Does the Pelini Era cast the Callahan Era in a different light?

[True2tRA]

 

 

 

 

Jesus. History made here today. True goes on emotional heated rant that makes sense. I solute you sir.

I've had some emotional heated rants here before. This wasn't one of them. I'm hardly rational or logical when I'm pissed off.

no sh#t.

But for real, this seemed like one of em. Then it made sense. We call that progress son. Im proud of you.

No son.......I'm proud of you.

dont call me son. I am a lawyer and an officer in the united states navy. And youre under arrest you son of a bitch.

don't wear that perfume in court, it wrecks my concentration.

[Elf]

 

 

Even as staunch a Pelini guy as I've been until the bitter end, you guys preaching about losing records are missing the point. And let's face it, had Bo been forced to coach a team in one of the top 2 conferences in the country in his last 4 years, it's quite possible, even probably, he'd a had 2, maybe even 3 losing seasons as well.

 

Now, it didnt happen, so for the sake of this discussion, all I can say is that both failed. Both had to job to do according to the expectations and desires of this program and fanbase, and both failed. But as far as changing my view on the Callahan years, no it doesnt change. I've preached about the lingering effects of that time, and still believe they did linger for a few years, but I never placed the blame on Callahan in a hatred type of manner. He took a job and did it to the best of what he knew. And frankly, while we distinguish experience, Bill was probably less experienced as a college head coach than Bo was. He had only been a head coach in the NFL two whole seasons, and had been out of the college game and atmosphere for years.

the negative callahan effect lingered throughout bo's best years here? and bo seemed to do worse the further he got from the callahan era? that is curious.

 

Yeah, despite leaving all the talent behind, i always there were some issues that needed to be fixed and weeded out, like most coaching changes deal with. It's not a Callahan only issue. Just a general observation of a coaching change. Obviously as hte years wore on, it became a Bo issue, not a Callahan issue. Bo had to come in and fix some things that were broken. So does Mike Riley. Callahan came in and completely tore down the culture of Nebraska football. Removed a tenured offensive identity known on a national scale for 40 years. No, this is not a "callahan and Petersen purposely ruined nebraska football" crazy man post. it's just an observation of what Bill did by following a plan he feld was best and made him and his staff most comfortable. But it created a division, did it not? How many poeple you think had immediate and lingering angst towards Callahan while he was here simply because his offense "was not Nebraska football". And having losing seasons twice in 4 years and missing bowl games didnt help with that flip of identity. So by the end of 2007, Nebraska football as a program and fanbase really had no sense of what we were anymore, or where we were headed. And as has been documented there were a few folks who didnt agree with the Bo hire from day one to fix it.

 

 

Please tell us what tenured offensive identity NU ran for 40 years?

 

Even Tom Osborne didn't run the same offense for the entire time he was the offensive coordinator at Nebraska. He became the offensive coordinator under Devaney in '69 and we all know he was his own offensive coordinator while he was the head coach.

[Saunders]

 

Saying that Bo or Bill were the worst thing to happen to this program.... Yeah. Lol. No matter your bias, they're a distant 2nd no matter how you try to spin it.

Distant second to what?

Stevie P

[AFhusker]

 

 

Even as staunch a Pelini guy as I've been until the bitter end, you guys preaching about losing records are missing the point. And let's face it, had Bo been forced to coach a team in one of the top 2 conferences in the country in his last 4 years, it's quite possible, even probably, he'd a had 2, maybe even 3 losing seasons as well.

 

Now, it didnt happen, so for the sake of this discussion, all I can say is that both failed. Both had to job to do according to the expectations and desires of this program and fanbase, and both failed. But as far as changing my view on the Callahan years, no it doesnt change. I've preached about the lingering effects of that time, and still believe they did linger for a few years, but I never placed the blame on Callahan in a hatred type of manner. He took a job and did it to the best of what he knew. And frankly, while we distinguish experience, Bill was probably less experienced as a college head coach than Bo was. He had only been a head coach in the NFL two whole seasons, and had been out of the college game and atmosphere for years.

the negative callahan effect lingered throughout bo's best years here? and bo seemed to do worse the further he got from the callahan era? that is curious.

 

Yeah, despite leaving all the talent behind, i always there were some issues that needed to be fixed and weeded out, like most coaching changes deal with. It's not a Callahan only issue. Just a general observation of a coaching change. Obviously as hte years wore on, it became a Bo issue, not a Callahan issue. Bo had to come in and fix some things that were broken. So does Mike Riley. Callahan came in and completely tore down the culture of Nebraska football. Removed a tenured offensive identity known on a national scale for 40 years. No, this is not a "callahan and Petersen purposely ruined nebraska football" crazy man post. it's just an observation of what Bill did by following a plan he feld was best and made him and his staff most comfortable. But it created a division, did it not? How many poeple you think had immediate and lingering angst towards Callahan while he was here simply because his offense "was not Nebraska football". And having losing seasons twice in 4 years and missing bowl games didnt help with that flip of identity. So by the end of 2007, Nebraska football as a program and fanbase really had no sense of what we were anymore, or where we were headed. And as has been documented there were a few folks who didnt agree with the Bo hire from day one to fix it.

 

That point shows the ignorance of the Nebraska fan base and how we love to live in the past. We didn't lose those games just because of the changing of the offense, we lost them because Frank killed the program with his lazy recruiting. He took a porche of a program and turned it into a beat up pinto. I mean just look at the QB's, he inherited Newcombe and Crouch, and he left us with Joe Dailey.....enough said. Bill did the best he could with the very little talent that Frank "the tank" left us. I highly doubt that Bo would have had a winning season if he was hired after Frank was fired. The only reason that NU had those two semi respectable years was because Bill recruited a ton of JUCO's to fill those holes. The problem was that they all left after 2006, which led us to 2007 with young talented guys that weren't ready to play that tough of a schedule. Not to mention the Big 12 was a great conference with two teams that are not normally powerhouses in KU and Mizzou having their best seasons in years. Bo was just another guy who was over his head (much like Frank) and it showed every time he had a chance to get a statement win for the program.

 

[Mavric]

No son.......I'm proud of you.

dont call me son. I am a lawyer and an officer in the united states navy. And youre under arrest you son of a bitch.

[True2tRA]

 

 

 

Even as staunch a Pelini guy as I've been until the bitter end, you guys preaching about losing records are missing the point. And let's face it, had Bo been forced to coach a team in one of the top 2 conferences in the country in his last 4 years, it's quite possible, even probably, he'd a had 2, maybe even 3 losing seasons as well.

 

Now, it didnt happen, so for the sake of this discussion, all I can say is that both failed. Both had to job to do according to the expectations and desires of this program and fanbase, and both failed. But as far as changing my view on the Callahan years, no it doesnt change. I've preached about the lingering effects of that time, and still believe they did linger for a few years, but I never placed the blame on Callahan in a hatred type of manner. He took a job and did it to the best of what he knew. And frankly, while we distinguish experience, Bill was probably less experienced as a college head coach than Bo was. He had only been a head coach in the NFL two whole seasons, and had been out of the college game and atmosphere for years.

 

the negative callahan effect lingered throughout bo's best years here? and bo seemed to do worse the further he got from the callahan era? that is curious.

Yeah, despite leaving all the talent behind, i always there were some issues that needed to be fixed and weeded out, like most coaching changes deal with. It's not a Callahan only issue. Just a general observation of a coaching change. Obviously as hte years wore on, it became a Bo issue, not a Callahan issue. Bo had to come in and fix some things that were broken. So does Mike Riley. Callahan came in and completely tore down the culture of Nebraska football. Removed a tenured offensive identity known on a national scale for 40 years. No, this is not a "callahan and Petersen purposely ruined nebraska football" crazy man post. it's just an observation of what Bill did by following a plan he feld was best and made him and his staff most comfortable. But it created a division, did it not? How many poeple you think had immediate and lingering angst towards Callahan while he was here simply because his offense "was not Nebraska football". And having losing seasons twice in 4 years and missing bowl games didnt help with that flip of identity. So by the end of 2007, Nebraska football as a program and fanbase really had no sense of what we were anymore, or where we were headed. And as has been documented there were a few folks who didnt agree with the Bo hire from day one to fix it.

That point shows the ignorance of the Nebraska fan base and how we love to live in the past. We didn't lose those games just because of the changing of the offense, we lost them because Frank killed the program with his lazy recruiting. He took a porche of a program and turned it into a beat up pinto. I mean just look at the QB's, he inherited Newcombe and Crouch, and he left us with Joe Dailey.....enough said. Bill did the best he could with the very little talent that Frank "the tank" left us. I highly doubt that Bo would have had a winning season if he was hired after Frank was fired. The only reason that NU had those two semi respectable years was because Bill recruited a ton of JUCO's to fill those holes. The problem was that they all left after 2006, which led us to 2007 with young talented guys that weren't ready to play that tough of a schedule. Not to mention the Big 12 was a great conference with two teams that are not normally powerhouses in KU and Mizzou having their best seasons in years. Bo was just another guy who was over his head (much like Frank) and it showed every time he had a chance to get a statement win for the program.[/size]

Good points. +1

[Count 'Bility]

Sorry AF, i just happen to think youre a little wrong on it. When you flip it and install a west coast offense with all option/ power personel, 5-7 is what you get. And again, Daily gets a bad rap. He became very out of place and probably ruined him from a psychological standpoint. Also, Nebraska returned 7 starters on both side of the ball from a 10-3 2003 team. And thats not including Stewart Bradly and Carriker who did start and did play a significant role in the Callahan years, recruited by Solich. So dont tell me ut was lack of talent and not a change of systems.

[Count 'Bility]

All i have is yoohoo and coco puffs.

[Count 'Bility]

 

 

 

Even as staunch a Pelini guy as I've been until the bitter end, you guys preaching about losing records are missing the point. And let's face it, had Bo been forced to coach a team in one of the top 2 conferences in the country in his last 4 years, it's quite possible, even probably, he'd a had 2, maybe even 3 losing seasons as well.

 

Now, it didnt happen, so for the sake of this discussion, all I can say is that both failed. Both had to job to do according to the expectations and desires of this program and fanbase, and both failed. But as far as changing my view on the Callahan years, no it doesnt change. I've preached about the lingering effects of that time, and still believe they did linger for a few years, but I never placed the blame on Callahan in a hatred type of manner. He took a job and did it to the best of what he knew. And frankly, while we distinguish experience, Bill was probably less experienced as a college head coach than Bo was. He had only been a head coach in the NFL two whole seasons, and had been out of the college game and atmosphere for years.

 

the negative callahan effect lingered throughout bo's best years here? and bo seemed to do worse the further he got from the callahan era? that is curious.

Yeah, despite leaving all the talent behind, i always there were some issues that needed to be fixed and weeded out, like most coaching changes deal with. It's not a Callahan only issue. Just a general observation of a coaching change. Obviously as hte years wore on, it became a Bo issue, not a Callahan issue. Bo had to come in and fix some things that were broken. So does Mike Riley. Callahan came in and completely tore down the culture of Nebraska football. Removed a tenured offensive identity known on a national scale for 40 years. No, this is not a "callahan and Petersen purposely ruined nebraska football" crazy man post. it's just an observation of what Bill did by following a plan he feld was best and made him and his staff most comfortable. But it created a division, did it not? How many poeple you think had immediate and lingering angst towards Callahan while he was here simply because his offense "was not Nebraska football". And having losing seasons twice in 4 years and missing bowl games didnt help with that flip of identity. So by the end of 2007, Nebraska football as a program and fanbase really had no sense of what we were anymore, or where we were headed. And as has been documented there were a few folks who didnt agree with the Bo hire from day one to fix it.

Please tell us what tenured offensive identity NU ran for 40 years?

 

Even Tom Osborne didn't run the same offense for the entire time he was the offensive coordinator at Nebraska. He became the offensive coordinator under Devaney in '69 and we all know he was his own offensive coordinator while he was the head coach.

an offense dedicated to the run. Really as simple as that. When you thought of Nebraska, you thought of tough hardcore power football. Youre talkin sophisticated Xs and Os. Im talking about a national brand. An identity in the eye of national perception. Callahan changed it. 180 degrees.

 

I know. Sometimes the things i say really make you have to think. I apologize for that.

[skersfan]

I think the worst part is BC felt bad about his failure, blamed no one but himself, left quietly, never saying a bad word about Nebraska, knowing most Nebraska fans hated him for what he did here. The last one left, not caring whether we ate $hit and died, and still most loved him, wish him luck at every opportunity. Callahan and staff feared for their lives. Truly a sad situation.

[Count 'Bility]

9 wins skersfan. Dont matter how you get it. Only that you do. 9 f'ing wins.

[Elf]

 

 

 

 

Even as staunch a Pelini guy as I've been until the bitter end, you guys preaching about losing records are missing the point. And let's face it, had Bo been forced to coach a team in one of the top 2 conferences in the country in his last 4 years, it's quite possible, even probably, he'd a had 2, maybe even 3 losing seasons as well.

 

Now, it didnt happen, so for the sake of this discussion, all I can say is that both failed. Both had to job to do according to the expectations and desires of this program and fanbase, and both failed. But as far as changing my view on the Callahan years, no it doesnt change. I've preached about the lingering effects of that time, and still believe they did linger for a few years, but I never placed the blame on Callahan in a hatred type of manner. He took a job and did it to the best of what he knew. And frankly, while we distinguish experience, Bill was probably less experienced as a college head coach than Bo was. He had only been a head coach in the NFL two whole seasons, and had been out of the college game and atmosphere for years.

the negative callahan effect lingered throughout bo's best years here? and bo seemed to do worse the further he got from the callahan era? that is curious.

Yeah, despite leaving all the talent behind, i always there were some issues that needed to be fixed and weeded out, like most coaching changes deal with. It's not a Callahan only issue. Just a general observation of a coaching change. Obviously as hte years wore on, it became a Bo issue, not a Callahan issue. Bo had to come in and fix some things that were broken. So does Mike Riley. Callahan came in and completely tore down the culture of Nebraska football. Removed a tenured offensive identity known on a national scale for 40 years. No, this is not a "callahan and Petersen purposely ruined nebraska football" crazy man post. it's just an observation of what Bill did by following a plan he feld was best and made him and his staff most comfortable. But it created a division, did it not? How many poeple you think had immediate and lingering angst towards Callahan while he was here simply because his offense "was not Nebraska football". And having losing seasons twice in 4 years and missing bowl games didnt help with that flip of identity. So by the end of 2007, Nebraska football as a program and fanbase really had no sense of what we were anymore, or where we were headed. And as has been documented there were a few folks who didnt agree with the Bo hire from day one to fix it.

Please tell us what tenured offensive identity NU ran for 40 years?

 

Even Tom Osborne didn't run the same offense for the entire time he was the offensive coordinator at Nebraska. He became the offensive coordinator under Devaney in '69 and we all know he was his own offensive coordinator while he was the head coach.

an offense dedicated to the run. Really as simple as that. When you thought of Nebraska, you thought of tough hardcore power football. Youre talkin sophisticated Xs and Os. Im talking about a national brand. An identity in the eye of national perception. Callahan changed it. 180 degrees.

 

I know. Sometimes the things i say really make you have to think. I apologize for that.

 

 

We didn't run an offense dedicated to the run for 40 years. Sorry, it's just not what we did.

[AFhusker]

Sorry AF, i just happen to think youre a little wrong on it. When you flip it and install a west coast offense with all option/ power personel, 5-7 is what you get. And again, Daily gets a bad rap. He became very out of place and probably ruined him from a psychological standpoint. Also, Nebraska returned 7 starters on both side of the ball from a 10-3 2003 team. And thats not including Stewart Bradly and Carriker who did start and did play a significant role in the Callahan years, recruited by Solich. So dont tell me ut was lack of talent and not a change of systems.

Joe Dailey is the worst QB NU has had in it's modern era. (apologies to Mike Grant) He may be a nice guy (I don't know him) and a great person, but he was a horrible QB and football player. All you have to do is look at the Southern Miss game, he ran out of bounds on a 4th and goal with less than a minute left in the game. That isn't counting a pick six on a screen pass that was just terrible. That isn't on Bill, that is on Joe and he lack of football knowledge, which is a must at QB. Even after he transferred to Duke he was beat out as a Sr by a freshman and had to be a possession WR to get playing time. Not to mention Joe was the only scholarship QB that Frank left.

 

Just because you return starters doesn't mean they are any good. NU only had one impact player on offense and that was Matt Herian, who we couldn't use because Joe can't throw (or run) the ball. The defense had good talent (for one year) in the secondary and the LB's, but the DL had no depth at all with only three DL on the team.

 

And finally stop looking at the record in 2003, it was the same bad year that was masked by beating 9 sh**ty teams in the regular season and we were dominated by the only two ranked teams that we played (UT, KSU) and by one that wasn't ranked. (Mizzou) Look at the offensive stats, they were worse in 2003, than they were in the 7-7 season of 2002. On the top of that Frank only had 5 guys committed to NU in December, so then there is that aspect that Frank was failing at too.

 

You put it all together, and Frank was leading the program down the toilet, that is why I will always believe that SP's biggest mistake was that he didn't give Frank one more year because he should have allowed him to complete his failure and then the next coach would have been given the time needed to rebuild this program the way it needed too. But SP tried to prevent the program from missing bowls and losing records, but Frank had already done too much damage with the Big 12 only getting better. It was just a matter of time no matter who the coach was.

 

Of course hindsight is always 20/20, but he should have let Frank lose the bowl streak, then everyone would have been behind getting rid of him and been behind the next guy. Which would have likely have been someone better than BC, because they would have been given the time to fix the program, not put a band aid on it and try to tread water with 9 pointless wins and not winning any championships. That was the real reason why nobody wanted to come here, they saw the state of the program with expectations that were temporarily unrealistic with the talent and culture (let the program get lazy) that was left by Frank.

[Count 'Bility]

Those 14 starters went 10-3 in 2003. Eric crouch woulda looked pretty bad in that west coast offense in 2004 as well. 2004 wasnt exactly a gauntlet schedule.

[Count 'Bility]

 

 

 

 

 

Even as staunch a Pelini guy as I've been until the bitter end, you guys preaching about losing records are missing the point. And let's face it, had Bo been forced to coach a team in one of the top 2 conferences in the country in his last 4 years, it's quite possible, even probably, he'd a had 2, maybe even 3 losing seasons as well.

 

Now, it didnt happen, so for the sake of this discussion, all I can say is that both failed. Both had to job to do according to the expectations and desires of this program and fanbase, and both failed. But as far as changing my view on the Callahan years, no it doesnt change. I've preached about the lingering effects of that time, and still believe they did linger for a few years, but I never placed the blame on Callahan in a hatred type of manner. He took a job and did it to the best of what he knew. And frankly, while we distinguish experience, Bill was probably less experienced as a college head coach than Bo was. He had only been a head coach in the NFL two whole seasons, and had been out of the college game and atmosphere for years.

the negative callahan effect lingered throughout bo's best years here? and bo seemed to do worse the further he got from the callahan era? that is curious.

Yeah, despite leaving all the talent behind, i always there were some issues that needed to be fixed and weeded out, like most coaching changes deal with. It's not a Callahan only issue. Just a general observation of a coaching change. Obviously as hte years wore on, it became a Bo issue, not a Callahan issue. Bo had to come in and fix some things that were broken. So does Mike Riley. Callahan came in and completely tore down the culture of Nebraska football. Removed a tenured offensive identity known on a national scale for 40 years. No, this is not a "callahan and Petersen purposely ruined nebraska football" crazy man post. it's just an observation of what Bill did by following a plan he feld was best and made him and his staff most comfortable. But it created a division, did it not? How many poeple you think had immediate and lingering angst towards Callahan while he was here simply because his offense "was not Nebraska football". And having losing seasons twice in 4 years and missing bowl games didnt help with that flip of identity. So by the end of 2007, Nebraska football as a program and fanbase really had no sense of what we were anymore, or where we were headed. And as has been documented there were a few folks who didnt agree with the Bo hire from day one to fix it.

Please tell us what tenured offensive identity NU ran for 40 years?

 

Even Tom Osborne didn't run the same offense for the entire time he was the offensive coordinator at Nebraska. He became the offensive coordinator under Devaney in '69 and we all know he was his own offensive coordinator while he was the head coach.

an offense dedicated to the run. Really as simple as that. When you thought of Nebraska, you thought of tough hardcore power football. Youre talkin sophisticated Xs and Os. Im talking about a national brand. An identity in the eye of national perception. Callahan changed it. 180 degrees.

I know. Sometimes the things i say really make you have to think. I apologize for that.

We didn't run an offense dedicated to the run for 40 years. Sorry, it's just not what we did.

you again are missing the point. Youre picking apart playcalling and I'm talking about the National perception of Nebraska football at the time Callahan was hired. There was a cukture and an identity that Nebraska known for. It doesnt matter that the offenses actually did change ir that they threw it more early in Osbornes tenure. Its that the general perception of Nebraska football was that it had always been this hard nosed old fashioned style of football. And a lot of people took pride in that.

 

Is that understandable? Or am i going to have to rexplain it again by saying the exact same thing again?