Alleged Miami Violations "Biggest NCAA Investigators Have Ever Seen"

[tschu]

I missed the part where Shapiro is only 5'5" ...that is fantastic

[Husker_x]

The problem with the whole SMU argument is that I don't believe that's the most relevant precedent. The most relevant precedent is USC. USC, who we'll all remember was slammed to the tune of 30 schollies and two years without a bowl, the harshest penalty in recent memory. What USC did looks like playing Candy Land past bedtime compared to the U's antics.

 

Forget which was worse, SMU or Miami. Just look at the infractions, the length, the breadth, and the depth of them. Consider that they are now repeat violators. To me the Death Penalty is the only punishment fitting this kind of corruption. When you have a handful of coaches and dozens of players involved for the better part of a decade, what else is just? You couldn't strip enough schollies to make it fair after what they did to USC.

[Nebula]

I missed the part where Shapiro is only 5'5" ...that is fantastic

 

What's wrong with being 5'5"?

[tschu]

I'm 6'7" so I tend to, you know, look down on the 5'5"ers...

[redblooded]

Maybe it was a tad disingenuous to not do the present value calculations back to 1985 in my post, but that starts making things more complicated then they really need to be first thing in the morning.

 

It's hard to compare actual value (since we don't really know grand totals for either case) but in the end the value isn't going to make a damn bit of difference because both are so outrageous in the first place.

 

It'll be tough to accurately compare them till the notices come down. I'm sticking with this one is bigger.

 

As far as the SMU 5x probation in 11 years, I wouldn't discount the fact that this will put Miami on a 20 year running stretch of violations with 2 repeats. At some point that stops being a "well its more spread out so its not as bad" situation and turns into a "christ, really? they've kept repeat violator status since their 1995 case with 400k of improper benefits and pell-grant fraud?" situation.

 

I certainly wouldn't want to be a fan of either school.

 

I won't even attempt to predict the punishment that comes down, but whatever dreams they had of "da U" making a comeback ain't happening for a long time if ever.

[redblooded]

The problem with the whole SMU argument is that I don't believe that's the most relevant precedent. The most relevant precedent is USC. USC, who we'll all remember was slammed to the tune of 30 schollies and two years without a bowl, the harshest penalty in recent memory. What USC did looks like playing Candy Land past bedtime compared to the U's antics.

 

Forget which was worse, SMU or Miami. Just look at the infractions, the length, the breadth, and the depth of them. Consider that they are now repeat violators. To me the Death Penalty is the only punishment fitting this kind of corruption. When you have a handful of coaches and dozens of players involved for the better part of a decade, what else is just? You couldn't strip enough schollies to make it fair after what they did to USC.

 

Also consider the man who lectured USC as the head of the infractions committee about "high-profile athletes demand high-profile compliance" and was pushing for harsher punishments was the AD at Miami while this was going on.

 

It's just so beyond sad the state of the NCAA and college football is what it is now that it is funny.

[NebHusker72]

So what do you do if you are Al Golden/Jim Larranaga(sp?)? Do you stick around? Do you wait this year until jobs come open after the seasons and then leave?

 

What does Mizzery do? They now have a coach implicated by name in this mess!

[VectorVictor]

But people tend to have a recency bias, and seeing the words "prostitutes" "strip clubs" and "abortion" tends to inflate the severity of this stuff in people's minds.

 

And remember, Florida is a reddish state--these words tend to exacerbate things in such locations.

 

 

---

 

 

Also, people keep bringing up the USC debacle, but how many players were ever implicated in that mess, and for how many years? I thought it was only (only!) twenty or so players over Pete's reign.

 

If I'm remembering correctly, USC's infractions would be small potatoes compared to what Yahoo Sports dug up on Miami.

 

Plus, let's look at it this way--would giving the death penalty to Miami kill the ACC in either the short or long term? Probably not, especially with expansion on the horizon.

 

USC getting the death penalty...that's more of a linchpin program for the Pac-12, and it's temporary removal would likely cause the Pac-12 to collapse in on itself. Ohio State, same thing.

 

Even though it shouldn't be, I'm sure the program's importance to the conference is being taken into account here...and Miami really isn't all that special to the ACC, and Miami has willingly played the villain since the 80s.

 

This alone makes them the perfect program to make an example of.

[knapplc]

[redblooded]

But people tend to have a recency bias, and seeing the words "prostitutes" "strip clubs" and "abortion" tends to inflate the severity of this stuff in people's minds.

 

And remember, Florida is a reddish state--these words tend to exacerbate things in such locations.

 

 

---

 

 

Also, people keep bringing up the USC debacle, but how many players were ever implicated in that mess, and for how many years? I thought it was only (only!) twenty or so players over Pete's reign.

 

If I'm remembering correctly, USC's infractions would be small potatoes compared to what Yahoo Sports dug up on Miami.

 

Plus, let's look at it this way--would giving the death penalty to Miami kill the ACC in either the short or long term? Probably not, especially with expansion on the horizon.

 

USC getting the death penalty...that's more of a linchpin program for the Pac-12, and it's temporary removal would likely cause the Pac-12 to collapse in on itself. Ohio State, same thing.

 

Even though it shouldn't be, I'm sure the program's importance to the conference is being taken into account here...and Miami really isn't all that special to the ACC, and Miami has willingly played the villain since the 80s.

 

This alone makes them the perfect program to make an example of.

 

How many players got USC their penalties? http://www.ncaa.org/wps/wcm/connect/d28c898042cdd2bc958fd5a6e282e000/20100610+USC+Public+Report.pdf?MOD=AJPERES&CACHEID=d28c898042cdd2bc958fd5a6e282e000

 

(A) 2.

 

When you start doling out punishment because of someones status as a powerhouse (or not) in a conference you lose legitimacy as an impartial enforcement body. Which is already thought of as arbitrary in it's enforcement. More of that would be bad.

[knapplc]

LSUFreek knocking these out quite quickly now.

 

 

[BOJ]

We could be sitting here thinking about how we Just won this title or that title.... not to say that Nebraska was innocent of all wrong doing during the glory years.... but overall nothing remotely close to auburn Ohio St. Miami smu ou. I'm proud to say overall things were done the right way at Nebraska.

I am a little bias, but I have to say, what "allegedly" happened at Miami and Auburn and what did happen at SMU and Oklahoma aren't even in the same ballpark as what happened at OSU.

 

Let's not forget there is a Nebraska player in one of those photographs, I know the guy is a Miami booster, but if any college football fan should learn anything from all these experiences it is that no fan of any program should go throwing stones as we all live in glass houses and any program could be "outed" at any time.

[BOJ]

We could be sitting here thinking about how we Just won this title or that title.... not to say that Nebraska was innocent of all wrong doing during the glory years.... but overall nothing remotely close to auburn Ohio St. Miami smu ou. I'm proud to say overall things were done the right way at Nebraska.

I am a little bias, but I have to say, what "allegedly" happened at Miami and Auburn and what did happen at SMU and Oklahoma aren't even in the same ballpark as what happened at OSU.

Sorry to quote my own reply, but what I mean by that is: players selling their own property for nominal money and what occurred at these other schools is not comparable; at least not from a homer's point of view. Me selling my own trophy and you paying me money because I play football are two different things, at the end of the day in the first scenario, you got something in return for the money a trophy that has value and I originally owned it, in the second you got nothing in return except a future hand in my pocket. Huge difference.

[VectorVictor]

But people tend to have a recency bias, and seeing the words "prostitutes" "strip clubs" and "abortion" tends to inflate the severity of this stuff in people's minds.

 

And remember, Florida is a reddish state--these words tend to exacerbate things in such locations.

 

 

---

 

 

Also, people keep bringing up the USC debacle, but how many players were ever implicated in that mess, and for how many years? I thought it was only (only!) twenty or so players over Pete's reign.

 

If I'm remembering correctly, USC's infractions would be small potatoes compared to what Yahoo Sports dug up on Miami.

 

Plus, let's look at it this way--would giving the death penalty to Miami kill the ACC in either the short or long term? Probably not, especially with expansion on the horizon.

 

USC getting the death penalty...that's more of a linchpin program for the Pac-12, and it's temporary removal would likely cause the Pac-12 to collapse in on itself. Ohio State, same thing.

 

Even though it shouldn't be, I'm sure the program's importance to the conference is being taken into account here...and Miami really isn't all that special to the ACC, and Miami has willingly played the villain since the 80s.

 

This alone makes them the perfect program to make an example of.

 

How many players got USC their penalties? http://www.ncaa.org/wps/wcm/connect/d28c898042cdd2bc958fd5a6e282e000/20100610+USC+Public+Report.pdf?MOD=AJPERES&CACHEID=d28c898042cdd2bc958fd5a6e282e000

 

(A) 2.

 

When you start doling out punishment because of someones status as a powerhouse (or not) in a conference you lose legitimacy as an impartial enforcement body. Which is already thought of as arbitrary in it's enforcement. More of that would be bad.

 

Yet, we have judges that do that very thing in our legal system--they weight punishment against the crime, impact to dependents/innocents, and the defendant's importance, political climate (if the judges are voted on), among other factors.

 

Not saying it's right, but there's a precedent in our own judicial system of this taking place. I would think it's not a reasonable stretch to see this occur when the NCAA doles out punishment.

 

The NCAA said they weren't going to let schools get away with this any more. You have a school that's been trying to get away with it since 2002 (and earlier, more than likely). You have a school whose AD was on the NCAA committee that personally lambasted USC for lack of oversight for their infractions, and now his (former) school is the one with the lack of oversight.

 

I promise that if there's a death penalty levied, it's because of politics and the lack of importance on the part of the Miami program in the grand scheme of things. The NCAA is backed into a corner on this one, and the school is more or less a disposable one on the whole collegiate football landscape.

[knapplc]

Mark Emmert says the NCAA has been investigating this for five months:

 

 

NCAA President Mark Emmert responds to Miami allegations

 

If the assertions are true, the alleged conduct at the University of Miami is an illustration of the need for serious and fundamental change in many critical aspects of college sports. This pertains especially to the involvement of boosters and agents with student-athletes. While many are hearing about this case for the first time, the NCAA has been investigating the matter for five months. The serious threats to the integrity of college sports are one of the key reasons why I called together more than 50 presidents and chancellors last week to drive substantive changes to Division I intercollegiate athletics.

 

So... does this mean we'll be seeing penalties to Miami sooner rather than later? And why are currently active players named by the Yahoo! article like Jacory Harris, among others, still practicing with the team?