walksalone Posted August 20, 2011 Share Posted August 20, 2011 Pakistan's is a bunch of underhanded douchebags, that really need to be dealt with... What would you recommend? Not sure yet... What would you recommend we do? Continue giving them money, while they continue supplying North Korea with nuclear materials, or why don't we have the Air Force drop all our best technology over there, so they can invite China back over? Should we just not give a damn? What do you think we should do? Well options are kinda limited as long as we want to fight a war on/in their borders and have them pretend to help. So yeah, "not give a damn" is probably about right. I'd prefer the US just stop fighting wars over there because it's bleeding us dry, with no actual gain except killing off Bin Laden and Saddam (but increasing Iran's influence on Iraq). Yet we seem to keep finding new bogeymen over there to go after since now its Gadhafi and soon it'll be Al-Assad (its like we have an expiration date on our smart-bombs or something). Then isolationism? Link to comment
carlfense Posted August 20, 2011 Share Posted August 20, 2011 Pakistan's is a bunch of underhanded douchebags, that really need to be dealt with... What would you recommend? Not sure yet... What would you recommend we do? Continue giving them money, while they continue supplying North Korea with nuclear materials, or why don't we have the Air Force drop all our best technology over there, so they can invite China back over? Should we just not give a damn? What do you think we should do? I'd say our best option is to stay in this strange quasi-ally/quasi-enemy state. Pakistan will alway act in their own national interest . . . just like the United States always acts in our own national interest. When our interests coincide we should take advantage of that. Pakistan has been willing to give up certain terrorist leaders (generally for their own political gain rather than out of concern for the US) and we would be foolish to turn down that sort of intelligence. Generally, I think the US is better off with Pakistan as a occasional ally than we would be if we were openly hostile. Honestly, it's a rather sh**ty situation. (Just like Afghanistan and Iraq. Now that we're in it isn't as easy as just saying that we're leaving immediately . . . but I think almost everyone agrees that it would have been better to have not gone in in the first place. ESPECIALLY Iraq. What a catastrophe. Thanks W.) Link to comment
walksalone Posted August 20, 2011 Share Posted August 20, 2011 Pakistan's is a bunch of underhanded douchebags, that really need to be dealt with... What would you recommend? Not sure yet... What would you recommend we do? Continue giving them money, while they continue supplying North Korea with nuclear materials, or why don't we have the Air Force drop all our best technology over there, so they can invite China back over? Should we just not give a damn? What do you think we should do? I'd say our best option is to stay in this strange quasi-ally/quasi-enemy state. Pakistan will alway act in their own national interest . . . just like the United States always acts in our own national interest. When our interests coincide we should take advantage of that. Pakistan has been willing to give up certain terrorist leaders (generally for their own political gain rather than out of concern for the US) and we would be foolish to turn down that sort of intelligence. Generally, I think the US is better off with Pakistan as a occasional ally than we would be if we were openly hostile. Honestly, it's a rather sh**ty situation. (Just like Afghanistan and Iraq. Now that we're in it isn't as easy as just saying that we're leaving immediately . . . but I think almost everyone agrees that it would have been better to have not gone in in the first place. ESPECIALLY Iraq. What a catastrophe. Thanks W.) Is that why Pakistan helped us to get Bin Laden, and in a record time of 10 years, when he was having a sleep over at their house? Link to comment
carlfense Posted August 20, 2011 Share Posted August 20, 2011 Pakistan's is a bunch of underhanded douchebags, that really need to be dealt with... What would you recommend? Not sure yet... What would you recommend we do? Continue giving them money, while they continue supplying North Korea with nuclear materials, or why don't we have the Air Force drop all our best technology over there, so they can invite China back over? Should we just not give a damn? What do you think we should do? I'd say our best option is to stay in this strange quasi-ally/quasi-enemy state. Pakistan will alway act in their own national interest . . . just like the United States always acts in our own national interest. When our interests coincide we should take advantage of that. Pakistan has been willing to give up certain terrorist leaders (generally for their own political gain rather than out of concern for the US) and we would be foolish to turn down that sort of intelligence. Generally, I think the US is better off with Pakistan as a occasional ally than we would be if we were openly hostile. Honestly, it's a rather sh**ty situation. (Just like Afghanistan and Iraq. Now that we're in it isn't as easy as just saying that we're leaving immediately . . . but I think almost everyone agrees that it would have been better to have not gone in in the first place. ESPECIALLY Iraq. What a catastrophe. Thanks W.) Is that why Pakistan helped us to get Bin Laden, and in a record time of 10 years, when he was having a sleep over at their house? Nope. That's why we took him out without their permission. Our own national interest in getting bin Laden outweighed our national interest in not tweaking Pakistani's feelings. They have helped us get a lot of other al Queda members. If it's the status quo versus another pointless war I'll take the status quo. I notice that you haven't said what you would do yet. What's up with that? Just in for criticizing other people's ideas and unable to provide your own? Side note, happy to see Obama's Libya strategy is working out beautifully. Link to comment
walksalone Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 Is that why Pakistan helped us to get Bin Laden, and in a record time of 10 years, when he was having a sleep over at their house? Nope. That's why we took him out without their permission. Our own national interest in getting bin Laden outweighed our national interest in not tweaking Pakistani's feelings. They have helped us get a lot of other al Queda members. If it's the status quo versus another pointless war I'll take the status quo. I notice that you haven't said what you would do yet. What's up with that? Just in for criticizing other people's ideas and unable to provide your own? Side note, happy to see Obama's Libya strategy is working out beautifully. Well, either way, if I say we go f#*k em up, you'll have a smart ass comment, if I don't you'll have another smart ass comment.... There's a laundry list of people we need to go f*ck up, but never will Link to comment
knapplc Posted August 21, 2011 Author Share Posted August 21, 2011 Well, either way, if I say we go f#*k em up, you'll have a smart ass comment, if I don't you'll have another smart ass comment.... There's a laundry list of people we need to go f*ck up, but never will Rather difficult to do to a nuclear power, isn't it? What's to stop them from bringing suitcase bombs into the States and taking out major cities if we go F them up? Link to comment
carlfense Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 Is that why Pakistan helped us to get Bin Laden, and in a record time of 10 years, when he was having a sleep over at their house? Nope. That's why we took him out without their permission. Our own national interest in getting bin Laden outweighed our national interest in not tweaking Pakistani's feelings. They have helped us get a lot of other al Queda members. If it's the status quo versus another pointless war I'll take the status quo. I notice that you haven't said what you would do yet. What's up with that? Just in for criticizing other people's ideas and unable to provide your own? Side note, happy to see Obama's Libya strategy is working out beautifully. Well, either way, if I say we go f#*k em up, you'll have a smart ass comment, if I don't you'll have another smart ass comment.... There's a laundry list of people we need to go f*ck up, but never will Interesting. Interesting. You responded to my post with Is that why Pakistan helped us to get Bin Laden, and in a record time of 10 years, when he was having a sleep over at their house? but you complain about my smart ass comments. The hypocrisy is a bit blinding, isn't it? Link to comment
walksalone Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Is that why Pakistan helped us to get Bin Laden, and in a record time of 10 years, when he was having a sleep over at their house? Nope. That's why we took him out without their permission. Our own national interest in getting bin Laden outweighed our national interest in not tweaking Pakistani's feelings. They have helped us get a lot of other al Queda members. If it's the status quo versus another pointless war I'll take the status quo. I notice that you haven't said what you would do yet. What's up with that? Just in for criticizing other people's ideas and unable to provide your own? Side note, happy to see Obama's Libya strategy is working out beautifully. Well, either way, if I say we go f#*k em up, you'll have a smart ass comment, if I don't you'll have another smart ass comment.... There's a laundry list of people we need to go f*ck up, but never will Interesting. Interesting. You responded to my post with Is that why Pakistan helped us to get Bin Laden, and in a record time of 10 years, when he was having a sleep over at their house? but you complain about my smart ass comments. The hypocrisy is a bit blinding, isn't it? And yet you do the same as well... Oh well, it's your world, I'm just livin' in it.. just a squirrel trying to get a nut... Link to comment
carlfense Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Is that why Pakistan helped us to get Bin Laden, and in a record time of 10 years, when he was having a sleep over at their house? Nope. That's why we took him out without their permission. Our own national interest in getting bin Laden outweighed our national interest in not tweaking Pakistani's feelings. They have helped us get a lot of other al Queda members. If it's the status quo versus another pointless war I'll take the status quo. I notice that you haven't said what you would do yet. What's up with that? Just in for criticizing other people's ideas and unable to provide your own? Side note, happy to see Obama's Libya strategy is working out beautifully. Well, either way, if I say we go f#*k em up, you'll have a smart ass comment, if I don't you'll have another smart ass comment.... There's a laundry list of people we need to go f*ck up, but never will Interesting. Interesting. You responded to my post with Is that why Pakistan helped us to get Bin Laden, and in a record time of 10 years, when he was having a sleep over at their house? but you complain about my smart ass comments. The hypocrisy is a bit blinding, isn't it? And yet you do the same as well... Oh well, it's your world, I'm just livin' in it.. just a squirrel trying to get a nut... Apparently you don't notice the difference: I don't constantly complain about your smart ass comments while making my own. You do. THAT is the hypocrisy that I am talking about. Link to comment
walksalone Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 http://www.military.com/news/article/mullen-pakistan-helped-haqqanis-attack-us-troops.html?ESRC=dod.nl Link to comment
walksalone Posted September 27, 2011 Share Posted September 27, 2011 http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/envoy/pakistan-tied-deadly-2007-ambush-u-officers-afghan-174413442.html Link to comment
VectorVictor Posted September 29, 2011 Share Posted September 29, 2011 Pakistan has us over a barrel because of Afghanistan, and they know it. I think it's time we not only got out of there, but we take the money we're throwing at Pakistan and blatantly and openly give it to India. Pakistan isn't going to get their house in order because we asked them to--they're going to get their house in order because they'll see us throwing weight behind their biggest, nuclear-armed adversary with an itchy trigger finger. I don't like middle-finger politics, but when you have the Pakistani government deliberately putting our troops in harms way and actively sabotaging our efforts, they have to know if you mess with the bull, you get the horns. Link to comment
PuegotDaddy Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 Agreed , I guess as we speak the US is massing a force on the border and whether Pakistan likes it or not , we are sending Drones into Pakistan as we speak. Pakistan can bitch and moan but this administration is going after the terrorists in places where it was too POLITICALLY CORRECT before ...and more power to them ... Reports: Pakistan let Chinese inspect U.S. stealth copter Chinese military engineers likely got to examine the wreckage of the U.S. stealth helicopter that crashed during the raid on Osama bin Laden's compound in Pakistan, according to news reports. Pakistani intelligence operatives likely gave the Chinese access to the wreckage, the New York Times reported, citing American officials and other intelligence sources. The Chinese engineers were able to photograph the wreckage and take samples of the stealth skin that helps the chopper avoid radar detection, intelligence sources told the Financial Times. When the aircraft crashed during the raid that killed the al Qaeda leader in May, Navy SEALs destroyed most of it to protect the technology. But the tail section remained mostly intact and it was that area that the Chinese engineers examined, according to the New York Times report. U.S. intelligence is basing its opinion that the Chinese got access to the stealth copter on intercepted phone conversations, the Times reported. With allies like the Pakistanis, who needs enemies? Link to comment
knapplc Posted November 8, 2011 Author Share Posted November 8, 2011 What is with this whole top-quoting schtick? Link to comment
Excel Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 Pakistan isn't "underhanded" for this one, they just pursued what was in their national interest as much as can be expected from any state. They're thinking of their future and siding with the United States isn't the smartest move for the long haul. America's time in the region is quickly counting down and for the Pakistanis the war can't end soon enough. It's been incredibly costly and has led to near Civil War in certain regions not to mention the American invasion removed a friendly Afghan government and replaced it with what Islamabad believes to be a committee of potential lackeys for the Indians. They feel they're now bordered, on both sides by hostile powers, not a good place to be, they need a game changer. Naturally they turn to China. Pakistan and China have a long lived and quite strong relationship with much more public support among the citizenry than can be said for the United States (84% of Pakistanis have a favorable view of China vs 16% of the US ). In fact the Sino-Pakistani partnership can and has been equated to that of Israel and the United States. They have a lot in common (Indian problems) and are growing strong economic ties (the Chinese have built numerous ports, highways, mines and housing developments across the country). Militarily China has been the largest supplier of arms to the Pakistanis and its greatest benefactor in nuclear concerns. They've developed just about every kind of weapon in a modern state's arsenal together. Chinese support has proven invaluable in guarding against what Pakistanis percieve to be their greatest enemy...India, not vaguely defined "terrorists" as the US would like to have them believe. In that sense it is almost laughable that some Americans think we can wave the comparatively small amount of aid we've provided and expect them to do our bidding. ....so basically my point is...we need to view things in the proper context. If this alleged disclosure actually took place (it probably did) it shouldn't shock or offend anyone. It's nothing personal, strictly business. On a side note...I challenge anyone to bring forth credible evidence that the United States is massing for an attack on Pakistan outside of the occasional (though growing more frequent) UAV strike. It's just not going to happen. Link to comment
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