Taylor Martinez Sports Science

[Ratt Mhule]

You said "The 80 yard TD drive would never have happened if Martinez never threw that pass," as if that somehow answered my point about the defense giving up four scoring drives of 50+ yards, including a four-play 80-yard drive.

 

If you're saying the whole team is to blame for the loss, we're saying the same thing. If you're saying Martinez shoulders more of the blame, the facts don't back it up.

 

That is a true statement about that ONE scoring drive. If the INT was not thrown, they would not have gotten the ball on the 20 yrd. line and then the defense would not have given up an 80 yrd. TD drive. If we kick the field goal, who knows what would have happened on OUs next drive. Did the defense give up the TD, yes, did the offense have something to do with it by turning the ball over in the redzone, yes.

 

And no, we are not saying the same thing, you said in a earlier post the defense is to blame for this loss and Im saying they are not. It was the offense that cost us this game, not Martinez, not Helu, not Watson, the entire offense.

 

Then kindly explain how the entire offense allowed Oklahoma to score 23 points, giving up a 17-point lead, and surrendering four 50+ yard scoring drives.

 

I already did. Three turnovers on four possessions doesn't help the defense one bit. Neither does scoring only three points in the last three quarters. Do you expect the defense to pitch a shutout? Do you blame the defense for the Texas CCG the year before? They gave up 13 points.

[knapplc]

You said "The 80 yard TD drive would never have happened if Martinez never threw that pass," as if that somehow answered my point about the defense giving up four scoring drives of 50+ yards, including a four-play 80-yard drive.

 

If you're saying the whole team is to blame for the loss, we're saying the same thing. If you're saying Martinez shoulders more of the blame, the facts don't back it up.

 

That is a true statement about that ONE scoring drive. If the INT was not thrown, they would not have gotten the ball on the 20 yrd. line and then the defense would not have given up an 80 yrd. TD drive. If we kick the field goal, who knows what would have happened on OUs next drive. Did the defense give up the TD, yes, did the offense have something to do with it by turning the ball over in the redzone, yes.

 

And no, we are not saying the same thing, you said in a earlier post the defense is to blame for this loss and Im saying they are not. It was the offense that cost us this game, not Martinez, not Helu, not Watson, the entire offense.

 

Then kindly explain how the entire offense allowed Oklahoma to score 23 points, giving up a 17-point lead, and surrendering four 50+ yard scoring drives.

 

I already did. Three turnovers on four possessions doesn't help the defense one bit. Neither does scoring only three points in the last three quarters. Do you expect the defense to pitch a shutout? Do you blame the defense for the Texas CCG the year before? They gave up 13 points.

 

Actually, you didn't. You didn't explain how the offense made the defense give up a four-play, 80-yard scoring drive. Or three other drives in excess of 50 yards.

 

You seem to be having difficulty with cause-and-effect. You're saying THE REASON Oklahoma scored on a four-play drive is BECAUSE Taylor Martinez threw a pick. Not true. There is nothing about that interception that NECESSARILY meant Oklahoma would score a touchdown, and so easily. That TD is entirely on the defense.

 

Taylor was not on the field when any of Oklahoma's points were scored. Further, his turnover put the ball 80 yards from the end zone. That is well within the capabilities of the Blackshirts to stop, but instead of stopping Oklahoma, they rolled over. In four plays.

 

That is not Taylor Martinez' fault.

 

I'll repeat it again - the entire team is to blame for losing that game. Everyone, from Bo to the backups. Taylor is in part, but so is every member of that defense.

[Ratt Mhule]

You said "The 80 yard TD drive would never have happened if Martinez never threw that pass," as if that somehow answered my point about the defense giving up four scoring drives of 50+ yards, including a four-play 80-yard drive.

 

If you're saying the whole team is to blame for the loss, we're saying the same thing. If you're saying Martinez shoulders more of the blame, the facts don't back it up.

 

That is a true statement about that ONE scoring drive. If the INT was not thrown, they would not have gotten the ball on the 20 yrd. line and then the defense would not have given up an 80 yrd. TD drive. If we kick the field goal, who knows what would have happened on OUs next drive. Did the defense give up the TD, yes, did the offense have something to do with it by turning the ball over in the redzone, yes.

 

And no, we are not saying the same thing, you said in a earlier post the defense is to blame for this loss and Im saying they are not. It was the offense that cost us this game, not Martinez, not Helu, not Watson, the entire offense.

 

Then kindly explain how the entire offense allowed Oklahoma to score 23 points, giving up a 17-point lead, and surrendering four 50+ yard scoring drives.

 

I already did. Three turnovers on four possessions doesn't help the defense one bit. Neither does scoring only three points in the last three quarters. Do you expect the defense to pitch a shutout? Do you blame the defense for the Texas CCG the year before? They gave up 13 points.

 

Actually, you didn't. You didn't explain how the offense made the defense give up a four-play, 80-yard scoring drive. Or three other drives in excess of 50 yards.

 

You seem to be having difficulty with cause-and-effect. You're saying THE REASON Oklahoma scored on a four-play drive is BECAUSE Taylor Martinez threw a pick. Not true. There is nothing about that interception that NECESSARILY meant Oklahoma would score a touchdown, and so easily. That TD is entirely on the defense.

 

Taylor was not on the field when any of Oklahoma's points were scored. Further, his turnover put the ball 80 yards from the end zone. That is well within the capabilities of the Blackshirts to stop, but instead of stopping Oklahoma, they rolled over. In four plays.

 

That is not Taylor Martinez' fault.

 

I'll repeat it again - the entire team is to blame for losing that game. Everyone, from Bo to the backups. Taylor is in part, but so is every member of that defense.

 

You didn't answer my question, do you expect the defense to pitch a shutout every game? And do you blame the defense for our loss against Texas in 2009 CCG for giving up more than 1 point?

[skersfan]

It amazes me how we can watch a video telling us just how fantastic the kid is when healthy and not even consider it. We have never had a athlete of his level is basically what the video is saying. Maybe not just Nebraska but in all of college football. Listen to the video and be thankful he is on our sideline.

 

This kid is special, problems with him for sure, but the fan base blaming him for everything but the death of Christ is getting sickening.

 

He did his best. He did his best while suffering two very limiting injuries. And yes those injuries did affect his decesion making, his throwing motion, his ability to trust his elusiveness. Injuries change things from normal.

 

I hope he heals and has a great season, but if he does not start this year, I will be cheering for whoever starts and wishing them luck, just as I do Taylor.

[zoogs]

I am sick of this blame the player, blame Watson, blame anyone but the individual responsible for it.

 

Bo is the problem, he decides to play a player that is injured, that according to some is not qualified to play the position. Bo is responsible for the failure. .

 

Get off the kids who are trying their guts out. Blame the one that is responsible for the problems.

 

Our defense is better than it was and is moving in the right direction, but it has cost games, Washington II was a joke on both sides of the ball. WAh I do not want to play them again is crap. WE ARE NEBRASKA. PRIDE TRADITION ON AND ON.

 

Poor leadership at the top caused that loss. Who is that?

 

I agree.

 

I am glad that Bo is here, but these decisions lay at his feet. If we think they are questionable, Bo is the person to blame. But when we talk about why we think it's questionable, you might say, "_____ was not a good option for this game compared to _____" - a little different from blaming the player, because after all, it's not the player's fault that he was chosen to run on the field.

[huskerscott]

One thing I noticed when watching that video. Watch the DEs crash down on Helu every single time. Also this video was done before Taylor got hurt and against terrible defenses, hince the DEs always crashing. Later teams figured out the zone read, by keeping the DEs to stay home and the LB coming down to clog the middle. It certainly didnt help our offense playing faster and more disciplined defenses as the season went on.

[skersfan]

I think the injuries changed the whole situation. He played well against Texas, we could not catch the ball, he played well against Oklahoma State, and did pretty good against Missouri, I think we were up 20 some points when he got hurt. Missouri had just knocked off Oklahoma the weekend before.

 

Some people can work through/play through injury, somc can not. He was forced to it appears to me. We have no real idea of what the affect on him was, but all will agree after Missouri he was never even close to the same.

 

A lot of things that upset people were the rumors running around about him and the team, which have never been proven true and denied by all that are asked, this seemed to turn the fan base against him. It was not fair. He may be a roaring @hole, I have no idea, but he suffered for being one either way.

 

It all goes back to one thing. He was the best we had, and he did not start himself. He can only do what he is told. If his choices were bad, he was not coached up properly, not prepared. If he was injured and it affected his play that is not on him.

 

Bo felt even injured he gave Nebraska the best chance of winning. That is the bottom line. If you do not believe that, then you do not believe what Bo says all the time. Open competition every week. The best will play period.

[knapplc]

You said "The 80 yard TD drive would never have happened if Martinez never threw that pass," as if that somehow answered my point about the defense giving up four scoring drives of 50+ yards, including a four-play 80-yard drive.

 

If you're saying the whole team is to blame for the loss, we're saying the same thing. If you're saying Martinez shoulders more of the blame, the facts don't back it up.

 

That is a true statement about that ONE scoring drive. If the INT was not thrown, they would not have gotten the ball on the 20 yrd. line and then the defense would not have given up an 80 yrd. TD drive. If we kick the field goal, who knows what would have happened on OUs next drive. Did the defense give up the TD, yes, did the offense have something to do with it by turning the ball over in the redzone, yes.

 

And no, we are not saying the same thing, you said in a earlier post the defense is to blame for this loss and Im saying they are not. It was the offense that cost us this game, not Martinez, not Helu, not Watson, the entire offense.

 

Then kindly explain how the entire offense allowed Oklahoma to score 23 points, giving up a 17-point lead, and surrendering four 50+ yard scoring drives.

 

I already did. Three turnovers on four possessions doesn't help the defense one bit. Neither does scoring only three points in the last three quarters. Do you expect the defense to pitch a shutout? Do you blame the defense for the Texas CCG the year before? They gave up 13 points.

 

Actually, you didn't. You didn't explain how the offense made the defense give up a four-play, 80-yard scoring drive. Or three other drives in excess of 50 yards.

 

You seem to be having difficulty with cause-and-effect. You're saying THE REASON Oklahoma scored on a four-play drive is BECAUSE Taylor Martinez threw a pick. Not true. There is nothing about that interception that NECESSARILY meant Oklahoma would score a touchdown, and so easily. That TD is entirely on the defense.

 

Taylor was not on the field when any of Oklahoma's points were scored. Further, his turnover put the ball 80 yards from the end zone. That is well within the capabilities of the Blackshirts to stop, but instead of stopping Oklahoma, they rolled over. In four plays.

 

That is not Taylor Martinez' fault.

 

I'll repeat it again - the entire team is to blame for losing that game. Everyone, from Bo to the backups. Taylor is in part, but so is every member of that defense.

 

You didn't answer my question, do you expect the defense to pitch a shutout every game? And do you blame the defense for our loss against Texas in 2009 CCG for giving up more than 1 point?

The reason I didn't answer your question is because it's irrelevant to the point, and therefore I figured it was rhetorical. Since it wasn't:

 

Of course I don't expect the defense to pitch a shutout. But I also don't expect them to lay down on a drive like they did, giving up 80 yards and a TD in four plays. If they simply play like they should have, like they are eminently capable of, they would have stopped OU from scoring from their own 20 yard line. Instead, they played like ass, gave up huge plays, and that contributed to the loss.

 

It was not the sole cause of the loss. The defense was not solely to blame. They were part of the problem, which I've now said about seven times, and they will admit that to you if you ask them. I know that, because I have talked to two guys about that drive.

 

We hit a wall in that game, and the entire team, not just the offense or the offensive coaches, but the whole team contributed to the loss.

[Ratt Mhule]

Of course I don't expect the defense to pitch a shutout. But I also don't expect them to lay down on a drive like they did, giving up 80 yards and a TD in four plays. If they simply play like they should have, like they are eminently capable of, they would have stopped OU from scoring from their own 20 yard line. Instead, they played like ass, gave up huge plays, and that contributed to the loss.

 

Well, let's just agree to disagree. I thought the defense played well for the most part. One long drive does not determine who wins the game. Im sure Auburns defense gave up a few 80 yard TD drives this year, but they went undefeated. Who knows what would have happened if we would have scored on the INT drive we had going. We were up 17-0 with all the momentum. We could have put a dagger through their heart had we scored. Instead we turn it over and OU gets life back in them and the rest is history. Hopefully, the past doesn't repeat itself.

[zoogs]

It was a whole team loss and the defense has to shoulder its part in the blame. But that was a critical moment in the game where as Po says, we could've driven a dagger through. Instead, because of a horrendously poor decision, we lose that opportunity.

[Pedro Guerrero]

I have seen several people predict that Taylor gets hurt. What kind of crystal ball do you have that you can foresee injuries?

 

How many games in his one year career has he been fully healthy? How many games has he been injured? I believe the answer to both is 7.

 

So aren’t the people who are “predicting” his staying healthy basing their “predictions” off of the same information that the people that are “predicting” an injury?

 

Since when do people need to base their “predications” off of facts?

[knapplc]

I have seen several people predict that Taylor gets hurt. What kind of crystal ball do you have that you can foresee injuries?

 

How many games in his one year career has he been fully healthy? How many games has he been injured? I believe the answer to both is 7.

 

So aren’t the people who are “predicting” his staying healthy basing their “predictions” off of the same information that the people that are “predicting” an injury?

 

Since when do people need to base their “predications” off of facts?

 

Really? This is what you have?

 

Something as unforeseeable as an injury can't be "predicted." It's like predicting winning the lottery.

 

I would think that would be obvious.

[Pedro Guerrero]

I have seen several people predict that Taylor gets hurt. What kind of crystal ball do you have that you can foresee injuries?

 

How many games in his one year career has he been fully healthy? How many games has he been injured? I believe the answer to both is 7.

 

So aren’t the people who are “predicting” his staying healthy basing their “predictions” off of the same information that the people that are “predicting” an injury?

 

Since when do people need to base their “predications” off of facts?

 

Really? This is what you have?

 

Something as unforeseeable as an injury can't be "predicted." It's like predicting winning the lottery.

 

I would think that would be obvious.

 

If people can’t predict he will get hurt why can people predict that he won’t get hurt? Can the people predicting that he won’t get hurt see into the future? Do they have crystal balls telling them this?

[knapplc]

Who is predicting he won't get hurt? I haven't seen that in this thread. I think you're misreading what people are saying. Saying that "you can't predict he will get hurt" doesn't mean you're predicting he won't.

 

 

EDIT - Taylor Martinez' future injured/non-injured status is essentially Schroedinger's Cat. The trap you're falling into is in believing that disagreeing with the ability to predict the unpredictable equates to predicting the opposite. It does not.

[Hunter94]

since he has only played one year, i don't even think one could say he is injury prone, let alone predict he could or is likely to get hurt again, although i do believe he was never given a chance to heal up and i hope that doesn't mean this will be a cronic type injury that will just never go away...anyone got a durability record when he was in high school?