Splitting the United States into separate Republics

[Mars]

We don't have large numbers of people setting up IED's on every well traveled road?

 

Seriously, the politics, and sociological differences between the US and the middle east is its own thread, or two even.

 

Generally speaking, yeah not having wars is a good reason to stick together. We have more in common, and benefit more from being one nation than becoming a Balkanized continent.

 

I ask you why our lives are more sacred than theirs, and your response is...IED's? Did you ever bother to ask why those people are setting up IED's on their roads in the first place?

 

You say that not having wars is a good reason not to divide the nation, but you're perfectly comfortable spreading wars to other parts of the world?

 

Stanford and New York University law schools released a study not too long ago detailing the casualties of drone strikes. Here's an article: Link

 

Just one in 50 victims of America’s deadly drone strikes in Pakistan are terrorists – while the rest are innocent civilians, a new report claimed today.

1 person out of 50 of the those killed by drone strikes was a terrorist. Is that what our founding fathers fought for? So that the generations that followed could bomb the hell out of innocent civilians in the Middle East? Not all of them are terrorists strigori.

 

The point that I was trying to make is that we wouldn't be in the Middle East, and Middle Eastern citizens wouldn't be setting up IED's to kill our soldiers, if our monstrosity of a government no longer existed, and was instead replaced by a group of smaller, less powerful nations that lacked the funds to police the world and invade other nations.

 

Also generalizing, but the people who want to secede are generally little more than religious wackjobs. If they got their dream, they would be living in a third world nation almost the second they become their own little theocracy.

Show me the proof that backs up this statement.

 

And while you're at it, explain to me why these nations would become "third world".

[Mars]

If all of this can somehow get rid of my student loan debt, I'm in.

 

If not, this is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Just reduce the power of the Federal Government and send the power back to the states like it was meant to be in the first place, and boom! everybody's happy again (for the most part).

I didn't realize that we could reduce the size of the federal government just by snapping our fingers. It was so easy!

 

How stupid of me not to think of such an easy, entirely uncomplicated solution!

[strigori]

We don't have large numbers of people setting up IED's on every well traveled road?

 

Seriously, the politics, and sociological differences between the US and the middle east is its own thread, or two even.

 

Generally speaking, yeah not having wars is a good reason to stick together. We have more in common, and benefit more from being one nation than becoming a Balkanized continent.

 

I ask you why our lives are more sacred than theirs, and your response is...IED's? Did you ever bother to ask why those people are setting up IED's on their roads in the first place?

 

You say that not having wars is a good reason not to divide the nation, but you're perfectly comfortable spreading wars to other parts of the world?

 

Stanford and New York University law schools released a study not too long ago detailing the casualties of drone strikes. Here's an article: Link

 

Just one in 50 victims of America’s deadly drone strikes in Pakistan are terrorists – while the rest are innocent civilians, a new report claimed today.

1 person out of 50 of the those killed by drone strikes was a terrorist. Is that what our founding fathers fought for? So that the generations that followed could bomb the hell out of innocent civilians in the Middle East? Not all of them are terrorists strigori.

 

The point that I was trying to make is that we wouldn't be in the Middle East, and Middle Eastern citizens wouldn't be setting up IED's to kill our soldiers, if our monstrosity of a government no longer existed, and was instead replaced by a group of smaller, less powerful nations that lacked the funds to police the world and invade other nations.

 

Also generalizing, but the people who want to secede are generally little more than religious wackjobs. If they got their dream, they would be living in a third world nation almost the second they become their own little theocracy.

Show me the proof that backs up this statement.

 

And while you're at it, explain to me why these nations would become "third world".

I'm not going to keep derailing the thread with the middle east vs the west. Very complex topic.

 

 

To the religious nuts, just read the above links. Catch a clip or promo of 'Doomsday Preppers" Its not lefties calling for pulling out. All mentions of culture, and anyone paying attention knows that is referring to the more secular direction the country has been moving to since the 50's ended. The 'left' is more apt to think we are moving in the right direction socially and culturally.

 

To the 3rd world line. Again, read who is calling for breaking off. The brains in the nation by and large do not gravitate to the Bible thumping areas. You would see a mass exodus of whole levels of their population. Youth would flee, Tech industries would flee. A host of others would. These people talking breaking off are talking 'God' all the time, so unless you are in their little camp, life would go to absolute crap for you. And take a look around. Every theocracy is a 3rd world nation.

[Mars]

I'm not going to keep derailing the thread with the middle east vs the west. Very complex topic.

Nation building and warmongering go hand in hand with massive government spending and abuse of power. Hence the proposal to break apart the empire into smaller pieces.

 

No one is making this an issue of Middle East versus West. You're not derailing the thread either. So, by all means, continue the discussion.

 

To the religious nuts, just read the above links. Catch a clip or promo of 'Doomsday Preppers" Its not lefties calling for pulling out. All mentions of culture, and anyone paying attention knows that is referring to the more secular direction the country has been moving to since the 50's ended. The 'left' is more apt to think we are moving in the right direction socially and culturally.

 

To the 3rd world line. Again, read who is calling for breaking off. The brains in the nation by and large do not gravitate to the Bible thumping areas. You would see a mass exodus of whole levels of their population. Youth would flee, Tech industries would flee. A host of others would. These people talking breaking off are talking 'God' all the time, so unless you are in their little camp, life would go to absolute crap for you. And take a look around. Every theocracy is a 3rd world nation.

 

Here's a poll conducted by the Middlebury Institute: Link

 

Politically, liberal thinkers were much more likely to favor the right to secession for states and regions, as 32% of mainline liberals agreed with the concept. Among the very liberal the support was only slightly less enthusiastic – 28% said they favored such a right. Meanwhile, just 17% of mainline conservatives thought it should exist as an option for states or regions of the nation.

 

The "bible thumpers" are less likely to favor secession.

 

Where do the "brains in the nation" reside exactly? California?

 

Why would the youth flee? Why would they leave the regions that they grew up in?

 

Why would the tech industries flee? For that matter, why would businesses in general flee?

[Mars]

Pro-secession movement grows to 40 states: Link

 

Texas secession petition hits 83,000 signatures by Tuesday evening: Link

[clyde40]

I realize the United States isn't in the best shape but, I believe we need to come together instead of trying to break apart.

[zoogs]

 

The petition also was popular with out-of-staters who seemingly embraced the idea of a Texas-free nation. Of the almost 400 names added to the petition from noon until 12:10 p.m., for example, almost 1 in 4 listed a non-Texas hometown.

 

By Tuesday afternoon, similar petitions were active for almost 40 other states, with Louisiana crossing the 25,000-vote threshold and Alabama, Georgia, Florida, Tennessee and North Carolina nearing that number.

 

Also gaining popularity was a petition asking the government to deport “everyone that signed a petition to withdraw their state from the United States.”

 

Then came the inevitable — a petition requesting that Austin be allowed to withdraw from Texas, and remain part of the United States, because the city suffers from a “lack of civil, religious and political freedoms imposed … by less liberally minded Texans.”

 

Secession, by the way, isn’t a viable option for states — that matter was resolved by the Civil War. Even so, a White House official said the secession petitions will receive an official administration response in the future, although there is no set deadline.

 

people be trippin'

[BigRedBuster]

I realize the United States isn't in the best shape but, I believe we need to come together instead of trying to break apart.

 

I agree. I love this country the way it is as far as structure. But, the problems we have, the majority can't stomach what it will take to fix it.

[HuskerShark]

If all of this can somehow get rid of my student loan debt, I'm in.

 

If not, this is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Just reduce the power of the Federal Government and send the power back to the states like it was meant to be in the first place, and boom! everybody's happy again (for the most part).

I didn't realize that we could reduce the size of the federal government just by snapping our fingers. It was so easy!

 

How stupid of me not to think of such an easy, entirely uncomplicated solution!

 

Thank you for the sarcastic reply. Much appreciated.

 

I know that it would not be an easy task to reduce the amount of "big government" that is going on, but quite simply, it needs to be done. And it starts with the people that we elect to the Presidency/Senate/House. They are the ones in the end that have to collectively decide to make this change, and we are getting nowhere with the types of people that America votes in.

[Mars]

If all of this can somehow get rid of my student loan debt, I'm in.

 

If not, this is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Just reduce the power of the Federal Government and send the power back to the states like it was meant to be in the first place, and boom! everybody's happy again (for the most part).

I didn't realize that we could reduce the size of the federal government just by snapping our fingers. It was so easy!

 

How stupid of me not to think of such an easy, entirely uncomplicated solution!

 

Thank you for the sarcastic reply. Much appreciated.

 

I know that it would not be an easy task to reduce the amount of "big government" that is going on, but quite simply, it needs to be done. And it starts with the people that we elect to the Presidency/Senate/House. They are the ones in the end that have to collectively decide to make this change, and we are getting nowhere with the types of people that America votes in.

I proposed an idea to fix the problem, and your response was to call it the "stupidest thing you've ever heard". You added nothing to the discussion with your first response. Much appreciated.

 

I agree with you that if the problems are to be corrected, we need to start with our elected representatives. But after this last election, nothing has changed. The White House is the same, the Senate is the same, and Congess is the same. People understand that a change has to be made, but they keep electing the same people to office. Barring some kind of catastrophic event, I don't see any kind of change happening.

[Mars]

White House secession petitions reaches 675,000 signatures, makes front page of Drudge Report: Link

 

Less than a week after a New Orleans suburbanite petitioned the White House to allow Louisiana to secede from the United States, petitions from seven states have collected enough signatures to trigger a promised review from the Obama administration.

By 6:00 a.m. EST Wednesday, more than 675,000 digital signatures appeared on 69 separate secession petitions covering all 50 states, according to a Daily Caller analysis of requests lodged with the White House’s “We the People” online petition system.

[Lil' Red]

I can't fathom why splitting up the United States should even be considered. It is inevitable that the United States will eventually dissolve but right now we have a very strong country and we should try to preserve it for as long as possible. Improvements in technology to our transportation and communication systems have diminished the importance of cultural, economic, and geographic factors as we are now much less isolated from each other.

[Mars]

Improvements in technology to transportation and communication systems have diminished the importance of cultural, economic, and geographic factors as we are now much less isolated from each other.

How do improvements in technology diminish the importance of cultural, economic, and geographic factors?

[Mars]

On the flip side, would anyone on this forum support a one world government, modeled after the American system of government?

[Lil' Red]

Improvements in technology to transportation and communication systems have diminished the importance of cultural, economic, and geographic factors as we are now much less isolated from each other.

How do improvements in technology diminish the importance of cultural, economic, and geographic factors?

Through technology we are now more interdependent than we were previously which minimizes the potential for those factors to create division. When the United States split from England those factors were key contributors as communication and travel between the two places was very slow and limited. Today, we can easily travel and communicate with states like Hawaii limiting the possibility for those factors to cause disconnect between us.