Enhance

This is one of those tough situations where we, as fans, can only rely on the coaching staff's opinions and perspectives. The only assumption we can safely make is that Martinez was still, in their opinion, the best quarterback for the job. I feel pretty confident that Frost & Co. are playing the players they believe give them the best chance to win, but they're also trying to do what they believe is best for each player overall. As for Martinez' potential injury, I guess that's certainly possible, but I also felt AM had quite a few problems this year that appeared more mental than physical.

Admittedly, I do not pay close attention to the exact nature of Tommie's remarks, so perhaps my following comment isn't overly fair. I don't understanding taking shots at Frazier's coaching career at Doane. The fact that he didn't have a lot of success doesn't do much to invalidate his opinion in my eyes. The dude knows football. He probably knows more about football than the vast majority of this fan base. I can certainly say he knows far more than me. So, if he's sitting there saying things like 'I could do a better job because of X, Y and Z' then yeah... perhaps he is going too far. But, if he's just sharing his opinion as a frustrated fan, that's pretty much what all of us do. We just have the luxury of being able to do it 'anonymously.'

"Regression" is a hard word for me to use as a blanket statement for two reasons: first, they won more games this year than they did last. It may have only been one, and that may not matter that much to some people, but it matters to me. I'm long past the point of taking wins for granted. Second, I saw improvement in some areas (i.e. penalties), but felt there was a fair amount of stagnation and/or regression happening in other areas. Some of that stagnation or regression was also shockingly disappointing i.e. Martinez' play, some of the play-calling, lack of overall WR depth, etc. I guess where I would land is that I did expect a bit more by this point. I don't feel ashamed to admit that because I bet you that's probably the feeling for a lot of people (including the coaches/players) at One Memorial Drive. But, I'm still all board the Frost train at this point.

Yep - essentially all we know is the people who wanted Baby Yoda are remnants of the Empire and that they want something Baby Yoda has (I think it's mostly been implied that it has something to do with his force sensitivity/genetics/DNA). I think the biggest issue more than anything is that episode 4 went off down a path that really only told us two things - 1) Mando is conflicted about his 'code' and 2) bounty hunters are after Baby Yoda. But, we already knew these things to be true by the end of episode 3, so I don't personally think the direction they took episode 4 was overly valuable.

I agree. I thought they started off fairly strong and built the right amount of tension through the first few episodes, but last week's episode really fell off for me. About the only reason I'm being made to feel that I should care right now is there's a really cute baby alien and we should protect it because it's pretty adorable and loving. Part of me feels like we're missing the "other side," if that makes sense. Following Mando as the primary character is natural, but there's obviously a bigger picture element here as well as some primary antagonist (whether it's a single individual or a group of people, who knows for certain). We're not really seeing any of that perspective.

Overall, I've enjoyed the series so far, though episode two was fairly slow and episode four felt incredibly rushed. Episode four TBH I am kind of frustrated with the amount of spoilers that are happening. The whole Baby Yoda thing popped up on my social media feeds before I had had time to watch the show. But, in this era of social media, it's sort of what you sign up for if you don't stream a show as soon as it goes live.

I disagree purely from the standpoint that $5+ million/year comes with a certain level of understanding about what type of value you have as a coach. It's not the end all be all by any means, but at some point, that kind of money has to translate to equivalent results. They could be paying somebody a lot less to win a similar # of games.

I would be inclined to agree about his overall tenure based on his age. My primary point was that I think Moos' job security is more exclusive of Frost's successes/failures than a lot of other ADs and head coaches around the country.

TBH I don't remember much of the national commentary Riley received after his hiring announcement, but I remember a lot of the local commentary was borderline manic. Many of us were basically trying to convince ourselves that the hire made sense even though there were a ton of red flags. I include myself in that group. Frost was (and still is, in my opinion) different. He didn't come in with the same baggage. The results of his first two seasons haven't really altered my perspective or hopes for him much. I'm certainly bummed things haven't gone differently, but I still have a ton of faith and confidence in him at this point personally.

In a vacuum I agree, but few AD's hire the #1 overall coaching candidate in the fan's and industry's eyes. This is one of those rare circumstances where the AD would likely outlast the coach they hired. It's fair to say more than 90% of this fan base wanted Frost two years ago. He was also the most sought after coaching candidate. I can't imagine many people sitting here with a straight face and suggesting Moos be let go for that, unless we want to fire ourselves as fans, too.

Moos hired the man that the vast majority of this fan base wanted. The same guy that most people considered to be the #1 available college coaching candidate in 2017. He also hired one of the top 3 available college bball coaches last year and is spearheading a massive facilities upgrade. All things considered, I don't think Moos has much to worry about even if Frost doesn't work out.

I agree with this. Moos is really in a perfect position because he hired the person that virtually everybody (local fans, and other colleges with openings) wanted. Then he did the same for Hoiberg. Pretty nice position to be in if you're him. But you're absolutely right. Frost has bought himself more time than just about anyone else. I think it would take an absolute trainwreck or dumpster fire of a season for him to be out any time before 2022 even.

Going off the thread title, yes, I think Frost is still the coach in 2021 with a 5-7 campaign in 2020. And that's largely because I think Bill Moos would still be here. After that, though, continuation of .500 or worse isn't going to cut it based on the talent, facilities and amount of money we're paying Frost. You can't justify $5 million/year and be a .500 (or worse) coach at the division one level IMO.

I don't really fault Tommie for his opinion. I'm not really sure how fans should feel at the moment. In one hand, I believe it's still too early to be dissenting from Frost or throwing around accusations of 'he can't get it done.' In the other hand, there are a few things I think we should be reasonably concerned or asking questions about. I'm certainly disappointed that we haven't made more progress in the wins column yet but I'm also nowhere near throwing in the towel. Frost is getting a lot closer to the point where his salary is going to demand certain results. I don't know if that's next year or three years from now, but that moment comes for every coach eventually.

Several posts have been moved out of this thread and into the Woodshed for what should be incredibly obvious reasons. Please keep this thread on topic and the posts within our board guidelines. This will be my only verbal warning.