I hope Turner or another QB gets a long hard look this offseason.

[zoogs]

Right now, I think our passing game would benefit more from having Alshon Jeffery than it would from having Andrew Luck.

 

Strongly, strongly disagree on this.

 

As far as consistency, I don't really know what else to say, zoogies. This offense was far more consistent than the 2009 and 2010 units, including QB play, against much stronger defenses.

 

I have no idea why there is such a prevalent sense of our offense being consistent. Taking a step forward from previous years and flashing some potential, maybe, but it's still a light switch on, light switch off kind of performance. You might say they haven't put it all together and matured as a group yet.

 

In fact...

 

"We had flashes of brilliance but we didn't have the evidence of great consistency all the time," Brown said. "And if you're going to be a great team you have to have the brilliance that's consistent."

 

"I don't think we're very far off," Brown said. "But again, it's consistency."

 

LJS: Husker offense in search of maturity, consistency

 

I hope Taylor proves me wrong and becomes a much more dangerous - better vision, better reads, etc - runner next season. His passing is almost a secondary point. We can disagree on the extent of the weaknesses there, but I think we can agree that his effectiveness at producing through the air is heavily dependent on how effective a threat he is on the ground.

[Hercules]

That's why I said "more consistent." I wouldn't call them "consistent." Just "more consistent" than they were - that's improvement. They're not perfect. Taylor's not perfect. But if you're waiting for perfection, you're going to be waiting for a long, long time for nothing but disappointment.

 

As far as the running game, zoogies - I'm still curious what kind of production you're expecting from the QB. You've talked in abstract about the type of runner you want him to be, and you've talked specifically about wanting to see him improve his vision and his reads - but not about the amount of production you expect. Just seems funny to be so critical of his running production given that from a statistical standpoint, his rushing production and efficiency have been very good in his first two years as starter.

 

The offense was better this year, and Taylor was better this year. Time for another step forward in 2012. I actually think they're going to take a big step forward, considering how much youth was on the team this year and considering that it was everybody's first year in Beck's system.

[nhuskers5]

I don't know where this idea that we abandoned the option came from. We may have used it less in some games than in others, but we used it throughout the season, and we used it pretty effectively against South Carolina in the bowl game.

 

As far as Taylor's passing improvement goes, I look at "pre-Wisconsin" and "post-Wisconsin." It's about cutting down on mistakes, but it's also about taking what's there and not trying to force plays. You may think that's a small thing, but that's the difference between a win and a loss against Ohio State.

 

Furthermore, I just don't think that the QB is the only reason we have troubles in our passing game. Right now, I think our passing game would benefit more from having Alshon Jeffery than it would from having Andrew Luck.

 

As far as consistency, I don't really know what else to say, zoogies. This offense was far more consistent than the 2009 and 2010 units, including QB play, against much stronger defenses. There were no absolutely pathetic performances like we saw against Iowa State or Texas in 2009, or Texas A&M and Washington in 2010, and the offense actually carried the defense (as opposed to the other way around) in wins against Washington and Fresno State. We were capable of moving the ball on everyone, including teams with top 5 defenses like Michigan State and South Carolina, and we weren't relying on the big play. That's a good step forward for the entire offense, QB included.

 

 

THIS

[bshirt]

That's why I said "more consistent." I wouldn't call them "consistent." Just "more consistent" than they were - that's improvement. They're not perfect. Taylor's not perfect. But if you're waiting for perfection, you're going to be waiting for a long, long time for nothing but disappointment.

 

As far as the running game, zoogies - I'm still curious what kind of production you're expecting from the QB. You've talked in abstract about the type of runner you want him to be, and you've talked specifically about wanting to see him improve his vision and his reads - but not about the amount of production you expect. Just seems funny to be so critical of his running production given that from a statistical standpoint, his rushing production and efficiency have been very good in his first two years as starter.

 

The offense was better this year, and Taylor was better this year. Time for another step forward in 2012. I actually think they're going to take a big step forward, considering how much youth was on the team this year and considering that it was everybody's first year in Beck's system.

 

Excellent post.

 

I would argue that while we took a step back offensively from last year it was mostly due to a far, far better defenses we played this year. Holy Moly, this year we played six teams having a top 20 defense. Wow....even with a vastly tougher defensive schedule we still had much, much better results than 2009.

 

2009.....NU 99th in total offense (vs 3 top 20 defenses, VT -12th, OU -8th, Texas 3rd)

 

2010....NU 44th in total offense (vs 1 top 20 defenses, Texas-6th)

 

2011....NU 66th in total offense (vs 6 top 20 defenses, Ohio St - 19th, Michigan St - 6th, PSU - 20th, USC - 3rd, Michigan - 17th, Wisconsin - 15th)

 

I too have been trying to get a straight answer from zoogies on what numbers it would take from Tmart for him to acknowledge how our qb running threat is a good asset. No answer yet. Let's see what the numbers are for our qb the during the same last three years (including sacks)......

 

2009....Z. Lee, 103 rushes for 171 yds, 1.7 ypc w/1 TD)

 

2010....Tmart, 162 rushes for 965 yds, 6.0 ypc w/12 TDs)

 

2011....Tmart, 188 rushes for 874 yds, 4.7 ypc w/9 TDs)

 

Well zoogies? Just what does he need to do? As Hercules already mentioned, even with zero sacks to drag down his running stats, here's SuperRex's numbers this year.....

 

2011....SuperRex, 284 rushes for 1357 yds, 4.8 ypc w/15 TDs)

 

So, we're talking almost identical ypc (again, even with Tmart's sacks). So, once again zoogies, just what does he have to do? Do results mean anything to you?

[bshirt]

Btw, here's Tmart's passing stats this year...

 

2011, Tmart....288 attempts, 162 completions for a 56% ratio, 2089 yds for 13 TDs & 8 interceptions. Not bad but just imagine what those numbers would be if our wrs could catch the ball?

 

Well, I'll let the haters continue to rip our qb to shreds. However, the numbers state quite clearly that Tmart & SRex were easily our best two offensive players and we would have been in deep, deep do-do without either of them this year. I bet they both excel even more next year (more experience, maybe a better Oline, OC's 2nd year & the endless hope we'll clone some Peterson's, Swift's & Davison's).

[zoogs]

Numbers in a vacuum don't tell the whole story. Colin Klein is a great example. Guy averaged 3.6 yards on the ground (sacks included, I guess), but look what he got done at Kansas State. And when it comes to the QB, the guy taking all the snaps, why is it unreasonable to measure him by more than his individual rushing production?

 

There are so many ways of looking at numbers, too. Yeah, he piled up the most yards on the team, but he's the starting quarterback in every game, of course that is going to happen! Compare his production to that of other QBs. Middle-of-the-pack in total yardage. Yards-per-play, pretty average. Touchdown count, on the low side. Fumble count, on the high side. INT%, not too bad. Maybe he played better D's this year, but his yards-per-play dropped a full yard, and he had 22 TDs and 8 INTs as opposed to 22 and 7, while spending no part of this year playing hobbled.

 

How about we frame it this way so people don't need to get so defensive: I am talking about areas of the game that Taylor needs to develop this offseason in order to truly blossom. I don't think our thinking is too far apart, Herc. You're expecting improvements in Taylor next year, big ones. I don't know if I share the optimism, but I'm saying: to get from 'average' to 'great', here are the things he must be able to do. I think we both agree that this year wasn't some kind of great show he put up. I think some people are getting the impression that I'm saying this year was awful from him and I'm just tearing him down. I'm not saying that.

 

I should leave the pessimism aside and just say I hope that Taylor will get better at picking apart coverages and blitzes, be consistent in his throws, have great running vision, develop pocket awareness, and be able to make something out of nothing. How he makes that something - 1) making holes when there are none to be found, 2) bruising through tacklers, 3) evading pressure and running or throwing out of that - or any combination of these - I don't care. And to be clear, these expectations are still far from perfection.

 

I'll really try to stop going on about it this time, neither side is really going to get convinced.

[Hercules]

I don't disagree with anything you just said zoogies. I think where we probably disagree most is where our priorities are. It always seems to me from the urgency of your tone that you think that for the offense to get better, Taylor is the only key. I tend to think that while I want Taylor to improve in every way you just mentioned, he's a lot closer to what we need him to be than the offensive line, the wide receivers, and the fullback are.

 

I think that Taylor could play roughly the same in 2012 as he did in 2011, and if other players didn't make critical mistakes like they did this year, we'd win 1-2 more games (like we would have against Northwestern and South Carolina this year). That said, we won't beat teams like Wisconsin or Michigan next year unless Taylor improves.

 

In other words, I'm totally with you on where I hope Taylor improves this offseason. I'm just more worried about the secondary, the linebackers, the defensive line, the wide receivers, the offensive line, and the fullback. Basically I'm worried about everyone on the team more than I am about Taylor Martinez or Rex Burkhead.

 

That said, while I hope Taylor improves upon everything you said, I don't think you're going to see his running instincts change that much. That seems to be more of a natural skillset, and Taylor doesn't seem to possess the natural running instinct that someone like Rex possesses. That hasn't stopped him from being a very effective runner, and it won't. We don't need the guy to be Michael Vick or Denard Robinson on the ground - we just need him to be dangerous. He is. Given all the concerns on the team going into next year, I think we should stop worrying about Taylor Martinez's ability to run the ball.

 

Where I want to see him get better running the ball, and I think he will, is in executing the option and the zone read. He showed improvement in both areas this year. He's going to show more during the offseason and next year. I hope he spends all winter, spring, and summer watching film of Tommie Frazier and Turner Gill.

 

In the passing game, I would love to see him consistently get set with his feet throwing the football. I think that's the main mechanical issue the coaches are worried about fixing, and I think when he gets set and has his feet moving in the right direction, he is pretty accurate. Last year I was concerned about his decision-making, but I was happy to see him improve upon that this year - hopefully he continues to, while improving his vision down the field (i.e. reading coverages and identifying the open man). Part of that will come from more experience in Beck's system and knowing the playbook, more of it will come from film study.

 

Anyways, I'm optimistic about our starting QB, but I hope that Carnes pushes him this offseason. I don't want to hear Bo saying, "Taylor's way ahead." I want to hear, "Brion's really playing well, and Taylor is responding to the competition."

[Enhance]

All I know is that Martinez is essentially a veteran right now. Whatever we get next year is what we will have the year after.

[Hunter94]

2 more years of TM, he better improve!

[2ndNnine]

[ronsss]

qb taylor just has never looked the same since his injury.....not sure if this year was due to the offensive line, or taylor has lost a step since the injury

[kchusker_chris]

All I know is that Martinez is essentially a veteran right now. Whatever we get next year is what we will have the year after.

He is. I just watched a 3rd year sophomore starting his first season tear appart one of the top defenses in the nation - whithout his #1 WR, with a stagnant running game, against two all-american CBs. This "he's only a sophomore" crap is getting old. Guy's got 26 starts. If this is all our coaches can do w/ that much experience (yes taylor is VERY experienced) then we have issues.

[MichiganDad3]

zoogies, every time you or someone else asks why we couldn't have a RB take responsibility for Taylor's rushing production, you're completely ignoring the whole point of having a QB who can run. That point is to force the defense to defend all 11 players on the field for the offense

 

I think you misunderstand me. There are many reasons to have a QB who can run. I am saying Taylor's running threat, specifically, is in one way only: straight-line burning speed. He doesn't run the option well. He doesn't shake defender and can't barrel over them. When the pocket breaks down and he gets pressured, he doesn't dance out of it. He usually goes down with it. I wouldn't even say he has great running vision. These are all the kinds of things you are looking to get out of the QB when he is a 'dual-threat' type.

 

I am saying if we are going to have a running QB, he has to be that kind of dynamic threat on the ground. Otherwise, we're better off having a passer. Or without even changing the scheme at all, a guy who isn't as fast, but has some vision and shake ability and throws the ball better. Sooner or later, one of our recruits is going to have that.

 

If Taylor ran either the read option or the option well, then we'd use both a lot more. We largely abandoned the option, didn't we?

 

If the steps he has taken to protect himself as a runner have nixed an entire dimension in his running game, then I'd have to say I was wrong and that it wasn't worth it. Although I've seen it said that he would probably protect himself better by lowering his shoulder rather than taking those steamrolling hits upright, and I agree with that.

 

I'm not that cynical about Beck, thugh, really. I will just disagree about all the passing and consistency improvements. I don't think Taylor raised the ceiling he was showing in his passing game pre-injury in 2010. He has cut down on mistakes, and that's about it.

 

I agree with zoogies. Nebraska has a running QB who rarely scrambles for a 1st down when there is a called pass play. Opposing teams kills Nebraska with running QBs on passing plays, but Nebraska can't seem to return the favor.

[Hercules]

All I know is that Martinez is essentially a veteran right now. Whatever we get next year is what we will have the year after.

He is. I just watched a 3rd year sophomore starting his first season tear appart one of the top defenses in the nation - whithout his #1 WR, with a stagnant running game, against two all-american CBs. This "he's only a sophomore" crap is getting old. Guy's got 26 starts. If this is all our coaches can do w/ that much experience (yes taylor is VERY experienced) then we have issues.

 

He tore them apart? They kicked five field goals, and then the best RB in the country broke a run around the end when LSU had already given up.

 

BTW, I think Taylor actually has 24 starts... something like that. And while McCarron played the game of his life last night, I'd take Taylor over senior Jordan Jefferson every day of the week.

[bshirt]

All I know is that Martinez is essentially a veteran right now. Whatever we get next year is what we will have the year after.

He is. I just watched a 3rd year sophomore starting his first season tear appart one of the top defenses in the nation - whithout his #1 WR, with a stagnant running game, against two all-american CBs. This "he's only a sophomore" crap is getting old. Guy's got 26 starts. If this is all our coaches can do w/ that much experience (yes taylor is VERY experienced) then we have issues.

 

Tore them up???

 

A whole four FGs (12 - 0 in the 4th qtr) & then their rb runs for a long TD with the game already done is "a qb tearing them up" Haha....wow, you must have thought our 2009 offense was a scoring explosion".