HuskerShark Posted March 6, 2012 Author Share Posted March 6, 2012 You don't have to beg for anything. You just have to show God that you love Him and trust him, and that is said to be your admittance into Heaven. There is a biblical saying that my friend always tells me: Salvation is not in the works. If you don't know what that means, I will spell it out for you. The works refers to the things that we do in our lifetime. Therefore, your salvation does not depend on what amount of sin that you carry, but rather if you trust and believe in Jesus Christ as your savior. That's not to say that the works have nothing to do with your right to eternal life. My interpretation of the Bible is that God wants us to be living examples of His word. Therefore if you are a horrible person and murder others and commit rape, etc. then it could be said that you are not a living example of His word and do not fully trust and believe in Him. At least that is what I get out of that portion of the Bible when I read it. Just to be clear, I am not saying these things to try and force anyone to believe, just clearing up the misconception that strigori stated. But your quote goes the other way too. Those who live a great life, love everyone, help the homeless, donate time and money to worthy causes, etc...but just don't happen to believe Jesus is their savior, means they are going to hell. In other words, your god cares more about what you believe and not your actions. Why is that a quality you want in a god? You're right, it could go the other way. Let's say that you live a great life and help others just out of the goodness of your heart. I'm sure once you die and get to the gates of Heaven and see what awaits you, you will become a believer pretty quickly. No one has all the answers, but my intuition tells me that is how it works. Link to comment
bennychico11 Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 But my question is; what kind of reward can you be expecting to receive at the end of your life and exactly who is going to bestow that reward? I expect to receive my rewards during my life, not after I'm underground. The whole idea of an afterlife is seems bizarre and a little sad to me. Likewise. But I'd also like to add that your memory after you die...is probably even more of a reward than heaven. To die and then be remembered fondly by all your loved ones. To die and have your 'legacy' live on in your children. To know that you lived a full life. That's the reward I want. 1 Link to comment
bennychico11 Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 But my question is; what kind of reward can you be expecting to receive at the end of your life and exactly who is going to bestow that reward? I expect to receive my rewards during my life, not after I'm underground. The whole idea of an afterlife is seems bizarre and a little sad to me. I guess we will all find out someday. There have been numerous accounts of people who have died, been brought back to life, and said that while they were dead they saw a bright white light. If you have never heard them, you should do a quick search. It really is an amazing thing. Of course, cynical non-believers will attribute the white light to chemcals being released as the brain shuts down. As we've all seen on this board, non-believers find any reason they can to dismiss things like that and attribute it to "science." The soul is an energy, and it will still exist long after we are dead. Not cynical...but maybe more logical about it. There's been experiments done where scientists can manipulate the brain into the same response. You have to realize, like you said, the patient is near death. Their brain is deprived of oxygen and may have other damage to itself. To expect it to be totally coherent, is asking a lot. Think about how you are each morning after having an extremely vivid dream. The brain can play tricks on you. Look up the "god helmet" Link to comment
bennychico11 Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 You're right, it could go the other way. Let's say that you live a great life and help others just out of the goodness of your heart. I'm sure once you die and get to the gates of Heaven and see what awaits you, you will become a believer pretty quickly. No one has all the answers, but my intuition tells me that is how it works. But according to your theology it won't matter...it'll be too late for me. Still, I can be a believer in it, and not agree with it. Link to comment
HuskerShark Posted March 6, 2012 Author Share Posted March 6, 2012 But my question is; what kind of reward can you be expecting to receive at the end of your life and exactly who is going to bestow that reward? I expect to receive my rewards during my life, not after I'm underground. The whole idea of an afterlife is seems bizarre and a little sad to me. I guess we will all find out someday. There have been numerous accounts of people who have died, been brought back to life, and said that while they were dead they saw a bright white light. If you have never heard them, you should do a quick search. It really is an amazing thing. Of course, cynical non-believers will attribute the white light to chemcals being released as the brain shuts down. As we've all seen on this board, non-believers find any reason they can to dismiss things like that and attribute it to "science." The soul is an energy, and it will still exist long after we are dead. Not cynical...but maybe more logical about it. There's been experiments done where scientists can manipulate the brain into the same response. You have to realize, like you said, the patient is near death. Their brain is deprived of oxygen and may have other damage to itself. To expect it to be totally coherent, is asking a lot. Think about how you are each morning after having an extremely vivid dream. The brain can play tricks on you. Look up the "god helmet" There have been enough accounts of people having this experience, as well as hearing a calm, loving voice AFTER they have died and their heart has stopped beating to make me believe that it is not science. Link to comment
knapplc Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 I guess we will all find out someday. There have been numerous accounts of people who have died, been brought back to life, and said that while they were dead they saw a bright white light. If you have never heard them, you should do a quick search. It really is an amazing thing. Of course, cynical non-believers will attribute the white light to chemcals being released as the brain shuts down. As we've all seen on this board, non-believers find any reason they can to dismiss things like that and attribute it to "science." The soul is an energy, and it will still exist long after we are dead. I've read numerous accounts of people who have "died" and seen this mysterious white light. I've read the science showing that this is brain-related. Why would you dismiss the idea that this is a natural phenomenon? There is no Biblical foundation for the "white light" being anything related to God. There was never any teaching of Jesus that instructed Christians to think that this is what they would see when they died. So why do you attribute this to something God-related, and not accept the conclusion that it is a result of brain functions shutting down? Link to comment
Husker_x Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 But my question is; what kind of reward can you be expecting to receive at the end of your life and exactly who is going to bestow that reward? I expect to receive my rewards during my life, not after I'm underground. The whole idea of an afterlife is seems bizarre and a little sad to me. I guess we will all find out someday. There have been numerous accounts of people who have died, been brought back to life, and said that while they were dead they saw a bright white light. If you have never heard them, you should do a quick search. It really is an amazing thing. Of course, cynical non-believers will attribute the white light to chemcals being released as the brain shuts down. As we've all seen on this board, non-believers find any reason they can to dismiss things like that and attribute it to "science." The soul is an energy, and it will still exist long after we are dead. Not cynical...but maybe more logical about it. There's been experiments done where scientists can manipulate the brain into the same response. You have to realize, like you said, the patient is near death. Their brain is deprived of oxygen and may have other damage to itself. To expect it to be totally coherent, is asking a lot. Think about how you are each morning after having an extremely vivid dream. The brain can play tricks on you. Look up the "god helmet" There have been enough accounts of people having this experience, as well as hearing a calm, loving voice AFTER they have died and their heart has stopped beating to make me believe that it is not science. You should really do some research into what you're talking about before you form wild conclusions. NDEs are well documented phenomena and a lot of work has gone into building the science of death and dying. Link to comment
carlfense Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 But my question is; what kind of reward can you be expecting to receive at the end of your life and exactly who is going to bestow that reward? I expect to receive my rewards during my life, not after I'm underground. The whole idea of an afterlife is seems bizarre and a little sad to me. I guess we will all find out someday. There have been numerous accounts of people who have died, been brought back to life, and said that while they were dead they saw a bright white light. If you have never heard them, you should do a quick search. It really is an amazing thing. Of course, cynical non-believers will attribute the white light to chemcals being released as the brain shuts down. As we've all seen on this board, non-believers find any reason they can to dismiss things like that and attribute it to "science." The soul is an energy, and it will still exist long after we are dead. Yeah . . . assuming that a medical phenomenon can be attributed to "science" is cynicism. I've heard that some deaths are even attributed to "scientific" things like cancer instead of Satan's influence in our lives. Link to comment
carlfense Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 But my question is; what kind of reward can you be expecting to receive at the end of your life and exactly who is going to bestow that reward? I expect to receive my rewards during my life, not after I'm underground. The whole idea of an afterlife is seems bizarre and a little sad to me. Likewise. But I'd also like to add that your memory after you die...is probably even more of a reward than heaven. To die and then be remembered fondly by all your loved ones. To die and have your 'legacy' live on in your children. To know that you lived a full life. That's the reward I want. Agreed. +1 Link to comment
johnnyrodgers20 Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 But my question is; what kind of reward can you be expecting to receive at the end of your life and exactly who is going to bestow that reward? I expect to receive my rewards during my life, not after I'm underground. The whole idea of an afterlife is seems bizarre and a little sad to me. I guess we will all find out someday. There have been numerous accounts of people who have died, been brought back to life, and said that while they were dead they saw a bright white light. If you have never heard them, you should do a quick search. It really is an amazing thing. Of course, cynical non-believers will attribute the white light to chemcals being released as the brain shuts down. As we've all seen on this board, non-believers find any reason they can to dismiss things like that and attribute it to "science." The soul is an energy, and it will still exist long after we are dead. Yeah . . . assuming that a medical phenomenon can be attributed to "science" is cynicism. I've heard that some deaths are even attributed to "scientific" things like cancer instead of Satan's influence in our lives. Awful cocky for someone who is going to fry. Link to comment
Hoosker Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 What if you try to live a good life, try to always do what you think is right, and just believe that you'll be rewarded somehow after you die? Why does the whole Lord and Savior idea have to be brought into anything if people are capable of passing down good, wholesome values to their children without involving an all-powerful man in the clouds? Is it necessary to living the life we want to live? Nobody is saying you can't be a good person with good values without going to church or otherwise living a religious life. But my question is; what kind of reward can you be expecting to receive at the end of your life and exactly who is going to bestow that reward? Sounds kind of like you expect to win the game without putting in the required work in practice. That's what I'm saying. Nobody has a clue. Nobody knows what's going to happen to them when they die. I guess I think believing in karma does a similar job to having faith in a higher power. They both try and guide you in the right direction by treating others how you want to be treated and all that good stuff. Neither are right/wrong, but I was just curious if anyone else felt the same way I do. I'm skeptical when it comes to why I'm here and what's in store for me in the bigger picture of it all. I think it's good to embrace the POSITIVE lessons that religion offers, but I don't think you need the outrageous story that goes along with it to lead a good, meaningful life. Link to comment
carlfense Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 Awful cocky for someone who is going to fry. Well, johnny, that's not a very Christian thing for you to say? Does your particular sect of Christianity encourage the judging of others? Anyways. You're right. I will fry because I've chosen to be cremated. Link to comment
Enhance Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 But my question is; what kind of reward can you be expecting to receive at the end of your life and exactly who is going to bestow that reward? I expect to receive my rewards during my life, not after I'm underground. The whole idea of an afterlife is seems bizarre and a little sad to me. I guess we will all find out someday. There have been numerous accounts of people who have died, been brought back to life, and said that while they were dead they saw a bright white light. If you have never heard them, you should do a quick search. It really is an amazing thing. Of course, cynical non-believers will attribute the white light to chemcals being released as the brain shuts down. As we've all seen on this board, non-believers find any reason they can to dismiss things like that and attribute it to "science." The soul is an energy, and it will still exist long after we are dead. I love how you continue to berate people who don't think like you. If somebody tries to attribute something to science, they're a "cynical non-believer'. If you have no problem calling others by that name, then I guess you have no problem being dubbed a 'blind religious fool'. Would I be right in this conclusion? Like others on this boards, I've seen scientific evidence showing why people see some sort of white light after they die. It's been scientifically proven that terminally ill people may have a huge spike in brainwave activity before they die, resulting in the brain experiencing a cascade of information overload just before death. I assume you have no problem with doctors knowing how to complete open-heart surgery, but the second doctors begin to test strange bodily phenomena, you cry blasphemy and insinuate they don't know what they're talking about. 1 Link to comment
JJ Husker Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 A few interesting statistics on what Americans believe. 92% believe in God. 85% believe in heaven. 82% believe in miracles 71% believe in the devil 69% believe religion plays too small a role in our lives 15% believe religion plays too large a role in our lives 34% believe in ghosts 34% believe in UFO's 29% believe in Astrology 25% believe in reincarnation I'll be the first to admit that being in the majority is not always what it's cracked up to be but, 92%? People can do what they wish but I would really have to do some serious thinking and possibly re-evaluate my position if I knew 92% of other people disagreed with me on an issue that could have such eternal ramifications. Either that or I would have to be extremely egotistical and self centered to think I was that much smarter or more informed than so many other people. Link to comment
carlfense Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 A few interesting statistics on what Americans believe. 92% believe in God. 85% believe in heaven. 82% believe in miracles 71% believe in the devil 69% believe religion plays too small a role in our lives 15% believe religion plays too large a role in our lives 34% believe in ghosts 34% believe in UFO's 29% believe in Astrology 25% believe in reincarnation I'll be the first to admit that being in the majority is not always what it's cracked up to be but, 92%? People can do what they wish but I would really have to do some serious thinking and possibly re-evaluate my position if I knew 92% of other people disagreed with me on an issue that could have such eternal ramifications. Either that or I would have to be extremely egotistical and self centered to think I was that much smarter or more informed than so many other people. Eh. Everyone believed the world was flat for a long time. Everyone believed that sickness was caused by "bad vapors" for a long time. Etc. How do you feel about the near scientific consensus on global warming? Link to comment
Recommended Posts