The Ron Brown Religion & Persecution Thread

[It'sNotAFakeID]

I may not fully agree with Ron Brown's position on homosexuality or his choice to apparently speak so frequently on the subject but, I have nothing but respect for him and for his right to express his opinion on the issue. My only hope is that he remains extremely clear about these being his opinions and that he is not representing the University in any way, shape, or form. I feel this specific deal is simply exacerbated by current political correctness and because it is hot button issue. Where I do agree with him is that I don't feel the GLBT community needs any additional protections or allowances. But, I feel that way about all groups of people no matter how some may choose to catagorize them. We have civil rights and labor laws that are designed to protect all of us regardless if we are white, black, brown, male, female, gay, straight, Christian, atheist, etc. If a person feels homosexuality is a sin, no law in the world is going to change that. It doesn't even matter if he is right or wrong or if you think he is misinterpreting the Bible. He has the right to express his opinion and others have that same right to agree or disagree with him. However, he does not have the right to use his position as a University employee or coach to deliver a controversial message. If he feels it is that important of an issue and he understands the fine line he is treading, I have nothing but respect for him sticking to his convictions. The world would be a much better place if all people had that level of integrity.

 

A quote from the article that I liked-

Walls, now pastor at Shades Mountain Independent Church in Birmingham, Ala., said the Brown he knows is not hateful.

''When you speak the truth to people who don't see it that way, they often come away thinking you condemned them or judged them rather than addressing their sin from God's perspective, which is an act of love,'' Walls said. Brown helps ''illuminate the perversion and confusion of our culture.''

Brown said he isn't ''picking on'' homosexuals. He said a gay agenda has cropped up in American culture and that he is merely responding to it.

 

I thought only God could address sins from God's perspective, again, how does a "sinner" have the right to castigate a "sinner"?

 

The perversion and confusion of our culture, like saying that people are not on an equal footing solely for a choice of sexual preference, as if somehow being homosexual makes you less intelligent, less integrity filled, less valuable?

[It'sNotAFakeID]

I honestly think the world would be a better place if everyone took an agonistic approach to religion. We don't know, so who are we to judge, castigate, downgrade, belittle, and so on?

[NUance]

I thought only God could address sins from God's perspective, again, how does a "sinner" have the right to castigate a "sinner"?

 

I honestly think the world would be a better place if everyone took an agonistic approach to religion. We don't know, so who are we to judge, castigate, downgrade, belittle, and so on?

 

Every time you guys write "castigate" my eyes initially read "castrate". Which seems a bit harsh.

[JJ Husker]

Like knapp said, there shouldn't be a law that says we HAVE to do this. When hiring, if you have an African-American man going up against a Caucasian woman, what should be done is you take a number of core variables from that person's career life and plug them into a multiple regression model (obviously one that works [which more than likely doesn't include gender or ethnicity]) and obtain a criterion score (based on whatever aspect you're looking for). Whomever you hire, you hire.

 

The problem comes with the people who don't get hired looking way too much into things and deriving a reason that really is not there. "You didn't hire me because I'm a woman." "No, I didn't hire you because you had a lower score than the other candidate." I think what could go a long way in quelling this problem is to tell those who didn't get hired in excruciating detail why they didn't get hired. But that takes time (and more than likely money) to do, and it seems like a waste to the businesses (which is understandable).

 

But I see I have wandered slightly off topic. So let me get back to the point of this thread. I share the sentiment of the majority of the folks here when I think that Ron Brown shouldn't be fired, but he should stop using his platform as a coach at Nebraska to promote his religious views. There are more sins in the Bible than just being gay, Mr. Brown, and I am sure you have committed some of them. If God can forgive us of our sins (even though we constantly repeat them), why can't he forgive homosexuals? Is that not the same thing? Homosexuality is not the be-all-end-all sin, it does not have more value than any other sin.

 

Does a "sinner" have any right to castigate another "sinner"?

I agree with your post BBB12 except for 2 points where I think you are misrepresenting Mr. Brown's stance.

 

1- I have not seen any evidence or claims that God can't or doesn't forgive homosexuals. I do not believe that to be Ron Brown's stance on the subject at all.

2- I don't think "castigate" is a correct choice of words for what Brown has been doing. There is a big difference between calling something a sin and castigating someone for committing said sin. I know the way the media portrays it and the way gay activists respond to it makes it seem like he is being overly judgemental but I don't see it that way. Knowing what I do about Ron, I think he is simply presenting what he feels the truth is and, if anything, is trying to help these people rather than castigate them. It may only appear that he is focusing on this one sin more than others because it happens to be a current frontline issue. I think to portray him as somehow thinking he is better or less of a sinner than others is an incorrect representation.

[huskerenner]

Ron Brown is a great coach,and entitled to his opinion.If people can't deal with it,maybe They should move on.You can't get rid of coach's everytime they have an opinion you don't like.

[Omaha-Husker]

Ron Brown is a great coach,and entitled to his opinion.If people can't deal with it,maybe They should move on.You can't get rid of coach's everytime they have an opinion you don't like.

 

They don't have to go out shouting their opinion. I am sure the rest of the staff has very strong opinions on many issues, you don't see them out there sharing them.

 

With Brown's career choice his actions and the things he says have bigger consequences than most of the rest of us, he knew that when he signed up.

[Blackshirts007]

I wonder if this could have an effect on recruiting, positvie or negative, now its not likely you run across a gay football player, but if players are very religious and have his same beliefs it could be positve, and vice versa if they dont

[bhamHusker]

I wonder if this could have an effect on recruiting, positvie or negative, now its not likely you run across an openly gay football player, but if players are very religious and have his same beliefs it could be positve, and vice versa if they dont

FTFY

[knapplc]

Ron Brown is a great coach,and entitled to his opinion.If people can't deal with it,maybe They should move on.You can't get rid of coach's everytime they have an opinion you don't like.

 

Wrong-minded on many levels. Let's review:

 

Nobody is saying he's not entitled to his opinion. In fact, in the OP, I supported Coach Brown's right to voice his opinion. The clear difference is that he - HE - continually thrusts UNL into the conversation. He did it again in his statement that he would be more proud to be fired because of his religious beliefs than because of his performance. Wait a second - why are we suddenly talking about employment? This is Ron Brown discussing his opinion on gays. Why is his employment coming into play? Because - and solely because - he put it there.

 

Next, nobody wants to get rid of a coach because we disagree with his opinion. I'm certain there are people for whom I cheer loudly, both players and coaches, who have wildly disparate religious and political views. Those views are wholly irrelevant to why I'm a fan, and I don't care what their views are or how they express them. The ONLY difference is if they wrap themselves in the cloak of UNL to espouse those views. If John Cook suddenly comes out in favor of widgets, and I'm anti-widget to the core, I'm still gonna cheer for him on game day. But if John Cook uses his position as volleyball coach to promote his widget agenda, we have a problem.

 

Ron Brown IS a great coach.

 

Ron Brown IS entitled to his opinion.

 

I SUPPORT Ron Brown's right to not only hold the opinion he holds, but to voice that opinion.

 

I DO NOT and WILL NOT support Ron Brown's choice to promote his opinion under the auspices of UNL. That is not negotiable.

[bhamHusker]

The fact that Brown mentioned his employment status tells me that he's been cautioned that his job could be on the line if he doesn't knock it off.

[knapplc]

I wonder if this could have an effect on recruiting, positvie or negative, now its not likely you run across an openly gay football player, but if players are very religious and have his same beliefs it could be positve, and vice versa if they dont

FTFY

 

I'm typically not a fan of "FTFY" but that is an important distinction. It is not statistically probable that there are no gay athletes at UNL. It is not statistically probable that there are no gay athletes on the football team, right now. It is a near impossibility that we have had not just a few, but many gay players on the football team over the years. All of which is totally irrelevant to how they play football.

 

To have a coach so openly come out against gays, and do so "as a coach" for Nebraska, has got to be uncomfortable for these players. If there's a gay recruit out there, why would he want to come to Nebraska, now that Coach Brown has openly said his piece, citing Memorial Stadium as his home, standing by those words?

[knapplc]

How did I know? Well, the promotions came during a company-wide push to promote more females. And there was a HUGE uproar over these two girls getting promoted due to their lack of qualifications. At the time it was a pretty big scandal in our little corner of the world. Neither of these girls was even remotely deserving of the promotion as compared to the others in our group--either skill-wise or in terms of seniority. (It wouldn't have been such a big deal if they had three or four more years experience, and maybe led a couple of projects along the way.) Let's talk in football terms. Imagine if Andy Janovich was named the starting RB in our first game this fall (he's a walk-on from Gretna). Andy is a fine football player. Who knows, maybe he'll start some day. But right now he is not remotely qualified to be starting over Burkhead, Ameer Abdullah, Aaron Green, Braylon Heard, and a couple others. If this happened there would be a HUGE uproar.

 

I guess it's possible that management saw some nugget of managerial expertise in these two girls that was lacking in their more experienced, and apparently more highly qualified male counterparts. Then again, perhaps Andy Janovich *should* be our starting tailback come September.

 

Who said the company was having a push to promote more females? That's a clear violation of Title VII if they announced such a thing, and you would think lawsuits would have abounded after such an announcement. The EEOC would have stepped in with some very exciting paperwork for your employer, post haste.

[bhamHusker]

I'm typically not a fan of "FTFY" but that is an important distinction. It is not statistically probable that there are no gay athletes at UNL. It is not statistically probable that there are no gay athletes on the football team, right now. It is a near impossibility that we have had not just a few, but many gay players on the football team over the years. All of which is totally irrelevant to how they play football.

 

To have a coach so openly come out against gays, and do so "as a coach" for Nebraska, has got to be uncomfortable for these players. If there's a gay recruit out there, why would he want to come to Nebraska, now that Coach Brown has openly said his piece, citing Memorial Stadium as his home, standing by those words?

Neither am I. In fact, I'm about 99.95% sure that this is the first time I've ever "FTFYed" a post anywhere. I chose to do it here because, like you, I think it's a very important distinction to make. Your post matches my thinking on the subject perfectly.

[NUance]

How did I know? Well, the promotions came during a company-wide push to promote more females. And there was a HUGE uproar over these two girls getting promoted due to their lack of qualifications. At the time it was a pretty big scandal in our little corner of the world. Neither of these girls was even remotely deserving of the promotion as compared to the others in our group--either skill-wise or in terms of seniority. (It wouldn't have been such a big deal if they had three or four more years experience, and maybe led a couple of projects along the way.) Let's talk in football terms. Imagine if Andy Janovich was named the starting RB in our first game this fall (he's a walk-on from Gretna). Andy is a fine football player. Who knows, maybe he'll start some day. But right now he is not remotely qualified to be starting over Burkhead, Ameer Abdullah, Aaron Green, Braylon Heard, and a couple others. If this happened there would be a HUGE uproar.

 

I guess it's possible that management saw some nugget of managerial expertise in these two girls that was lacking in their more experienced, and apparently more highly qualified male counterparts. Then again, perhaps Andy Janovich *should* be our starting tailback come September.

 

Who said the company was having a push to promote more females? That's a clear violation of Title VII if they announced such a thing, and you would think lawsuits would have abounded after such an announcement. The EEOC would have stepped in with some very exciting paperwork for your employer, post haste.

You can choose to believe it. Or not. Your choice. But it really did happen. Just the way I said.

[NUance]

Ron Brown: "My Lord, i have done your bidding. I, Ron Brown, assistant at Nebraska, have publicly condemned homosexuality, and stood by your word. If I should lose my job as a result, it would be a greater honor than being fired for losing games."

 

 

Crazy Old Testament God: "THANK YOU. AND YOU'RE FIRED."

 

LINK

This topic made the EveryDayShouldBeSaturday blog. lol