The line between tough and abusive coach has changed

[NUance]

Anyone older than 30 who played football probably also had at least one coach who ordered physically harmful punishments. Mangino's undoing came quickly after former Jayhawks defensive lineman Corey Kipp told the Lawrence (Kan.) Journal-World that Mangino had forced Kipp to "bear crawl" across the field at Memorial Stadium in spite of the fact that the turf was too hot to touch on that 2003 day. Most damning were photos Kipp provided the paper taken immediately after the incident that showed a huge chunk of flesh was either burned or worn off of Kipp's right palm.

 

cnnsi.com article

 

I said this when it happened, and I’ve not changed my opinion after reflecting on it for a couple of months: The Kansas Jayhawks are softbellied pussies for firing Mark Mangino. He was a great coach--probably the best thing that happened to KU football. In over a century. So what if he ranted and raved, swore like a sailor, belittled players, chest-poked, grabbed facemasks, and instituted unreasonable punishments. Jayhawks football wouldn’t be anything close to the team they are today if Mangino had coached in a kinder more gentle manner. Sheesh. The whole university needs to grow a nutsack.

[Landlord]

Physical pain is part of football, everyone gets that. However, if a player is physically harmed by something that isn't within the context of football or relevant punishments (ie, being burned), I don't think that is ok. I don't care if he had to do 1,000 pushups or got put in the middle of a tackle circle for 10 minutes, or anything along those lines, I don't even care if he had to bear crawl across the field, but if he has to do it in a situation like this, where it is going to physicall harm him in a way that is unintended, then you need to find something else.

 

 

With that being said, Mangino may have been a good coach, but he didn't seem like a quality human being (only from what little I know), so I can't say it was a bad decision.

[Fuzzy]

"Have decades of artificial self-esteem boosting made American society so wimpy that a football coach can't raise his voice to a player anymore without the player running to the athletic director and demanding the coach be fired?"

 

So true dude. So true. Its really kind of sad. The way i see it, if your a player, no matter what sport and you mess up, the coach is going to give you an earful of vulgar language, and if you can't handle that, you shouldn't be playing a sport.

 

"What other profession in the country can you regularly abuse people, swear at them, belittle them, threaten them, and still keep your job?"

 

I just saw the picture of Corey Kipp's hand with the chunk of skin missing. That is a bit too far. I can understand his hand being red or sore from the hot turf, but when you start losing pieces of skin like that, that's going too far.

[NUance]

Now that I’ve seen the pictures of Corey Kipp’s hand I think the kid-—and the KU program in general—-are bigger woosies than I previously thought. I’ve had blisters worse than that from a summer job I held during my college years. I didn't go crying to the owners trying to get my foreman fired.

[Fuzzy]

Well its one thing to get blisters from working or pushing oneself during a workout, but to get it from a punishment seems a bit over the top.

 

Condoning that kind of behavior is like saying its ok to have your kid pound his head against the wall until a bruise shows up on his forehead.

[mmmtodd]

Well its one thing to get blisters from working or pushing oneself during a workout, but to get it from a punishment seems a bit over the top.

 

Condoning that kind of behavior is like saying its ok to have your kid pound his head against the wall until a bruise shows up on his forehead.

 

 

its not? I need to start taking notes on these types of things.

 

At a family gathering i got to talking to my cousin about his high school football assistant coaching gig. Talk led to penalties and how stupid some of the recurring ones were. I related to him how my coach would make us run sprints up this long nasty hill in town as punishment for penalties--if you had 12 penalties for 115 yards, he marked off 115 yards and you sprinted it 12 times. Miserable thing to face after practice. This was this century, my cousin is a couple years younger than me and could relate similar stories, but he said that if they tried anything like that with his team he'd lose his job. Apparently nothing can be labeled or construed as punishment, in any way, or it leaves the door open for lawsuits, blah blah blah. So basically, the concept of punishment/consequences do not exist to his players! Its mind blowing.

[Fuzzy]

Ha, i remember sprinting up hills till we were puking since junior high football, its was the norm when we played horrible.

 

After a few days it really started to smell bad out there. haha. But it taught us not to commit penalties or miss our assignments, routes, or snything else.

[Enhance]

Now that I’ve seen the pictures of Corey Kipp’s hand I think the kid-—and the KU program in general—-are bigger woosies than I previously thought. I’ve had blisters worse than that from a summer job I held during my college years. I didn't go crying to the owners trying to get my foreman fired.

I think you are taking this way out of context.

 

As others have pointed out, there is a difference between punishment incurred from something football related (i.e. throwing up after drills, soreness after having to run laps, etc.), however there is no place for physical punishment unrelated to football. There is no place for a coach to punish a player when he knows said punishment can result in some type of non-football related harm. Making a kid bear crawl across a sizzling hot field is not classy nor should it be accepted.

 

What if I asked you to bear crawl across dry ice? Or told you that you couldn't go home after practice until you did 50 sprints (barefoot) across a blistering hot gravel road next to the stadium? Or, what if I told you that the only way you could win playing time was if you kept running in 80 degree weather until you passed out from heat exhaustion? Would you have the same feeling towards this type of punishment then?

 

And second of all, what if Bo took us to a MNC this year and then got fired in 2011 for player abuse like the kind Mangino was accused of? Would you still feel there is a place for this type of punishment in football?