Homosexuality - Choice? or Genetic?

[Hoosker]

[Enhance]

Question for you, 308. All people start off as female, correct? It's only through some kind of chromosome interaction that males are created? Is it possible for humans to have other cells grow and mutate to match those of a female despite having that chromosome interaction making it male? Do you kind of see what I'm getting at?

[NUance]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RP_NOuHMhsw

I got nothing to add to this debate. But I thought Ray Gillette might be appropriate.

[Excel]

It's a complicated answer...I think the vast majority of people identifying as or having homosexual urges are born that way in that its in their genes, brains, hormones, chemicals whatever...I'm no scientist.

 

I also think that some people, a very small group, may feel urges out of experiences they had while their sexuality was still forming...maybe they were molested or what have you. Once again, I'm no expert but it seems plausible that such a thing could happen.

 

Finally I think that all acts, consensual ones I mean, are by choice of course. So there we have a convenient answer to the Ancient Greek issue. You can be heterosexual and still commit homosexual acts for any number of reasons;

• Confusion/Exploration: Every student at Women's colleges everywhere, that girl you know that discovers she's a lesbian after a bad break up with a long time boyfriend or Walksalone at band camp his senior year of High School.
  
• Gain (Money/Noteriety): Prostitutes, Adult "Actors/Actresses", Madonna and Britney Spears or those fake Lesbian bloggers that made the news not long ago.
  
• Cultural Influences: Some cultures use homosexual acts as a way of confirming what would 'normally' be heterosexual friendships or non-sexual business/political relationships...like the Greeks did. Others out of severe gender segregation and the repression of prevailing heterosexual feelings like what we see in Afghanistan. In still other places its just culturally in vogue like San Francisco, the University of Minnesota or all of Europe...
  

Anyhow that's my take on it. Back to the OP's question...is Homosexuality a choice or is it biologically predetermined? The answer is quite simple...Yes.

 

All of that said, I don't give two sh!ts how a guy hits his rocks off. Go ahead have sex and get married. Sure I don't like it. I don't want to be involved, as an actor or a passive spectator and thankfully because this is America, I don't have to. I'm tolerant in that sense.

 

To continue my diatribe on the 'tolerance' issue I think we have a problem in this country with confusing the toleration of an act with suporting that act. I tolerate babies crying on an airplane, I don't enjoy it but I live with it because that's what babies do, they cry. I don't support the baby's crying, I don't prod it with a fork to illicit more crying or tell the mother she's doing a great job. I don't have to do that...'toleration' doesn't require it. It's the same with homosexuality.

 

I may not 'like' homosexuality but I tolerate it...and there's a difference between that and 'supporting' it. Toleration is what homosexuals and all other Americans deserve. If we say we are a Country that espouses freedom and wants to maximize it in every way possible then consensual homosexuality must be tolerated. Also, if we say we want our Government to treat every citizen equally (see 14th amdt) and then we also want to govern the conventions of marriage then we must allow homosexuals to marry.

 

As a final caveat to all of this, when I say that I'm not a fan of homosexuality I mean just that...homosexuality. I have no problem with people that happen to be homosexual. Not that I count my friends or classify them into groups and such (that's always been a dead give away for prejudice in my mind....when a person says "Oh I'm not racist I have x amount of black, muslim, gay etc friends) but I do have friends that are gay. I served with people I knew to be gay in the days of DADT and I serve with them now. I have no problem with that. If you're a douchebag who's gay then I don't like you because you're a douche, not because you're gay.

[Hoosker]

It's a complicated answer...I think the vast majority of people identifying as or having homosexual urges are born that way in that its in their genes, brains, hormones, chemicals whatever...I'm no scientist.

 

I also think that some people, a very small group, may feel urges out of experiences they had while their sexuality was still forming...maybe they were molested or what have you. Once again, I'm no expert but it seems plausible that such a thing could happen.

 

Finally I think that all acts, consensual ones I mean, are by choice of course. So there we have a convenient answer to the Ancient Greek issue. You can be heterosexual and still commit homosexual acts for any number of reasons;

• Confusion/Exploration: Every student at Women's colleges everywhere, that girl you know that discovers she's a lesbian after a bad break up with a long time boyfriend or Walksalone at band camp his senior year of High School.
  
• Gain (Money/Noteriety): Prostitutes, Adult "Actors/Actresses", Madonna and Britney Spears or those fake Lesbian bloggers that made the news not long ago.
  
• Cultural Influences: Some cultures use homosexual acts as a way of confirming what would 'normally' be heterosexual friendships or non-sexual business/political relationships...like the Greeks did. Others out of severe gender segregation and the repression of prevailing heterosexual feelings like what we see in Afghanistan. In still other places its just culturally in vogue like San Francisco, the University of Minnesota or all of Europe...
  

Anyhow that's my take on it. Back to the OP's question...is Homosexuality a choice or is it biologically predetermined? The answer is quite simple...Yes.

 

 

 

 

 

 

All of that said, I don't give two sh!ts how a guy hits his rocks off. Go ahead have sex and get married. Sure I don't like it. I don't want to be involved, as an actor or a passive spectator and thankfully because this is America, I don't have to. I'm tolerant in that sense.

 

To continue my diatribe on the 'tolerance' issue I think we have a problem in this country with confusing the toleration of an act with suporting that act. I tolerate babies crying on an airplane, I don't enjoy it but I live with it because that's what babies do, they cry. I don't support the baby's crying, I don't prod it with a fork to illicit more crying or tell the mother she's doing a great job. I don't have to do that...'toleration' doesn't require it. It's the same with homosexuality.

 

I may not 'like' homosexuality but I tolerate it...and there's a difference between that and 'supporting' it. Toleration is what homosexuals and all other Americans deserve. If we say we are a Country that espouses freedom and wants to maximize it in every way possible then consensual homosexuality must be tolerated. Also, if we say we want our Government to treat every citizen equally (see 14th amdt) and then we also want to govern the conventions of marriage then we must allow homosexuals to marry.

 

As a final caveat to all of this, when I say that I'm not a fan of homosexuality I mean just that...homosexuality. I have no problem with people that happen to be homosexual. Not that I count my friends are classify them into groups and such (that's always been a dead give away for prejudice in my mind....when a person says "Oh I'm not racist I have x amount of black, muslim, gay etc friends) but I do have friends that are gay. I served with people I knew to be gay in the days of DADT and I serve with them now. I have no problem with that. If you're a douchebag who's gay then I don't like you because you're a douche, not because you're gay.

 

Good post.

 

I love it.

[HuskerShark]

It's a complicated answer...I think the vast majority of people identifying as or having homosexual urges are born that way in that its in their genes, brains, hormones, chemicals whatever...I'm no scientist.

 

I also think that some people, a very small group, may feel urges out of experiences they had while their sexuality was still forming...maybe they were molested or what have you. Once again, I'm no expert but it seems plausible that such a thing could happen.

 

Finally I think that all acts, consensual ones I mean, are by choice of course. So there we have a convenient answer to the Ancient Greek issue. You can be heterosexual and still commit homosexual acts for any number of reasons;

• Confusion/Exploration: Every student at Women's colleges everywhere, that girl you know that discovers she's a lesbian after a bad break up with a long time boyfriend or Walksalone at band camp his senior year of High School.
  
• Gain (Money/Noteriety): Prostitutes, Adult "Actors/Actresses", Madonna and Britney Spears or those fake Lesbian bloggers that made the news not long ago.
  
• Cultural Influences: Some cultures use homosexual acts as a way of confirming what would 'normally' be heterosexual friendships or non-sexual business/political relationships...like the Greeks did. Others out of severe gender segregation and the repression of prevailing heterosexual feelings like what we see in Afghanistan. In still other places its just culturally in vogue like San Francisco, the University of Minnesota or all of Europe...
  

Anyhow that's my take on it. Back to the OP's question...is Homosexuality a choice or is it biologically predetermined? The answer is quite simple...Yes.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

All of that said, I don't give two sh!ts how a guy hits his rocks off. Go ahead have sex and get married. Sure I don't like it. I don't want to be involved, as an actor or a passive spectator and thankfully because this is America, I don't have to. I'm tolerant in that sense.

 

To continue my diatribe on the 'tolerance' issue I think we have a problem in this country with confusing the toleration of an act with suporting that act. I tolerate babies crying on an airplane, I don't enjoy it but I live with it because that's what babies do, they cry. I don't support the baby's crying, I don't prod it with a fork to illicit more crying or tell the mother she's doing a great job. I don't have to do that...'toleration' doesn't require it. It's the same with homosexuality.

 

I may not 'like' homosexuality but I tolerate it...and there's a difference between that and 'supporting' it. Toleration is what homosexuals and all other Americans deserve. If we say we are a Country that espouses freedom and wants to maximize it in every way possible then consensual homosexuality must be tolerated. Also, if we say we want our Government to treat every citizen equally (see 14th amdt) and then we also want to govern the conventions of marriage then we must allow homosexuals to marry.

 

As a final caveat to all of this, when I say that I'm not a fan of homosexuality I mean just that...homosexuality. I have no problem with people that happen to be homosexual. Not that I count my friends are classify them into groups and such (that's always been a dead give away for prejudice in my mind....when a person says "Oh I'm not racist I have x amount of black, muslim, gay etc friends) but I do have friends that are gay. I served with people I knew to be gay in the days of DADT and I serve with them now. I have no problem with that. If you're a douchebag who's gay then I don't like you because you're a douche, not because you're gay.

 

Good post.

 

I love it.

 

Same.

[huskerswrkhavoc]

Enhance, I'd still love to see your answer to my question as far as gays and genetics go. If it is purely genetic, as you are suggesting that homosexuals feel, we eventually should see a strong, strong decline in homosexuality as we move on and homosexuality gains more acceptance.

 

As far as the religion goes, I'm Catholic, I practice, and I said other. I definitely don't think it's a choice, but I don't think there is that special 'gay gene' that makes someone gay or not gay. Maybe that's partly because of my age (22), but I don't really allow the Church's stance on things overly influence my views.

I haven't said one way or another whether it's purely genetic. That's why I voted 'other' in this pole, because I just don't know the exact correct answer.

 

All I know is that homosexual people are vehemently against the idea that they choose to be gay, and it isn't who they are. Given they're homosexual, and I'm not, I trust their judgment to a far greater extent than a couple of homosexual critics on Huskerboard.

 

I don't know if you're referring to me when you say "critic" but I am not trying to criticize anything, just understand this topic more. I'm sorry if I made it sound like you thought it was strictly genetic, but I meant the fact that you said gays say it is NOT a choice at all. That I just simply can't believe.

It's more or less directed at shark.

 

Choosing to believe the facts as they are is up to the individual interpreting them. You say you simply can't believe being gay isn't a choice, yet the vast majority of homosexuals claim they didn't simply make a choice to be gay. What, do people (not necessarily you) think others just wake up one morning and proclaim to the world "I choose to be gay today!"? I don't think so. Again, might I direct you to which hand you write with. How did you end up writing with this hand? Did you simply decide one day that you were going to write with a particular hand, or did you write with the hand that felt most comfortable or logic to you?

 

I think knapplc also asks an excellent question.

 

Do you sincerely think you could choose to be gay? Not just tolerate or become accustomed to sex with your same gender, but all the emotional attachment to someone of your gender that you feel for the opposite sex now. Could you choose to do that?

 

To me, the buck stops there. I can't choose to be gay any more than I choose to be straight - I just AM a heterosexual. I don't have emotional attachments with men like I do women, I don't find men sexually attractive. You're heterosexual - did you one day just decide to like women, or have you always just felt like women were the right thing for you?

 

It's the exact same principle. You're not gay, so how can you possibly explain how gay people feel or why they are gay? Like I said - all I know is that the vast majority of gay people claim they didn't choose to be gay. I'm far more likely to side with them over heterosexuals who are just assuming they have the right answer.

 

To answer both your thought and knapp's question, it's why I don't think there is one or the other that solely decides. I think there is obviously some sort of genetic difference between straight and gay individuals, but the way they are brought up and their surroundings make them 'more comfortable' with either a straight or gay lifestyle. I may have a disposition to be right handed, that may be what's 'more comfortable' to me, but if I were to have something bad happen to my right arm or hand when I was really young, or my parents were horrible and tied my right arm behind my back, then I would become more comfortable with my left hand and become 'left-handed.'

 

So no, by no means do I think I could wake up and decide whether to be gay or straight no more than I could decide if I was left-handed or right-handed. It's something that develops over time.

[Excel]

All the answers are here...http://conservapedia...cal_explanation

 

"The causes of homosexuality are attributable to man's sinful nature, nurture and environment, and personal choice"

[bennychico11]

All the answers are here...http://conservapedia...cal_explanation

 

"The causes of homosexuality are attributable to man's sinful nature, nurture and environment, and personal choice"

 

Well, that explains everything then!

[HuskerShark]

All the answers are here...http://conservapedia...cal_explanation

 

"The causes of homosexuality are attributable to man's sinful nature, nurture and environment, and personal choice"

 

Well, that explains everything then!

Yeah, that reasoning totally goes against the motto of the religion forum on this board:

 

"If conventional wisdom can't explain something, it's obviously just science."

 

 

[bennychico11]

All the answers are here...http://conservapedia...cal_explanation

 

"The causes of homosexuality are attributable to man's sinful nature, nurture and environment, and personal choice"

 

Well, that explains everything then!

Yeah, that reasoning totally goes against the motto of the religion forum on this board:

 

"If conventional wisdom can't explain something, it's obviously just science."

 

 

 

And when rationality and science doesn't agree with our religious beliefs...we turn to the magic book to give us answers that do!

 

The second you start spouting off the Bible's rules regarding the "sinful nature" of homosexuals the second you start losing any credibility with me. It's sad to think that the Bible is the only place you get your morality...particularly regarding how you are to view another fellow human being's sexual preference. The great book of "pick and choose your morality!"

[HuskerShark]

And when rationality and science doesn't agree with our religious beliefs...we turn to the magic book to give us answers that do!

 

The second you start spouting off the Bible's rules regarding the "sinful nature" of homosexuals the second you start losing any credibility with me. It's sad to think that the Bible is the only place you get your morality...particularly regarding how you are to view another fellow human being's sexual preference. The great book of "pick and choose your morality!"

 

Cool story bro.

[Excel]

All you dare mock conservipedia? You fools! You shall all pay soon!

[krill]

I totally forgot about that wiki, what a riot.

[Hoosker]

All the answers are here...http://conservapedia...cal_explanation

 

"The causes of homosexuality are attributable to man's sinful nature, nurture and environment, and personal choice"

 

Well, that explains everything then!

Yeah, that reasoning totally goes against the motto of the religion forum on this board:

 

"If conventional wisdom can't explain something, it's obviously just science."

 

 

 

And when rationality and science doesn't agree with our religious beliefs...we turn to the magic book to give us answers that do!

 

The second you start spouting off the Bible's rules regarding the "sinful nature" of homosexuals the second you start losing any credibility with me. It's sad to think that the Bible is the only place you get your morality...particularly regarding how you are to view another fellow human being's sexual preference. The great book of "pick and choose your morality!"

 

Totally agree. It's bizarre to me that people feel like they need that book to help them make decisions in their life. I've never read it, but I'm sure it has plenty of great things in it that mankind can benefit from, but times have changed since that book was written. Humans have evolved and have become more civilized in terms of acceptance. It's along the same lines as slavery. Once thought of as alright, but now that we've grown as a society, we know it's not okay. In my opinion, that's the way I look at homosexuals being accepted. It was once not okay, but we are steadily making progress as a human race in accepting them for who they are.