Sub-Husker Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Now who's moving the goal posts? Nobody said this was ONLY about Hamas. It's about Israel and their occupation of territories, and the response of Palestinians. Hamas is only one group, and we're talking about them for the moment. All of Palestine is responding to Israel, though, and we're going to be dealing with the entirety of the situation, not just specific groups. Have to. Can't take it piecemeal, because it's not a situation of having truces with one group for all groups. The Israelis routinely attack Hamas in a manner that prevents them from being able to govern the terratories they were elected to oversee. Surely you can understand how that would make it more difficult to police radical elements in Gaza. Link to comment
knapplc Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 And Hamas routinely attacks Israel in a manner that prevents them from being able to trust that they will have safety in their homes at night. We can dance like this forever. There are two parties here who are wrong. You cannot simply focus on Israel. Link to comment
Sub-Husker Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 It's disingenuous to start your history at 1967 without mentioning the reasons those borders changed that year. Why is that disingenuous? The Israelis attacked in a similar manner to the Japanese attack on Hawaii in 1941... a sneak attack. Please be more specific, I have no idea what you are trying to get at. Link to comment
Sub-Husker Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 And Hamas routinely attacks Israel in a manner that prevents them from being able to trust that they will have safety in their homes at night. We can dance like this forever. There are two parties here who are wrong. You cannot simply focus on Israel. No we can't go on like this forever... it would be like debating with someone who thought Palin was a good VP choice, or why Gingrinch would be a good president. Yeah both have done wrong, but it is not close to being equivalent. Link to comment
knapplc Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Yeah both have done wrong, but it is not close to being equivalent. This is true. Isreal is not classified as a terrorist organization by the West. Link to comment
knapplc Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 The Israelis attacked in a similar manner to the Japanese attack on Hawaii in 1941... a sneak attack. This is another disingenuous allegation. Both sides were heavily prepared for war. Two-thirds of the entire Egyptian military were on the Israeli borders. Iraq, Syria and Jordan all had large contingents on the Israeli border. This is not a peace-time maneuver. Don't pretend that Israel attacked a sleeping enemy like Japan. Not even close. Link to comment
johnnyrodgers20 Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 The Israelis attacked in a similar manner to the Japanese attack on Hawaii in 1941... a sneak attack. This is another disingenuous allegation. Both sides were heavily prepared for war. Two-thirds of the entire Egyptian military were on the Israeli borders. Iraq, Syria and Jordan all had large contingents on the Israeli border. This is not a peace-time maneuver. Don't pretend that Israel attacked a sleeping enemy like Japan. Not even close. I told you so!! Enjoy the dance!! Link to comment
Cactusboy Posted February 7, 2012 Author Share Posted February 7, 2012 Remember this whole exchange is about if and how often Hamas breaks ceasefires. They are the party/group in charge of Gaza. Now who's moving the goal posts? Nobody said this was ONLY about Hamas. It's about Israel and their occupation of territories, and the response of Palestinians. Hamas is only one group, and we're talking about them for the moment. All of Palestine is responding to Israel, though, and we're going to be dealing with the entirety of the situation, not just specific groups. Have to. Can't take it piecemeal, because it's not a situation of having truces with one group for all groups. Knapp I am going to give you some advice. We went round and round before on this subject. He will change and move the posts forever. He is right and you can't tell him a thing, the best you can do is just let him spout and throw up his little jabs and be done with it. He can't even say bombing a bus of innocent people is wrong without somehow tying it to the Israeli govt. and their policies that are the real cause of the killings. Just a little advice!! Thank you. It's helpful to speak with someone with experience. No problem, I fell into that trap and no matter what the facts are or the amount of evidence it is Israel's fault!! I'm sure you feel that way about most topics you discuss w/ people you disagree w/ on here. Link to comment
Cactusboy Posted February 7, 2012 Author Share Posted February 7, 2012 Remember this whole exchange is about if and how often Hamas breaks ceasefires. They are the party/group in charge of Gaza. Now who's moving the goal posts? Nobody said this was ONLY about Hamas. It's about Israel and their occupation of territories, and the response of Palestinians. Hamas is only one group, and we're talking about them for the moment. All of Palestine is responding to Israel, though, and we're going to be dealing with the entirety of the situation, not just specific groups. Have to. Can't take it piecemeal, because it's not a situation of having truces with one group for all groups. Knapp I am going to give you some advice. We went round and round before on this subject. He will change and move the posts forever. He is right and you can't tell him a thing, the best you can do is just let him spout and throw up his little jabs and be done with it. He can't even say bombing a bus of innocent people is wrong without somehow tying it to the Israeli govt. and their policies that are the real cause of the killings. Just a little advice!! Still haven't learned to wait for my response, huh? Don't worry, we'll wait for you to take the foot out of your mouth. WHAT????? You chimed in before I had a chance to respond. My response showed knapp was wrong. I showed his quote where he specifically only said Hamas. You don't follow along well. Link to comment
Cactusboy Posted February 7, 2012 Author Share Posted February 7, 2012 It's disingenuous to start your history at 1967 without mentioning the reasons those borders changed that year. There is an entire new can of worms. Hope you packed a lunch. Shall we dig in and see what happened? Link to comment
Cactusboy Posted February 7, 2012 Author Share Posted February 7, 2012 Yeah both have done wrong, but it is not close to being equivalent. This is true. Isreal is not classified as a terrorist organization by the West. South Africa was during Apartheid. What does that tell you? There were also very violent Jewish terrorist groups fighting for Israel's statehood up until the very moment it was granted. THey bombed marketplaces, theaters and cafes, etc. Members of the group/s went onto be top leaders of Israel. What does that tell you? Link to comment
johnnyrodgers20 Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Not with incoherent blatherings, No!! Link to comment
Cactusboy Posted February 7, 2012 Author Share Posted February 7, 2012 The Israelis attacked in a similar manner to the Japanese attack on Hawaii in 1941... a sneak attack. This is another disingenuous allegation. Both sides were heavily prepared for war. Two-thirds of the entire Egyptian military were on the Israeli borders. Iraq, Syria and Jordan all had large contingents on the Israeli border. This is not a peace-time maneuver. Don't pretend that Israel attacked a sleeping enemy like Japan. Not even close. EVERYONE that mattered KNEW Egypt wasn't going to attack. They are quoted as saying so...Israel's leader and US intelligence agreed they weren't going to and wouldn't have attacked. I can provide the quotes if needed. See how most have such a warped version of what's happened over there throughout the decades? How many outright lies do I need to show before you can admit it's greatly skewed? Step away from the conventional wisdom and into reality. Link to comment
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