Failed Wisconsin Recall

[Sargon]

This is the all goes subforum no?

Anyway if not fine I know what you are and I don't need to tell you again.

BTW pussies (not saying you are just sayin') like to hide behind rules such as those they think a lawyer might help them with.

 

I'm just saying that you can't beat me at trolling HB. I've worked very hard to get where I am and I'm not letting some up and comer take that away.

 

The patented triple reverse, time differential fake-out troll, I invented that move. Your skills are nothing.

That's fine pal you be the troll king I'll never try to take that from you. I'll hammer and ridicule you mercilessly as you will certainly deserve but I'll leave your Obaminible position to be yours and only yours. Congrats tenacious loser.

[lo country]

I am hoping that the message it sends to Rep and Dems is that Americans are sick and tired of spending more that we take in, sick of not having a budget, sick of continually raising the debt ceiling, Federally sick of not having a budget passed since 2008.

 

Until Americans realize we have a spending problem and not a taxing problem we are screwed.

[Yossarian]

I am hoping that the message it sends to Rep and Dems is that Americans are sick and tired of spending more that we take in, sick of not having a budget, sick of continually raising the debt ceiling, Federally sick of not having a budget passed since 2008.

 

Until Americans realize we have a spending problem and not a taxing problem we are screwed.

 

The "tax and spenders' had their butts handed to them yesterday in Wisconsin but there are still people who can't accept the voters' decision. Hopefully, the trend will continue through November.

[carlfense]

This recall shouldn't have happened. I did laugh every time I heard someone complaining about unions from outside of Wisconsin pouring money into the state to try to buy the election . . . so there's that.

 

Congratulations to Governor Walker and the Republicans who were so heavily invested in him. That's a big win.

[Count 'Bility]

People were just mad cuz the boss took the titty away. That is all.

[huKSer]

Ideally, in a well oiled Democracy, the people should be able to recall an elected official at any time for his behavior, criminal or not. Recalls, along with direct election of Senators and ballot initiatives, were part of the democratic reforms of the late 1800s pushed by Progressives (before that term came to mean Liberal) that vastly improved our system.

 

These events refine our Democracy. Succeed or fail, they're important in that they allow people a voice and enforce an extra degree of accountability. It was a good thing.

 

Anyhow, this is no great harbinger of things to come, at least not for the state. Walker will loose reelection in '14. He won this one because he had boat loads of outside cash and he was the defining issue of the election. An off year election with little outside funding and he'll lose. That's not a statement about what I think about Walker politically, that's a statement about this kind of election in general.

 

Personally, I don't care for the guy. He's an outsider who clearly has painfully little knowledge of the rich and complicated history of the State. His handling of the collective bargaining ordeal proved that.

 

He was elected as part of the fiscally conservative tea party backlash we saw against the President in 2010. In Wisconsin that movement is very much a fad, foreign even to the State's conservatives who've always been more based on social issues. He won't last.

I think recalls should be restricted to non-policy reasons. He was just elected and did what he promised to do during the campaign. Illegal and immoral (slippery slope there, but more like the SC gov and the South American hottie). If you disagree with the policies there is a remedy. It's called the next election. Otherwise you could throw one recall after another until the guy gets out of office.

[johnnyrodgers20]

Ideally, in a well oiled Democracy, the people should be able to recall an elected official at any time for his behavior, criminal or not. Recalls, along with direct election of Senators and ballot initiatives, were part of the democratic reforms of the late 1800s pushed by Progressives (before that term came to mean Liberal) that vastly improved our system.

 

These events refine our Democracy. Succeed or fail, they're important in that they allow people a voice and enforce an extra degree of accountability. It was a good thing.

 

Anyhow, this is no great harbinger of things to come, at least not for the state. Walker will loose reelection in '14. He won this one because he had boat loads of outside cash and he was the defining issue of the election. An off year election with little outside funding and he'll lose. That's not a statement about what I think about Walker politically, that's a statement about this kind of election in general.

 

Personally, I don't care for the guy. He's an outsider who clearly has painfully little knowledge of the rich and complicated history of the State. His handling of the collective bargaining ordeal proved that.

 

He was elected as part of the fiscally conservative tea party backlash we saw against the President in 2010. In Wisconsin that movement is very much a fad, foreign even to the State's conservatives who've always been more based on social issues. He won't last.

I think recalls should be restricted to non-policy reasons. He was just elected and did what he promised to do during the campaign. Illegal and immoral (slippery slope there, but more like the SC gov and the South American hottie). If you disagree with the policies there is a remedy. It's called the next election. Otherwise you could throw one recall after another until the guy gets out of office.

 

 

Exactly, the Pubs could go around the nation and get recalls from very close races and we would never have any peace. Just constant turnover because we don't like their policies, that would be sheer madness.

[carlfense]

Exactly, the Pubs could go around the nation and get recalls from very close races and we would never have any peace. Just constant turnover because we don't like their policies, that would be sheer madness.

Do you feel the same when it comes to impeachment over trumped up charges?

[huKSer]

Exactly, the Pubs could go around the nation and get recalls from very close races and we would never have any peace. Just constant turnover because we don't like their policies, that would be sheer madness.

Do you feel the same when it comes to impeachment over trumped up charges?

I do. Clinton probably should not have been - the affair didn't really affect his job ability

[carlfense]

Exactly, the Pubs could go around the nation and get recalls from very close races and we would never have any peace. Just constant turnover because we don't like their policies, that would be sheer madness.

Do you feel the same when it comes to impeachment over trumped up charges?

I do. Clinton probably should not have been - the affair didn't really affect his job ability

I think the lying (arguably) aspect was much more serious than the affair itself. I was thinking more about Obama than Clinton. Lots of loose impeachment talk from from Obama opponents.

[Excel]

Ideally, in a well oiled Democracy, the people should be able to recall an elected official at any time for his behavior, criminal or not. Recalls, along with direct election of Senators and ballot initiatives, were part of the democratic reforms of the late 1800s pushed by Progressives (before that term came to mean Liberal) that vastly improved our system.

 

These events refine our Democracy. Succeed or fail, they're important in that they allow people a voice and enforce an extra degree of accountability. It was a good thing.

 

Anyhow, this is no great harbinger of things to come, at least not for the state. Walker will loose reelection in '14. He won this one because he had boat loads of outside cash and he was the defining issue of the election. An off year election with little outside funding and he'll lose. That's not a statement about what I think about Walker politically, that's a statement about this kind of election in general.

 

Personally, I don't care for the guy. He's an outsider who clearly has painfully little knowledge of the rich and complicated history of the State. His handling of the collective bargaining ordeal proved that.

 

He was elected as part of the fiscally conservative tea party backlash we saw against the President in 2010. In Wisconsin that movement is very much a fad, foreign even to the State's conservatives who've always been more based on social issues. He won't last.

I think recalls should be restricted to non-policy reasons. He was just elected and did what he promised to do during the campaign. Illegal and immoral (slippery slope there, but more like the SC gov and the South American hottie). If you disagree with the policies there is a remedy. It's called the next election. Otherwise you could throw one recall after another until the guy gets out of office.

 

It sounds like you either;

 

1. Feel recall efforts could become frequent and frivolous. Petition minimums help prevent this, that's why we don't see them now.

2. Think that regularly scheduled elections suffice. That's a fine and fully respectable position but what if an elected executive and a requisite number of legislators went off the deep end enacting policies their constituents disagree with? They haven't broken any law, they've just violated the public trust. Shouldn't voters be allowed an outlet to avoid further damage?

 

I think our goal should be to construct as a responsive, transparent and accountable democracy as possible. Regular elections are a part of that and recalls further that effort.

[Ziggy]

Not exactly how I expected this thread to progress but oh well. Anyways, I think the recall was a total waste of time and a total BS move by the minority in a state who werent happy that the person democratically elected planned to do what he promised during the election. Should we not be more proud that a politician actually lived up to campaign promises and not just be worried about the next election. I hesitate to remove the ability to recall government officals because of the lack of accountability that occurs when there are no avenues to remove potentially harmful politicians.

 

As to the end arguement, Clinton is old news. Obama has some interesting decisions that may or may not be impeachable issues. I think the biggest thing is his direct decision to approve the killing of an American. He not only circumvented the constitution, it could be argued that he made a discision that directly violated the SOB terrorist's constiutional rights to a fair trial and the standard of innocent until proven guilty that our country's legal system has as its core.

[Excel]

Not exactly how I expected this thread to progress but oh well. Anyways, I think the recall was a total waste of time and a total BS move by the minority in a state who werent happy that the person democratically elected planned to do what he promised during the election. Should we not be more proud that a politician actually lived up to campaign promises and not just be worried about the next election. I hesitate to remove the ability to recall government officals because of the lack of accountability that occurs when there are no avenues to remove potentially harmful politicians.

 

As to the end arguement, Clinton is old news. Obama has some interesting decisions that may or may not be impeachable issues. I think the biggest thing is his direct decision to approve the killing of an American. He not only circumvented the constitution, it could be argued that he made a discision that directly violated the SOB terrorist's constiutional rights to a fair trial and the standard of innocent until proven guilty that our country's legal system has as its core.

 

Wisconsinites have always been more liberal than conservative and they still are. It's a progressive state with a progressive history. Scott Walker was elected by a minority of citizens and a majority of his donations were from residents of other states.

 

Purely in terms of the political power struggle the recall efforts were still worth it for the liberals of the state as John Lehman's victory gives them a majority in the Senate.

[carlfense]

Anyways, I think the recall was a total waste of time and a total BS move by the minority in a state who werent happy that the person democratically elected planned to do what he promised during the election.

You must really hate the U.S. Senate.

[Mavric]

Wisconsinites have always been more liberal than conservative and they still are. It's a progressive state with a progressive history. Scott Walker was elected by a minority of citizens and a majority of his donations were from residents of other states.

 

Purely in terms of the political power struggle the recall efforts were still worth it for the liberals of the state as John Lehman's victory gives them a majority in the Senate.

Is there any elected (at least on a state- or national-level) that isn't elected by a minority of citizens? Saying voting participation is anemic is giving it a lot of credit...