ICE Crackdown

[Landlord]

However the way he presented his post makes it seem as if the lack of enforcement of those laws or any laws, justifies the lack of enforcement of immigration laws.

 

No. The way I presented it showed how Dewiz' argument of, "It's a crime, period." is inconsistent outrage and hypocrisy because there are plenty of crimes that I am certain Dewiz has been fine with committing, as have all of us.

 

The hypocrisy is when someone claims "illegals" (an awful term, btw) are in the wrong because of no other reason than committing a crime. We all commit crimes. Give an ethical, practical, utilitarian, rational reason why what they're doing is actually wrong or harmful.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Are you saying that jaywalking should be enforced with the same zeal and with the same punishment as illegally entering a country?

 

Kind of!

 

What happens if somebody jaywalks? Usually nothing, maybe a car has to slow down a bit? No harm, no foul. No victim. What happens if somebody crosses the border. In that moment, what wrong has been committed? Who is suffering as a result? How has our country become worse because someone passed over a made up line in the sand?

[Moiraine]

 

 

 

 

Entering a country illegally is a crime...period.

So now we get to pick and choose which laws to enforce and which ones to turn a blind eye too?

Marijuana is illegal nationally yet people can basically consume it openly in Colorado and other states.

So, ya.

That's because in Colorado if you're older than 21, you can legally possess an ounce of weed on your person for recreational use. I'm sure the other 6 states who also allow legalized recreational marijuana usage follow the same guidelines....

Anything over an ounce is a no no

So, ya

Except it's still a schedule 1 drug and is federally illegal to posses or consume. The Feds could come in at anytime and raid the shops and lock everyone up. That's why they are a cash only buisness, because banks don't want to take the risk of association.

 

So ya...

Deputy U.S. Attorney General James Cole wrote in a memo sent Thursday to federal prosecutors that it will not be a priority to block landmark marijuana-legalization laws in the two states. The federal government also will not make it a priority to close down recreational marijuana stores, so long as the stores abide by state regulations, according to the memo.

 

However, if the two states are unable to keep pot away from kids, keep criminal gangs out of the marijuana industry or keep marijuana from being trafficked into neighboring states, among other concerns, Cole wrote that the federal government would consider cracking down.

 

http://www.denverpost.com/2013/08/29/federal-government-wont-block-colorado-marijuana-legalization/

 

So ya

You're still not understanding this. Marijuana is illegal federally but it is not enforced everywhere. The feds not cracking down just proves my point. It's illegal but they won't do anything about it in those states.

 

If an FBI agent wanted to arrest me for smoking pot in Colorado, they could.

 

Also, why do you keep saying "So ya" ?

 

I was answering your question in the positive: So now we get to pick and choose which laws to enforce and which ones to turn a blind eye too?

 

So I answered Ya, because we already do that for some crimes.

 

You replying "So ya" is like you're saying you're agreeing with me. :shrug:

[JJ Husker]

 

However the way he presented his post makes it seem as if the lack of enforcement of those laws or any laws, justifies the lack of enforcement of immigration laws.

 

No. The way I presented it showed how Dewiz' argument of, "It's a crime, period." is inconsistent outrage and hypocrisy because there are plenty of crimes that I am certain Dewiz has been fine with committing, as have all of us.

 

The hypocrisy is when someone claims "illegals" (an awful term, btw) are in the wrong because of no other reason than committing a crime. We all commit crimes. Give an ethical, practical, utilitarian, rational reason why what they're doing is actually wrong or harmful.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Are you saying that jaywalking should be enforced with the same zeal and with the same punishment as illegally entering a country?

 

Kind of!

 

What happens if somebody jaywalks? Usually nothing, maybe a car has to slow down a bit? No harm, no foul. No victim. What happens if somebody crosses the border. In that moment, what wrong has been committed? Who is suffering as a result? How has our country become worse because someone passed over a made up line in the sand?

 

 

And that is why I stated we first need to have a workable plan. We need to determine how many legal immigrants we want to allow into this country and then enforce that level. Allow the people who follow the procedure to come in. Prevent and deport the people who don't do it through proper channels.

 

I don't think that is a good analogy though. Jaywalking is one of those things that makes sense in certain instances to enforce (high volume-high speed area) and in others to ignore. Immigration can't be that way. Imagine the effect 20 million people entering a country unchecked could have. Lots of things could suffer. There is a number where it becomes detrimental.

 

We have to get beyond one side saying "oh they're good people who just want a better life" and the other side that wants to rip families apart because we've had bad policy and bad enforcement for too long. The people that are against amnesty need to get over it and realize that nothing will ever happen if it involves ripping families apart. That is just a problem we have to eat at this point. Everyone needs to realize that our current policy and lack of effective enforcement has caused this problem. Some need to quit blaming the "illegals" and the people who are racially motivated against brown people need to be marginalized and told to stfu. It's really simple in my mind, pick the number we can absorb and enforce it. It's not like our policies are more stringent than the rest of the world. Everything I've seen indicates we have one of the most lenient policies around yet many people act like those that actually want the laws enforced are monsters. I understand why people feel illegal immigrants are criminals, it's because they broke the law by coming here. But IMO the real problem is not the people themselves but rather a system that isn't clear, concise and easy and enforced.

[Danny Bateman]

Here's another way in which this is different. Obama left the DREAMers alone.

 

Seattle "Dreamer" will stay in custody, judge rules

 

 

 

Ramirez is father of a 3-year-old son who is a U.S. citizen, his lawyers have said. He worked on farms picking fruit in California before moving to Washington, and he twice passed background checks to participate in the DACA program — most recently last spring, they said.

 

Sounds like a bad egg to me. Let's get him out of here.

 

And then there's this...

 

Document shows key piece of evidence in ‘Dreamer’ case might have been erased, lawyers claim

 

 

Ramirez's lawyers are claiming that they tried to erase the beginning part of his appeal (in red):

 

I came in and the officer said I have gang affiliation with gangs so I wear an orange uniform. I do not have a criminal history and I'm not affiliated with any gangs.

 

I don't know, it could all be hearsay. I just don't like seeing this. I don't like reading quotes like this - gives me the chills:

 

 

Ramirez informed the officers about his work permit under DACA, KIRO reports. But the document says one of the ICE agents replied: “It doesn’t matter, because you weren’t born in this country.”

 

Trump doesn't seem like the guy to me who would go by the book. He seems like the type of guy who would abuse his power to cast as wide a net as possible.

 

Cool to see this, though. I'm glad I am not alone in my feelings on this.

 

[knapplc]

Good post, JJ, I agree with almost all of it. I'd add that, in addition to the problems you listed in your last sentence, another major problem is the profitability of illegals. Too many companies are making too much money for it to be realistic to get rid of all illegals. Getting rid of those illegals will harm the economy, no question.

 

Trump knows this, and it's why all of this is posturing. Even the wall, if it's ever built, will NOT keep illegals out.

 

Illegals are a good scapegoat for a portion of the Republican base, and that's why they keep banging this drum. On the other side, it's beneficial to Democrats to appear to be sympathetic to these people, because it appeals to a portion of their base. It's a political football both sides kick back and forth to each other.

[Danny Bateman]