's) is nothing short of amazing. I seriously doubt we will ever see a 5 year period that one team was so dominant

 

 

Isn't USC getting very, very close to that?? But yes I agree.

 

My glory years was in the 90s; I grew up in high school and college from 1991-1999 so I am especially spoiled rotten and I'm now in my 30s and hate to live in the Glory Days all the time.

[melscott62]

Yes, I did miss your point and yes, that is the best case scenario. I was just stating that IMO NU needs that type of coaching staff to have success. Anything less won't cut it for Pelini. He needs the entire staff.

 

Still IMO if Snyder had the staff loyalty like TO did back in the day, I guarantee KSU has an MNC by now. It may piss some huskers off, The Wizard had the greatest coaching staff ever assembled in college football. You don't do something like that at K-State without that. Hopefully Pelini has something close to that??

 

 

I'd say to's was better simply because they did stay together. KSU success was great, but to me as big of an accomplishment as it was what TO did with this school (esp in the 90's) is nothing short of amazing. I seriously doubt we will ever see a 5 year period that one team was so dominant

 

 

Isn't USC getting very, very close to that?? But yes I agree.

 

My glory years was in the 90s; I grew up in high school and college from 1991-1999 so I am especially spoiled rotten and I'm now in my 30s and hate to live in the Glory Days all the time.

 

 

somewhat. they are a title off.... thats a big deal. we were a blown clip and a crazy game against texas away from 5 in a row....

[SkullandBones]

That is the point guys, it does have to do with talent. It is not a coaching problem.

 

This coach has had fantastic defenses during his tours at Oklahoma and LSU. He has been in charge of them and made them work.

 

Talent is not limited to on field athletic ability. It is the ability to learn, adapt and understand their rolls, their limits. There is something missing there is no question, but it is not coaching in my mind.

 

If you were take all physical abilities into consideration, my guess is that we are on par with Baylor, Texas A&M, Colorado, Iowa State. Not close to Oklahoma, Texas, Tech, OK State, Missouri. Closer to Kansas than we think.

 

We are seeing the same problems we saw with the last defensive staff. Now we have had two defensive ideas and we are failing against top competition. We can blame the past staff, but it is becoming obvious that it was not just the past staffs problems. This is a talent issue period. You can only give them the tools, if they can not use them, well we see what is happening.

 

I think he summed it up pretty well

 

And down in Lubbock we hired some talent right? Otherwise, our boys don't have a chance, is that what I heard? Please.