Bowl Plan

[RedDenver]

Let the NFL be the sad football league that doesn't try to win them all - I'm looking at you Indianapolis!!! College football is about the game itself - and trying to win that game. If NU ever played not to win, for any reason, I'd want everybody from the AD on down fired. Spring and fall practice are for sorting out the QB position. The games are for winning. All of my thoughts can best be summed up by:

 

"Not the victory but the action; Not the goal but the game; In the deed the glory"

[zoogs]

Exactly, General Blackshirt.

 

I'm almost concerned the coaches don't feel this is a must-win game, though. They are certainly downplaying it.

 

Bo chewed his own brother's ass for a td at the end of the CU game that had no impact on the outcome of the game. I find it real hard believe this guy considers the bowl an exhibition-game. He hates to lose.

 

haha, his head nearly popped off as they walked off the field.

 

yeah! But then we got Bo saying things like it doesn't really matter what the outcome of the game is, though a W would be good for us in terms of momentum...Watson talking about creating competition for the future...it's probably just word games.

[zoogs]

 

Green and Lee however has been a much tighter battle. They're essentially equal other than the fact that Lee has had more experience and they use him to manage the game. Since the coaches are obviously flirting with the idea of putting him into the game, that means they think he can do just as good if not better than Lee. Hence, play Green the whole game and see what he can do (unless he royally fu#*$ up of course) to give him the experience that Lee has had.

 

Dude, Green and Lee are "essentially equal" only in your mind.

 

Coaches looked to Green for a spark midseason, then pulled him as soon as the going got tough. Talked about how they worked Green into the gameplan for several games, but never got around to putting him in because Lee gave us the best chance to win in games that turned out to be tight.

 

And if you think Lee can't run it, you haven't been paying attention. Lee is faster AND shiftier than Green, who needs time to get into open space before he can become a running threat at all. Green may be more of a runner based on mentality, but you think the offense is going to be affording him those opportunities against a quality team?

 

I know people don't like Lee for what happened this year, but flip the roles and have Green struggle and start, and it'd be just the opposite. Just because something isn't very good doesn't mean every other possible alternative is better. Green has shown only flashes of potential, and Lee is still head-and-shoulders above Green in terms of giving us a chance to win. But I guess you still maintain a victory in this game is secondary to getting a potential future quarterback some experience.

 

Neither Lee or Green deserves to be called very good at this point. But like Blackshirt said, Lee is better now. Why can't he be better next year? Why do people assume Cody is just going to make a quantum leap in understanding and ability?

 

To JTrain, it's true we've shown very little rhythm for the most part this year. But in any offense, the GOAL is to establish a rhythm. Without it, good luck winning any games. It's difficult enough for us to establish rhythm, as is. By rotating QBs around freely, it only makes it tons harder to do. The only reason to rotate a QB in is in hopes of finding a spark (or to keep the starter from having a mental breakdown). We've tried that (both) with Green this year, and he hasn't shown he can give us that spark. Why throw away any chance we have of getting some rhythm started?

 

So we'd be putting Green in only just to get his feet wet, which is all well and good when we're pounding a Sun Belt opponent into garbage time, but when we're trying to win an important bowl game against a solid Pac-10 opponent, I just want them to play to win the game.

 

*To add, it's an exceedingly tough pill to swallow, how lousy our offensive output has been this year. The regression and injuries to the O-line, the hurt RBs, lazy and incapable WRs, and out-of-it QB play. But that's what we have to accept and can only hope for better parts next year, instead of trying to believe that some other offensive scheme would have made these same guys into an explosive offense or something.

[General Blackshirt]

I said absolutely nothing about Suh or Baker. At all. So really, in the end, you're arguing with a quote you yourself wrote. Let that sink in a minute - you're arguing with yourself. Nice job.

 

You made a hypothetical coaching decision based on the logical notation that the experience players gain in the Holiday Bowl is more important than the Holiday Bowl itself.

 

In that sense, the Suh/Stein and Lee/Green situations are completely identical. If you stay consistent to your line of logic, you should also be in favor of giving Baker playing time as well as Cody. My argument was based on the fact that if you agree to play for experience at one position, you should do it at all positions. After all, winning isn't important, right? Why not just lose by 50. It doesn't really matter if that happens, I'm sure.

[skersfan]

Well I am hauling down to San Diego to see them win.

 

I could care less about Green's development. If he can not do it by now and is not better than Lee, he isn't going to be worth a crap anyway.

 

We play to win, this is not the Callahan coaching staff or fan body.

 

Good God how far have we fallen?

[WCHusker]

Well I am hauling down to San Diego to see them win.

 

I could care less about Green's development. If he can not do it by now and is not better than Lee, he isn't going to be worth a crap anyway.

 

We play to win, this is not the Callahan coaching staff or fan body.

 

Good God how far have we fallen?

 

How far have we fallen? Have you watched our offense this year? They were very consistently, well....offensive. As important as a "W" would be here, it certainly appears that the coaches are at least looking at the big picture and trying to get Green up to speed for next year.

[zoogs]

Um, not caring about whether we win or lose a bowl game is not "looking at the big picture"...

[skersfan]

Fan support for this game is ridiculous.

 

Hardly a post regaring the game.

 

Why not finish the season before worrying about next season.

 

I will say this now and get it out of the way.

 

Green is not the answer. He can not even beat out last years 4th string QB that is close to horrible.

 

So who will be next years savior? Every year it is the guy riding the bench.

 

Lee is our QB and we need to support him until it is not his job. The coaches make those decisions, none of us. If Green was all some think he is, why in God's name would he still be riding the pine after a spring, summer, fall, and season of practice. The step must not be too great between them is my guess.

 

There are many freshman QB's playing in NCAA football, and a lot of them are doing a pretty good job.

 

Give the coaches the time to figure out what to do, but the goal for this program is to win the games we have to play. Next year will take care of itself, or not. Losing a game because you want to play with things is not the answer, and sounds totally like a Clownahan coment.

[WCHusker]

Losing a game because you want to play with things is not the answer, and sounds totally like a Clownahan coment.

 

You act like they are writing off the game, which is far from the case. It's safe to say that the Lee experiment was a failure....100% failure. Without the incredible defense we have this year, NU is maybe a 4 win team. I'm fully behind the decision to keep trying diffferent things, because nothing so far has worked worth a crap.

[skersfan]

My coments are directed at the ones saying this game is not important. NO big deal.

 

That is a clownahan coment if I ever heard one.

 

Yes we need change, but we do not need to try something just to see if it might work. Plan what you want to try, but the basic game plan needs to be the same as past to win.

 

If by the grace of god they have headled on the Oline and the RB are healthy we may see another team out there. But you do not throw what got us 9 wins and hell of good showing against Texas away.

 

This victory or loss is very important, for the well being of the fan base and team over the winter and the recruiting which is obvious we so badly need.

 

Losing to Arizona in So Cal is not a good idea under any type of imagination.

 

This is the most important game of the season. Some need to start thinking like it.

[TheCheshireCat]

And if you think Lee can't run it, you haven't been paying attention. Lee is faster AND shiftier than Green,

 

Stop talking.

 

 

You made a hypothetical coaching decision based on the logical notation that the experience players gain in the Holiday Bowl is more important than the Holiday Bowl itself.

 

In that sense, the Suh/Stein and Lee/Green situations are completely identical. If you stay consistent to your line of logic, you should also be in favor of giving Baker playing time as well as Cody. My argument was based on the fact that if you agree to play for experience at one position, you should do it at all positions. After all, winning isn't important, right? Why not just lose by 50. It doesn't really matter if that happens, I'm sure.

 

I notice you completely disregarded almost all of what I said in my last post. But here you are, going back to the Suh and Baker thing although I said nothing about them. Let me reemphasize this for you: BAKER AND SUH ARE NOWHERE NEAR EACH OTHER IN LEVEL OF PLAY AS LEE AND GREEN ARE.

 

I was talking about two players at one position. Do not generalize to other players and positions and do not put words in my mouth and then try pathetically to argue with them. Zac Lee may be the quarterback next year. I never said that was impossible. I said play Green so that we can see how he has progressed since his last start, see how he manages an entire game. Yes I would like to win the bowl game, but it's not like we're playing for anything else, like getting into a conference championship that we need a certain record for.

 

hypothetical coaching decision

 

It's not hypothetical because they said they're going to play him. I just said do it for the whole game. They take him out every time he almost makes a mistake, I would like to see how he can adapt to a few bad plays and comes back from that. We haven't gotten much of a chance to see it.

 

If you're going to respond to this, try to do so without arguing based on extending what is "consistent with my line of logic." Try to argue something I actually said, not something you altered yourself and assumed. I know it's hard without your legion of ass-pals saying "PWNED" to give you that boost of confidence.

[zoogs]

I'm sorry, Green is not a shifty runner. He's not a Robert Griffin kind of player. He has a running mentality when he gets in the open field and that's an advantage over Lee, but Lee is also really athletic in his own right.

 

Feel free to respond to any of my other points at your leisure.

 

OTOH, skersfan, I will respectfully disagree that it is too early to write Green off, either.

 

(edit: Oops, I meant: I disagree, and I think that it is too early to write Green off.)

[Jeremy]

Look, I think he's a great kid and all, but Zac Lee is NOT a running QB in any sense. He's not 'shifty' at all. In fact, he makes Berringer look like Barry Sanders. That said, I think he makes better reads in the passing game and doesn't try to do too much (with the exception of the Big 12 Championship). A more consistent offensive line and strong, healthy backs would make him look a lot better than he has.

 

However, this is my reasoning for starting Green and sticking with him the whole game: He's a much better athlete, he's bigger, faster, and stronger. His 50 yard missile to Niles in the Baylor game was better than any completion Zac Lee had all season (sure, the bomb to Niles in the Missouri game was nice, but it was nothing compared to Green's). Green has shown ability to break tackles and make defenders miss, while Zac simply can't do this, and we desperately need that kind of play.

 

I'm hoping to see Green play so we have another run threat in the sprint option, zone read, and even a wildcat look. Cody can do these things about 12 levels better than Zac (like I said, I like Zac, but it's just not his strength), and it will only help to open up the passing game.

 

When the Zona linebackers are cheating up to stuff Helu, Green, and Burkhead, Niles and Kinnie will have a lot of space to work with for slants and post routes, not to mention the acres of green down the seam for McNeil, Cotton, etc.

 

If the safeties want to come up, Green has definitely shown the ability to throw it deep, and the receivers will be wide open.

[General Blackshirt]

Dear CC,

 

It is difficult to even begin to formulate a response to what you have said. I'll give you this:

 

Zac Lee may be the quarterback next year. I never said that was impossible. I said play Green so that we can see how he has progressed since his last start, see how he manages an entire game.

 

...but that is definitely not what was said earlier. The theme of this thread has basically become "Win with Zac, or lose with Cody? Which is more beneficial", and I happen to want to win with Zac. However, if the coaches truly believe we can win with Cody, then I'm all for that. I just think the point that most people on here arguing with you, including myself, are trying to make, is that winning this game is still the priority.

 

Also, what do you think is a "good" season? What are your goals? For most fans, I would think it would be to win every game. Once we are out of contention for either a NC or a Big 12 title do you just stop caring? I mean, if you do, that's cool, that might explain why you don't care about this game much. But for the rest of us, this game means quite a bit.

 

Love,

 

GB

[skersfan]

I know it is early, but at the beginning of the year we were talking how great Zac was and how there would be no drop off.

 

I stated then we were expecting too much out of kid that could not get on the field last year. How does he go to first string. Transfers, graduation, injury and all of sudden he is the end to end all.

 

Cody is what we have in the wings. who knows what he is. He really can not be that good if he isn't better than Lee at this point. At best Zac is third string this year, if Witt had stayed and Spano not gotten injured.

 

With nearly a year of learning, supposed to have all this talent, why is he not ready. Why is he still behind Zac?

 

Coaching, ability, intelligence, work ethic, what? Other freshmen are starting all over the country in tougher situations to play than here. I just do not think it is is there. I have looked when he is on the field. I just do not see that spark, that flash needed to do the job.