"Not a true Christian"

[Landlord]

You may believe what you like I don't have a problem with that. If you choose to feel there is no God then you are free to choose that. You must live with the consequences though. You may not feel there are any but you are wrong and in the end you will be sorry.

 

There is a difference in not believing in any god (not that there's anything wrong with that) and not believing in someone else's god story/myth.

 

Even when I was a hard-core Christian I could not belive that many of the fables in the Old Testament were true.

 

The OT was only put into writing about 500 BCE, almost a thousand years after the Exodus.

And the Bible was not assembled til around 300 AD, and many books had no written form for about a century. And the culture in the middle east at the time was not a strong oral history culture like the Navaho, the amount of changes of any event that may have actually been real would be enormous. Just look at how people view events differently that they actually happened with a few number of years in between and actual audio and video footage we have now.

 

(To say nothing of the comparisons between the Egyptian's Horus and Jesus)

 

U serious bro?

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oral_law#Oral_law_in_Judaism

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oral_Torah

 

The bit about similarities between Jesus and Horus is a crock too. Check http://stupidevilbastard.com/2005/01/ending_the_myth_of_horus/ for one good argument against why they're ridiculous (the guy is an atheist, for the record).

[johnnyrodgers20]

1. Jesus was the Son of God in the sense that is a part of the trinity and became man. We are all God's children in that he created mankind!!

 

Other than the Trinity, we are in agreement.

 

2. The God that Jesus talks to and honors as his father.

 

Which god of the Old Testament... there are two distinctly different ones. Does Jesus identify himself with El, or with YHWY?

 

3. Christ talked about a second coming so therefore he hasn't come yet because that is at teh end of days.

 

A "Second Coming" is not mentioned in the Bible. In Greek, it is described to be a "Triumphant Return" (of royalty).

 

Therefore it needs to be asked, had the Christ been here before the time of Jesus?

 

.

 

1. You either believe that Jesus is the Divine son of God and he came and died for your sins and rose again or you don't.

 

2. It is not a variable in the belief in Jesus. some may have some rough times in their lives and may say they lose faith but if they still believe in Jesus as the lord and savior that is the amount needed.

 

3. Yes, You must have faith to move a mountain. Jesus' point is we all lose faith that doesn't mean you lose eternity. You may not believe as much as you think but if you believe in the first sentence you will have everlasting life.

 

Nobody has faith beyond absolute certainty, and some people are flat-out wishy washy about it. Having faith is not a black or white characteristic. And some followers may have faith is a Jesus that differs from the standard Christian model.

 

 

You didn't ask if some followers had differing amounts of faith you asked how much faith is needed I believe. And I gave you the answer- That Jesus is the Son of God and he died on the cross for man's sin and he rose again in three days!! That is the amount you must believe if you are to enter the kingdom of heaven. All the other questions are just a smokescreen to whether or not you believe in that statement.

[Sub-Husker]

You didn't ask if some followers had differing amounts of faith you asked how much faith is needed I believe. And I gave you the answer- That Jesus is the Son of God and he died on the cross for man's sin and he rose again in three days!! That is the amount you must believe if you are to enter the kingdom of heaven. All the other questions are just a smokescreen to whether or not you believe in that statement.

 

So that's the magic "key to the kingdom" and nothing else matters.

 

Now if I have that key, I can blaspheme against the Holy Spirit with impunity!

 

Or maybe not?

[johnnyrodgers20]

You didn't ask if some followers had differing amounts of faith you asked how much faith is needed I believe. And I gave you the answer- That Jesus is the Son of God and he died on the cross for man's sin and he rose again in three days!! That is the amount you must believe if you are to enter the kingdom of heaven. All the other questions are just a smokescreen to whether or not you believe in that statement.

 

So that's the magic "key to the kingdom" and nothing else matters.

 

Now if I have that key, I can blaspheme against the Holy Spirit with impunity!

 

Or maybe not?

 

I think if you blaspheme against the Holy spirit you do not totally believe that Jesus is your savior. Why would you blaspheme a part of the trinity if you believe in Christ?

[Sub-Husker]

You didn't ask if some followers had differing amounts of faith you asked how much faith is needed I believe. And I gave you the answer- That Jesus is the Son of God and he died on the cross for man's sin and he rose again in three days!! That is the amount you must believe if you are to enter the kingdom of heaven. All the other questions are just a smokescreen to whether or not you believe in that statement.

 

So that's the magic "key to the kingdom" and nothing else matters.

 

Now if I have that key, I can blaspheme against the Holy Spirit with impunity!

 

Or maybe not?

 

I think if you blaspheme against the Holy spirit you do not totally believe that Jesus is your savior. Why would you blaspheme a part of the trinity if you believe in Christ?

 

OK, there is an additional condition that would void the faith in Jesus.

 

Do you know of any other such special conditions?

[johnnyrodgers20]

You didn't ask if some followers had differing amounts of faith you asked how much faith is needed I believe. And I gave you the answer- That Jesus is the Son of God and he died on the cross for man's sin and he rose again in three days!! That is the amount you must believe if you are to enter the kingdom of heaven. All the other questions are just a smokescreen to whether or not you believe in that statement.

 

So that's the magic "key to the kingdom" and nothing else matters.

 

Now if I have that key, I can blaspheme against the Holy Spirit with impunity!

 

Or maybe not?

 

I think if you blaspheme against the Holy spirit you do not totally believe that Jesus is your savior. Why would you blaspheme a part of the trinity if you believe in Christ?

 

OK, there is an additional condition that would void the faith in Jesus.

 

Do you know of any other such special conditions?

 

I didn't say there were any special conditions I said that if you blaspheme the Holy spirit you probalby don't believe in Christ. I ahve yet to find a person who believes Jesus is their savior blaspheing The Holy Spirit. If you find that person show him to me!!

[Sub-Husker]

So blasphemies against God the Father and God the Son are forgivable, but blasphemy against the Holy Spirit is not?

 

Is this trinitarian god not one in the same?

[johnnyrodgers20]

So blasphemies against God the Father and God the Son are forgivable, but blasphemy against the Holy Spirit is not?

 

Is this trinitarian god not one in the same?

 

 

They are one and the same but they also have their own indivdual qualities. Much like water is h2o when you divide the molecules they have individual traits. So like the trinity they are one but have their own traits. So you may blaspheme against one and ahve a different consequence then if you blaspheme against the other. Is there something you are trying to get at here? You say you are a Chrsitian or were a Christian or kinda Christian? Are you trying to find answers or to discredit God?

[Sub-Husker]

So blasphemies against God the Father and God the Son are forgivable, but blasphemy against the Holy Spirit is not?

 

Is this trinitarian god not one in the same?

 

They are one and the same but they also have their own indivdual qualities. Much like water is h2o when you divide the molecules they have individual traits. So like the trinity they are one but have their own traits. So you may blaspheme against one and ahve a different consequence then if you blaspheme against the other. Is there something you are trying to get at here? You say you are a Chrsitian or were a Christian or kinda Christian? Are you trying to find answers or to discredit God?

 

I am neither a blasphemer nor an apostate, I am a heretic.

 

I believe in a unitarian deity who is unlike any of the gods described in the Old Testament.

 

I consider myself to be a desciple of Jesus of Nazaerth, and strive to follow His teachings as described in the three Synoptic Gospels.

 

I am a heretic principally because I find the concept of a Trinity to be ludicrous.

 

That said, I do not believe the "Spirit of God" can be separated from god in any way, and any blasphemy against the spirit is blasphemy against all of god.

[Hammerhead]

I think the very fact that the Tree was named "The Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil" means they didn't know what they were getting themselves into prior to eating it. How could they, if they didn't truly understand Wrong?

 

But that is entirely beside the point. A loving parent doesn't put a child in a room with a loaded bear trap. The loaded bear trap never, ever, ever gets in the room. What the heck was it doing there?

I think we are going round in circles. You believe that God is fraudulant and I believe otherwise. God placed the tree there for a reason why only he would know. The humans knew not to eat of it and they chose to do so. Maybe evil was already in the world you know the devil had rebelled against God before the earth was made. So maybe the tree was made to hold the evil in and the eating of the fruit released it.

 

It's not a question of whether or not God is fraudulent. Moreso a question of whether God exists at all.

[johnnyrodgers20]

So blasphemies against God the Father and God the Son are forgivable, but blasphemy against the Holy Spirit is not?

 

Is this trinitarian god not one in the same?

 

They are one and the same but they also have their own indivdual qualities. Much like water is h2o when you divide the molecules they have individual traits. So like the trinity they are one but have their own traits. So you may blaspheme against one and ahve a different consequence then if you blaspheme against the other. Is there something you are trying to get at here? You say you are a Chrsitian or were a Christian or kinda Christian? Are you trying to find answers or to discredit God?

 

I am neither a blasphemer nor an apostate, I am a heretic.

 

I believe in a unitarian deity who is unlike any of the gods described in the Old Testament.

 

I consider myself to be a desciple of Jesus of Nazaerth, and strive to follow His teachings as described in the three Synoptic Gospels.

 

I am a heretic principally because I find the concept of a Trinity to be ludicrous.

 

That said, I do not believe the "Spirit of God" can be separated from god in any way, and any blasphemy against the spirit is blasphemy against all of god.

 

 

that is a well thought out answer and if you believe and follow Jesus do you believe he was the son of God or god incarnate?

[johnnyrodgers20]

I think the very fact that the Tree was named "The Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil" means they didn't know what they were getting themselves into prior to eating it. How could they, if they didn't truly understand Wrong?

 

But that is entirely beside the point. A loving parent doesn't put a child in a room with a loaded bear trap. The loaded bear trap never, ever, ever gets in the room. What the heck was it doing there?

I think we are going round in circles. You believe that God is fraudulant and I believe otherwise. God placed the tree there for a reason why only he would know. The humans knew not to eat of it and they chose to do so. Maybe evil was already in the world you know the devil had rebelled against God before the earth was made. So maybe the tree was made to hold the evil in and the eating of the fruit released it.

 

It's not a question of whether or not God is fraudulent. Moreso a question of whether God exists at all.

 

 

That is the question you have to ask yourself being God is the most powerful force in the universe do you believe - Well, do you Punk (What movie is that from, movie buffs)?

[Sub-Husker]

I am neither a blasphemer nor an apostate, I am a heretic.

 

I believe in a unitarian deity who is unlike any of the gods described in the Old Testament.

 

I consider myself to be a desciple of Jesus of Nazaerth, and strive to follow His teachings as described in the three Synoptic Gospels.

 

I am a heretic principally because I find the concept of a Trinity to be ludicrous.

 

That said, I do not believe the "Spirit of God" can be separated from god in any way, and any blasphemy against the spirit is blasphemy against all of god.

 

that is a well thought out answer and if you believe and follow Jesus do you believe he was the son of God or god incarnate?

 

I believe that Jesus was a child of god, as we all are.

 

As a mortal Jesus (aka Yeshua ben Pantera) was not god incarnate.

 

The Christ spirit, like our spirits (or souls) are part of god.

 

But that is just my opinion, and I'm not pushing it on anyone else or judging them by it.

[Hammerhead]

I think the very fact that the Tree was named "The Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil" means they didn't know what they were getting themselves into prior to eating it. How could they, if they didn't truly understand Wrong?

 

But that is entirely beside the point. A loving parent doesn't put a child in a room with a loaded bear trap. The loaded bear trap never, ever, ever gets in the room. What the heck was it doing there?

I think we are going round in circles. You believe that God is fraudulant and I believe otherwise. God placed the tree there for a reason why only he would know. The humans knew not to eat of it and they chose to do so. Maybe evil was already in the world you know the devil had rebelled against God before the earth was made. So maybe the tree was made to hold the evil in and the eating of the fruit released it.

 

It's not a question of whether or not God is fraudulent. Moreso a question of whether God exists at all.

 

 

That is the question you have to ask yourself being God is the most powerful force in the universe do you believe - Well, do you Punk (What movie is that from, movie buffs)?

 

I ask myself that quite often. I can't definitively answer the question, but as I once read on a Magic 8 Ball, "Signs point to no."

[johnnyrodgers20]

I am neither a blasphemer nor an apostate, I am a heretic.

 

I believe in a unitarian deity who is unlike any of the gods described in the Old Testament.

 

I consider myself to be a desciple of Jesus of Nazaerth, and strive to follow His teachings as described in the three Synoptic Gospels.

 

I am a heretic principally because I find the concept of a Trinity to be ludicrous.

 

That said, I do not believe the "Spirit of God" can be separated from god in any way, and any blasphemy against the spirit is blasphemy against all of god.

 

that is a well thought out answer and if you believe and follow Jesus do you believe he was the son of God or god incarnate?

 

I believe that Jesus was a child of god, as we all are.

 

As a mortal Jesus (aka Yeshua ben Pantera) was not god incarnate.

 

The Christ spirit, like our spirits (or souls) are part of god.

 

But that is just my opinion, and I'm not pushing it on anyone else or judging them by it.

 

I was just wondering if you thought he died for your sins and rose again. I am not pushing anything jsut curious. Obviously you are entitled to believe what you want. I ahve never met a person who follows Jesus' teachings and does not believe him to be THE son of God!! So I am very intereested in your logic and why youchoose to follow Christ but do not believe as others!!