The Doom Loop of Oligarchy

[carlfense]

I've always been great at math . . .

 

FWIW, I agree with the rest of your post and it sounds like it mostly mirrors my own life experience. Other than the math part. It's now 12 years later and I'll still never forgive math for what it did to my ACT score. Ever.

[JJ Husker]

If you look at campaign contributions, the Democratic and Republican contributors are vastly different.

 

Major corporations with government contracts, the big financial companies, all of the banks, pretty much anyone in the 1% supports the GOP candidate without question. Why? Should be obvious. They get rewarded with deregulation and tax breaks and the like - the 1% get richer. Meanwhile the Democratic contributors include some corporations (Microsoft I think?), a lot of private universities and organizations, law firms, etc.

 

So you tell me which party has the interest of the American public in mind.

 

Neither one.

 

There are plenty in the 1% that support the dems. Don't let the lip service of the parties overshadow what they actually do. If you think the Dems are somehow different or better than the Repubs in this regard, ........well, I don't think you are really that clueless.

 

Ask yourself who's budget is giving tax cuts to the wealthy while destroying social programs aimed at helping the poor. Which party is acting like health insurance for poor people is the greatest ill this country has ever faced?? I'm not saying the democrats are immune to this issue, but if you don't think they are better than republicans, I don't know what to tell you.

 

I've said this many times, I'm impressed with the Republican party by one thing. They've done a masterful job of convincing working class citizens that their greatest worry should be the tax rate on the wealthy. The democrats haven't done as good of a job at getting their message out in that respect.

 

No doubt the democrats take and maintain the "higher road" on a lot of issues, just like your example suggests. But, if they (either party) were truly doing anything in the peoples best interests, things would be getting better instead of worse. I'm impressed with the democratic party by one thing- they've done a masterful job of convincing people that they are for the little/working class/poor guy.

 

The reality is that both sides thrive on the status quo. Talk is cheap. It may appear to be a one-sided problem in many aspects but it isn't. The bastages have us right where they want us, fighting with each other and not willing to look behind the curtain. If one party were truly any better or different than the other, their control would escalate quickly and things would get better. Let me know when that happens.

[carlfense]

If one party were truly any better or different than the other, their control would escalate quickly and things would get better.

But what if one party or the other founds and tends a media empire almost wholly devoted to peddling a false version of reality?

[JJ Husker]

If one party were truly any better or different than the other, their control would escalate quickly and things would get better.

But what if one party or the other founds and tends a media empire almost wholly devoted to peddling a false version of reality?

 

You threw that out there like it was a hypothetical.... I think both parties have done/are currently doing this. It's the same problem no matter which angle a person tries to look at it. the money and power is concentrated at the top and it would behoove us to concentrate on that wicked cycle of perpetuity rather than trying to blame one or the other political parties. They both benefit greatly from the status quo and don't think for a minute that they don't know it.

[zoogs]

You're also assuming the people know the right way to make things better.

[tschu]

The "yeah well both parties do it" argument is not a good way to approach any issue.

[knapplc]

I think both parties have done/are currently doing this.

 

Yes

 

 

It's the same problem no matter which angle a person tries to look at it.

 

No.

 

 

Both parties do this. The difference is the extent to which they do it, and in that regard, one party far outstrips the other. It's the difference between stealing a car and stealing a dealership's lot full of cars. Both are wrong. One is more wrong, and the law would punish those two thieves differently.

 

Nobody here is saying "Yea, Democrats!" Several of us are saying, "Republicans, you gotta stop." That's where we're approaching this from.

[Junior]

No doubt the democrats take and maintain the "higher road" on a lot of issues, just like your example suggests. But, if they (either party) were truly doing anything in the peoples best interests, things would be getting better instead of worse. I'm impressed with the democratic party by one thing- they've done a masterful job of convincing people that they are for the little/working class/poor guy.

 

The reality is that both sides thrive on the status quo. Talk is cheap. It may appear to be a one-sided problem in many aspects but it isn't. The bastages have us right where they want us, fighting with each other and not willing to look behind the curtain. If one party were truly any better or different than the other, their control would escalate quickly and things would get better. Let me know when that happens.

 

This is silliness. You're trying very hard to come off as middle of the road. However, if you have followed politics for the past... oh... lets go with 10 years, you know one side has driven up this deficit under the guise of patriotism, and currently plans on fixing it by cutting taxes on the wealthy and benefits to the poor. That's the budget Paul Ryan put forth. The other side wants to raise taxes on the upper class as a means to close the deficit and still help the less fortunate.

 

You are lamenting that neither side is doing anything to really help the people, however, the Obama Administration has passed the ACA in order to help more people obtain affordable health insurance, because they are of the belief that the ability to survive cancer shouldn't be dependent on what job you have. Unfortunately, one side has fought that tooth and nail, through manufactured religious infringements, outright deception, and a television network devoted to both. The expansion of medicare in states would help countless people, yet republican state governments have repeatedly denied that benefit to their citizens, and then had the chutzpah to blame Obamacare for it. All in the name of refusing to raise taxes on their wealthy donors.

 

I've not said that either side is perfect, but one side is clearly worse than the other right now. Your unwillingness to acknowledge that right now, at this time, one party has aligned itself with big money donors more so than the other ("Corporations are people too, my friend") speaks volumes.

[sd'sker]

I'm impressed with the democratic party by one thing- they've done a masterful job of convincing people that they are for the little/working class/poor guy.

between the two parties, the working class only stands a chance with one. the one that wants universal healthcare, a higher minimum wage (love this link), and equal pay for equal work (how anyone could be opposed to that is baffling).

 

this is much less deceptive than what the republicans have done. which is to pay rich people to convince middle-class people to blame poor people.

 

and the real issue of it all is that republicans are hardly even trying anymore to keep up any facade. they are just obstructionist with one goal, lower taxes for wealthy by any means necessary.

[JJ Husker]

The "yeah well both parties do it" argument is not a good way to approach any issue.

 

That is not the argument or point I was trying to make. The repubs, going on quite awhile now, have been the greatest offenders by far. I am not attempting to excuse what they're doing by pointing out that the dems do it also. My point is much deeper and far more cynical. I believe both sides feed off of the other with the goal being to keep the status quo. The status quo being wealth accumulating at the top and the top controlling our political system and the vicious cycle that perpetuates. IMO, it is far too easy and simple to say the dems are trying to fix these inequities because they happen to be the ones talking about them. I believe the only goal from either party is to keep contributions flowing in and keep getting people re-elected. Period. I don't for one minute believe that any of them collectively want one f'ing thing to change. I could go on a long winded rant here but I think it really should be obvious to anyone paying attention. I am convinced nothing short of open rebellion in the streets will begin to fix our problems. Our way of government is beyond broken. Not only isn't it getting better, it can't get better IMO. So yeah, basically we're F'd. That was my point.

[Junior]

That is not the argument or point I was trying to make. The repubs, going on quite awhile now, have been the greatest offenders by far.

 

So, did you vote Romney or Obama?

[JJ Husker]

That is not the argument or point I was trying to make. The repubs, going on quite awhile now, have been the greatest offenders by far.

 

So, did you vote Romney or Obama?

 

Romney. But it was much more of a vote against Obama than it was any sort of vote for Romney. I really don't see what this has to do with the discussion at hand but you asked and now ya know.

[Junior]

That is not the argument or point I was trying to make. The repubs, going on quite awhile now, have been the greatest offenders by far.

 

So, did you vote Romney or Obama?

 

Romney. But it was much more of a vote against Obama than it was any sort of vote for Romney. I really don't see what this has to do with the discussion at hand but you asked and now ya know.

 

Just curious... you say the Republicans have been the greatest offenders "by far" and yet you voted Republican. Trying to understand the thought process.

[commando]

fwiw.....to me it seems that voting for either party is much like choosing which side of the sh#t sandwich you prefer to take your bite from. it may be your favorite side...but it is still the same sh#t sandwich any way you look at it.

[strigori]

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. We can get a majority of corporate money out of politics with a simple law that should get upheld by even this SCOTUS. Its simply, every penny donated to a politician, political party, organization, or PAC must be disclosed, on an online public website within 48 hours of receiving said money. Most corporations end up in a sticky spot where they piss off half of the population, and with how social media works, they may well damage their company, so that money stops cold. Right now they get to hide who they are backing.