Good news for us re: Obamacare/ACA

[rawhide]

Rich moronic tech companies and geeks. It's not just the feds; every level of government have their almost chronic lack of diligence or oversight. And in response: either lots of finger pointing or "crickets".

 

This is truly not a partisan issue; more of a systemic issue without regard to philosophic beliefs.

[HUSKER 37]

Partially? Overheard a joke on a late night talkshow talking about the call centers working as well as an Edsel full of New Coke...Googled for accuracy led me to this..

....The take-home lesson: Barring government subsidies (see “ethanol”), failure in the free market buys even the most dutifully hawked products a one-way ticket to the back of a Trivial Pursuit card.

 

That useful principle is exactly reversed in government. Lo this past century, America has rejected socialized medicine time and again. And time and again, Washington has responded, “See, you must really want socialized medicine. Otherwise you wouldn’t keep rejecting it.”

 

Or, to quote President Obama’s silliest talking point, “We are on the doorstep of accomplishing something that Washington has been talking about since Teddy Roosevelt was president, and that is reforming health care and health insurance here in America.”

 

What part of “No, we don’t want ObamaCare, ever, in any form” doesn’t he get? Why is it impossible to fathom that maybe — just maybe — America hasn’t embraced socialized medicine because America doesn’t desire socialized medicine? One might have thought that obvious, given that the attempt to impose HillaryCare spawned epic Democratic hemorrhaging in the ’94 elections.

To have failed despite so many tries, socialized medicine must be stupendously unpopular —

More at the link

 

I'd much rather see Big Brother crack down on the Insurance companies trying to weasel out of paying claims or making it so difficult for patients that really need care and do more to discourage so many uninsured folks like me from flooding the Emergency Rooms with a head cold.

 

Instead, it seems like they're sponsoring Legalized Extortion.

[MLB 51]

Partially? Overheard a joke on a late night talkshow talking about the call centers working as well as an Edsel full of New Coke...Googled for accuracy led me to this..

....The take-home lesson: Barring government subsidies (see “ethanol”), failure in the free market buys even the most dutifully hawked products a one-way ticket to the back of a Trivial Pursuit card.

 

That useful principle is exactly reversed in government. Lo this past century, America has rejected socialized medicine time and again. And time and again, Washington has responded, “See, you must really want socialized medicine. Otherwise you wouldn’t keep rejecting it.”

 

Or, to quote President Obama’s silliest talking point, “We are on the doorstep of accomplishing something that Washington has been talking about since Teddy Roosevelt was president, and that is reforming health care and health insurance here in America.”

 

What part of “No, we don’t want ObamaCare, ever, in any form” doesn’t he get? Why is it impossible to fathom that maybe — just maybe — America hasn’t embraced socialized medicine because America doesn’t desire socialized medicine? One might have thought that obvious, given that the attempt to impose HillaryCare spawned epic Democratic hemorrhaging in the ’94 elections.

To have failed despite so many tries, socialized medicine must be stupendously unpopular —

More at the link

 

I'd much rather see Big Brother crack down on the Insurance companies trying to weasel out of paying claims or making it so difficult for patients that really need care and do more to discourage so many uninsured folks like me from flooding the Emergency Rooms with a head cold.

 

Instead, it seems like they're sponsoring Legalized Extortion.

+1 Well said.

[carlfense]

Partially? Overheard a joke on a late night talkshow talking about the call centers working as well as an Edsel full of New Coke...Googled for accuracy led me to this..

....The take-home lesson: Barring government subsidies (see “ethanol”), failure in the free market buys even the most dutifully hawked products a one-way ticket to the back of a Trivial Pursuit card.

 

That useful principle is exactly reversed in government. Lo this past century, America has rejected socialized medicine time and again. And time and again, Washington has responded, “See, you must really want socialized medicine. Otherwise you wouldn’t keep rejecting it.”

 

Or, to quote President Obama’s silliest talking point, “We are on the doorstep of accomplishing something that Washington has been talking about since Teddy Roosevelt was president, and that is reforming health care and health insurance here in America.”

 

What part of “No, we don’t want ObamaCare, ever, in any form” doesn’t he get? Why is it impossible to fathom that maybe — just maybe — America hasn’t embraced socialized medicine because America doesn’t desire socialized medicine? One might have thought that obvious, given that the attempt to impose HillaryCare spawned epic Democratic hemorrhaging in the ’94 elections.

To have failed despite so many tries, socialized medicine must be stupendously unpopular —

More at the link

 

I'd much rather see Big Brother crack down on the Insurance companies trying to weasel out of paying claims or making it so difficult for patients that really need care and do more to discourage so many uninsured folks like me from flooding the Emergency Rooms with a head cold.

 

Instead, it seems like they're sponsoring Legalized Extortion.

But Obamacare isn't socialized medicine . . . it's the Republican championed (prior to Obama) alternative to socialized medicine.

 

 

As an aside, we really need to get away from these phrases that are designed to shut down the conversation. If by socialized we mean paid for or provided by the government: I drove on a socialized highway this morning. Made coffee with socialized tap water. Etc.

[Junior]

As an aside, we really need to get away from these phrases that are designed to shut down the conversation. If by socialized we mean paid for or provided by the government: I drove on a socialized highway this morning. Made coffee with socialized tap water. Etc.

 

 

That's just because you're a communist, Carl. I drove on a freedom highway and made coffee with freedom water.

[carlfense]

As an aside, we really need to get away from these phrases that are designed to shut down the conversation. If by socialized we mean paid for or provided by the government: I drove on a socialized highway this morning. Made coffee with socialized tap water. Etc.

That's just because you're a communist, Carl. I drove on a freedom highway and made coffee with freedom water.

[zoogs]

That useful principle is exactly reversed in government. Lo this past century, America has rejected socialized medicine time and again. And time and again, Washington has responded, “See, you must really want socialized medicine. Otherwise you wouldn’t keep rejecting it.”

 

Or, to quote President Obama’s silliest talking point, “We are on the doorstep of accomplishing something that Washington has been talking about since Teddy Roosevelt was president, and that is reforming health care and health insurance here in America.”

 

What part of “No, we don’t want ObamaCare, ever, in any form” doesn’t he get? Why is it impossible to fathom that maybe — just maybe — America hasn’t embraced socialized medicine because America doesn’t desire socialized medicine? One might have thought that obvious, given that the attempt to impose HillaryCare spawned epic Democratic hemorrhaging in the ’94 elections.

 

To have failed despite so many tries, socialized medicine must be stupendously unpopular —

More at the link

 

I'd much rather see Big Brother crack down on the Insurance companies trying to weasel out of paying claims or making it so difficult for patients that really need care and do more to discourage so many uninsured folks like me from flooding the Emergency Rooms with a head cold.

 

Instead, it seems like they're sponsoring Legalized Extortion.

But Obamacare isn't socialized medicine . . . it's the Republican championed (prior to Obama) alternative to socialized medicine.

 

BAM. This.

 

And I really wonder why someone would claim that an issue with a history of being raised and failing should never succeed. Because that describes almost every issue ever. The system is designed with a high bar so that sweeping changes don't happen on a whim.

[zoogs]

Also, in what sense can the ACA be described as legalized extortion? I don't understand the ACA so well, so it's an honest question as to where that's coming from. The individual mandate doesn't seem to fit the bill at all, because society as a whole bears the healthcare costs of everybody -- just because a person doesn't choose to purchase healthcare for themselves doesn't mean they don't run into health issues and end up in a hospital.

[JJ Husker]

Also, in what sense can the ACA be described as legalized extortion? I don't understand the ACA so well, so it's an honest question as to where that's coming from. The individual mandate doesn't seem to fit the bill at all, because society as a whole bears the healthcare costs of everybody -- just because a person doesn't choose to purchase healthcare for themselves doesn't mean they don't run into health issues and end up in a hospital.

It's legalized because they passed a bill and made a law out of it. It's extortion because in effect it says, purchase this service or be subjected to punishment for not purchasing it. We have quite few other things that could be classified the same. So, yes, it is legalized extortion. The fact that society bears the cost of healthcare really doesn't affect that.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm not all up in arms because it is legalized extortion. And I have some rather heartless feelings on whether or not society should bear the cost of healthcare for individuals who have the financial ability and made an informed choice to forego acquiring health insurance. The only way this deal works is with an individual mandate. I think it goes against the grain of what our country stands (stood) for but, it is highly necessary to make it work. In fact, I am starting to think they should have made the penalties much stiffer. Like equal to the cost of insurance stiffer. We will still be able to have uninsured people seeking care, not paying for it, and those costs getting passed on to others. We'll have to wait and see how much that problem gets mitigated by the individual mandate. If it's still a problem, I'm all for much larger penalties.

[carlfense]

Also, in what sense can the ACA be described as legalized extortion? I don't understand the ACA so well, so it's an honest question as to where that's coming from. The individual mandate doesn't seem to fit the bill at all, because society as a whole bears the healthcare costs of everybody -- just because a person doesn't choose to purchase healthcare for themselves doesn't mean they don't run into health issues and end up in a hospital.

It's legalized because they passed a bill and made a law out of it. It's extortion because in effect it says, purchase this service or be subjected to punishment for not purchasing it. We have quite few other things that could be classified the same. So, yes, it is legalized extortion. The fact that society bears the cost of healthcare really doesn't affect that.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm not all up in arms because it is legalized extortion. And I have some rather heartless feelings on whether or not society should bear the cost of healthcare for individuals who have the financial ability and made an informed choice to forego acquiring health insurance. The only way this deal works is with an individual mandate. I think it goes against the grain of what our country stands (stood) for but, it is highly necessary to make it work. In fact, I am starting to think they should have made the penalties much stiffer. Like equal to the cost of insurance stiffer. We will still be able to have uninsured people seeking care, not paying for it, and those costs getting passed on to others. We'll have to wait and see how much that problem gets mitigated by the individual mandate. If it's still a problem, I'm all for much larger penalties.

It has to be wrongful/criminal/etc. for it to be extortion.

[zoogs]

JJ, what are the other things?

 

Health care isn't a commodity you can choose as a consumer to acquire or not. It's more of an inextricable necessity for anyone who happens to be alive.

 

Similar example: if you happen to drive, you are required to purchase auto insurance. There's no such thing as 'informed choice'.

[JJ Husker]

Also, in what sense can the ACA be described as legalized extortion? I don't understand the ACA so well, so it's an honest question as to where that's coming from. The individual mandate doesn't seem to fit the bill at all, because society as a whole bears the healthcare costs of everybody -- just because a person doesn't choose to purchase healthcare for themselves doesn't mean they don't run into health issues and end up in a hospital.

It's legalized because they passed a bill and made a law out of it. It's extortion because in effect it says, purchase this service or be subjected to punishment for not purchasing it. We have quite few other things that could be classified the same. So, yes, it is legalized extortion. The fact that society bears the cost of healthcare really doesn't affect that.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm not all up in arms because it is legalized extortion. And I have some rather heartless feelings on whether or not society should bear the cost of healthcare for individuals who have the financial ability and made an informed choice to forego acquiring health insurance. The only way this deal works is with an individual mandate. I think it goes against the grain of what our country stands (stood) for but, it is highly necessary to make it work. In fact, I am starting to think they should have made the penalties much stiffer. Like equal to the cost of insurance stiffer. We will still be able to have uninsured people seeking care, not paying for it, and those costs getting passed on to others. We'll have to wait and see how much that problem gets mitigated by the individual mandate. If it's still a problem, I'm all for much larger penalties.

It has to be wrongful/criminal/etc. for it to be extortion.

 

Probably a good point. So, what is the correct word (if it's not extortion) when you are basically forced to do something against your will, under the threat of repercussions? Is there a non-criminal version of "extortion"?

[Junior]

Probably a good point. So, what is the correct word (if it's not extortion) when you are basically forced to do something against your will, under the threat of repercussions?

 

Taxes? Car insurance? Marriage?

[carlfense]

Probably a good point. So, what is the correct word (if it's not extortion) when you are basically forced to do something against your will, under the threat of repercussions? Is there a non-criminal version of "extortion"?

A law?

[BigRedBuster]

Probably a good point. So, what is the correct word (if it's not extortion) when you are basically forced to do something against your will, under the threat of repercussions?

 

Taxes? Car insurance? Marriage?

 

I don't have to buy car insurance just because I'm alive and living here. I don't have to get married if I don't want to.