cm husker Posted March 23, 2016 Author Share Posted March 23, 2016 Some of these black and white, harsh responses do make me wonder who had played college athletics.That's a cop out, most of us on this board have not. The same ideals stand outside college athletics. You screw up, you pay the consequences. And the people around you will be disappointed. A no injury/nonaggrevated dui outside of college athletics results in the same collateral damage as in football? No. That's of course not true. It's just as easy for me to argue that TA in that situation should only be subject to his civil punishments. Punishing him additionally seems unfair to a degree too. Of course if we are talking about credible charges of assault, rape, etc. a football punishment is appropriate as well (as should be a university suspension, at the least). Quote Link to comment
Redux Posted March 23, 2016 Share Posted March 23, 2016 Well, you go right ahead and coach a team. Let the players know that if they get into trouble off the field that they won't be punished further because it may hurt the team. Let us know how that little experiment goes. Imagine it, a whole team of Jameis Winston's and Johnny Manziel's. 3 Quote Link to comment
cm husker Posted March 23, 2016 Author Share Posted March 23, 2016 Well, you go right ahead and coach a team. Let the players know that if they get into trouble off the field that they won't be punished further because it may hurt the team. Let us know how that little experiment goes. Imagine it, a whole team of Jameis Winston's and Johnny Manziel's. So these players only stay out of trouble because threat of football punishments? That's cynical to the extreme. And I never precluded punishment. Just asked if it should be a factor. Please stop overstating my thoughts. Quote Link to comment
Redux Posted March 23, 2016 Share Posted March 23, 2016 Well, you go right ahead and coach a team. Let the players know that if they get into trouble off the field that they won't be punished further because it may hurt the team. Let us know how that little experiment goes. Imagine it, a whole team of Jameis Winston's and Johnny Manziel's. So these players only stay out of trouble because threat of football punishments? That's cynical to the extreme. And I never precluded punishment. Just asked if it should be a factor. Please stop overstating my thoughts. It's called incentive and there is nothing cynical about this. You are told day 1 not to get in trouble or you will get in trouble, verbatim. These kids are here to either get an education and or further their playing career. They know full well that getting busted will hinder that. I mean you have to understand that right? 1 Quote Link to comment
cm husker Posted March 23, 2016 Author Share Posted March 23, 2016 Yeah, we are talking way past each other. No sense in continuing. Quote Link to comment
Bowfin Posted March 23, 2016 Share Posted March 23, 2016 Why is punishing everyone, guys who have worked their tails off and coaches with jobs on the line, automatically the appropriate value? You've never served in the military, have you? There's a whole philosophy behind group punishment providing motivation on several different levels, and it has worked ever since the Legions of Rome. On the other hand, you are advocating for the "Johnny Manziel" mode of discipline. Make somebody sit out for a half against a team they will beat anyway, perhaps? Look at the dumpster fire that Texas A&M has become and look at how that has molded JFF into what he is (and maybe more importantly, what he ISN'T). 1 Quote Link to comment
Redux Posted March 23, 2016 Share Posted March 23, 2016 Yeah, we are talking way past each other. No sense in continuing. What exactly are you proposing in terms of alternative ways of punishment for what kind of offense? Quote Link to comment
cm husker Posted March 23, 2016 Author Share Posted March 23, 2016 Actually I have served. 10 years. Three Mideast deployments and another to South America between '01 and '07. No way would I leave one of my best guys on the bench if I thought it would hurt mission effectiveness unless it was taken out of my hands. You're way overstating my positions by acting as though i wouldn't Acknowledge the value of team punishments during practice, such as group runs, push-ups and up downs, and by saying I'm endorsing a j manziel approach to all situations. Quote Link to comment
cm husker Posted March 23, 2016 Author Share Posted March 23, 2016 Also, what is the evidence that Texas A&M is a dumpster fire due to Manziels punishments? I'm not familiar. A quick Google search didn't reveal any crazy arrest or other disciplinary issues since he left school. Quote Link to comment
gobiggergoredder Posted March 23, 2016 Share Posted March 23, 2016 Punishing a player has the potential of hurting the short term performance of the team, but it shows the team what behaviors are acceptable. Not punishing the player shows the team that there are no rules and more will begin to challenge. Eventually, you lose complete control of the program. You have to punish a player for not following the rules regardless of the impact on the team. 3 Quote Link to comment
Redux Posted March 23, 2016 Share Posted March 23, 2016 Punishing a player has the potential of hurting the short term performance of the team, but it shows the team what behaviors are acceptable. Not punishing the player shows the team that there are no rules and more will begin to challenge. Eventually, you lose complete control of the program. You have to punish a player for not following the rules regardless of the impact on the team. Bingo Quote Link to comment
Red Dead Redemption Posted March 23, 2016 Share Posted March 23, 2016 But you can't hold a whole team responsible for the behavior of a few, sick twisted individuals. For if you do, then shouldn't we blame the whole college athletics system? And if the whole college athletics system is guilty, then isn't this an indictment of our entire sports institutions in general? I put it to you, CM - isn't this an indictment of our entire American society? Well, you can do whatever you want to the players, but we're not going to sit here and listen to you badmouth the United States of America. Gentlemen! *marches out of forum humming "Star-Spangled Banner"*... 1 Quote Link to comment
Red Dead Redemption Posted March 23, 2016 Share Posted March 23, 2016 Everybody thought that RDR was brain damaged. (then he double-posted and proved it...) 1 Quote Link to comment
ColoradoHusk Posted March 23, 2016 Share Posted March 23, 2016 Coaches need to hold players accountable for their actions. If there is a player that deserves suspension for a game(s), the coach shouldn't base the suspension on who the opponent is. It's the player's responsibility to not get suspended, not the coaches responsibility to ensure the punishment doesn't hurt the team. Quote Link to comment
Redux Posted March 23, 2016 Share Posted March 23, 2016 Furthermore, the coach will end up taking heat for NOT punishing the player because it's the expected action. Quote Link to comment
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