Michigan OSU split

[irafreak]

http://espn.go.com/blog/ncfnation/post/_/id/24934/momentum-builds-for-michigan-osu-split

 

 

For years, we heard that Michigan and Ohio State never would regularly play The Game after Thanksgiving. That will change this fall.

 

When the Big Ten added Nebraska in June and a divisional split seemed imminent, most folks (including me) thought there was little chance the Wolverines and the Buckeyes would end up on opposite sides of the league. This, too, has changed as we anxiously wait the division pairings to be announced.

 

If you're paying attention to the words coming out of both Columbus and Ann Arbor, you shouldn't be surprised if Michigan and Ohio State are placed in opposite divisions.

 

Athletic directors Gene Smith (Ohio State) and Dave Brandon (Michigan) both are preparing their respective fan bases for the Buckeyes and Wolverines to possibly move their rivalry game earlier in the season. The only reason this would happen is if the teams went in opposite divisions, creating the potential for a rematch in the Big Ten championship game. They would meet every year in a protected crossover game.

 

Brandon weighed in Friday morning on WTKA radio in Ann Arbor, and the blog MVictors has a good breakdown of theinterview.

When asked if he were making the decision, would he put Michigan and Ohio State in the same conference division, Brandon paused and then answered, "No." He continued: "We're in a situation where one of the best things that could happen in my opinion in a given season would be the opportunity to play Ohio State twice, once during the regular season and once for the championship of the Big Ten."

On the Michigan-Ohio State game, Brandon said: "I think there's a distinct possibility that that game will be a later game in the season, but not necessarily the last game of the season. And that's simply because … I don't think the coaches, or the players, or the fans, or the networks or anyone, would appreciate that matchup to happen twice within the same seven-day period."

More from Brandon: "What you're really going to want is that last game of the regular season to really determine, often times, the championship -- who's going to be the champion of that division and go to the championship game and play for all the marbles. So from a scheduling/timing perspective, it’s a new ballgame, and although I love playing Ohio State in the last game of the year, I don't think it's necessarily a slam dunk that that's going to continue.

 

Translation: Get ready for Michigan-Ohio State in late October. Probably.

 

Smith was a little less direct in his comments this week to The Columbus Dispatch.

 

"I know one thing for sure -- that we're going to play [Michigan] every year," Smith said. "We may end up playing the last game of the year, or not. I just don't know that yet."

 

Smith said his one unshakable objective at the start of the realignment discussion was to assure that Ohio State and Michigan would play every year. There is no danger of that being threatened. Beyond that, Smith said it's wise to let the process play out, step by step, without trying to insist on further requirements.

 

 

Ohio State head coach Jim Tressel added this at Big Ten media days when asked about The Game: "Where it will be in the future, I'm not sure. But I don't think it will ever change in its importance to the people that are involved in it, especially, what it means to all of them and all of us."

 

There are some obvious pros to splitting Ohio State and Michigan into two divisions.

Penn State could be paired with Ohio State or Michigan instead of Nebraska to keep a 2-2 split with the league's four biggest brands, which I believe is imperative no matter what the Big Ten decides.

There could be more of a geographical division split, which many fans seem to want. Michigan and Michigan State could go "West" and be in the same division with Wisconsin, Nebraska, Iowa and Minnesota.

An Ohio State-Michigan clash in the Big Ten championship would be huge, regardless of what happened in the first meeting.

 

The big negatives relate to tradition and the importance of the first game. Will it mean as much in mid October as it does in late November? Also, splitting Ohio State and Michigan could actually decrease the number of blockbuster games that could be enhanced through protected crossovers.

 

I'm all for being more open-minded in the Big Ten, but I'm concerned about the potential ramifications here.

 

Just be prepared for this to happen.

 

 

Surprised no one had posted this yet so I will because I want to discuss the divisions here.

[schuhbdoo]

http://espn.go.com/blog/ncfnation/post/_/id/24934/momentum-builds-for-michigan-osu-split

 

 

For years, we heard that Michigan and Ohio State never would regularly play The Game after Thanksgiving. That will change this fall.

 

When the Big Ten added Nebraska in June and a divisional split seemed imminent, most folks (including me) thought there was little chance the Wolverines and the Buckeyes would end up on opposite sides of the league. This, too, has changed as we anxiously wait the division pairings to be announced.

 

If you're paying attention to the words coming out of both Columbus and Ann Arbor, you shouldn't be surprised if Michigan and Ohio State are placed in opposite divisions.

 

Athletic directors Gene Smith (Ohio State) and Dave Brandon (Michigan) both are preparing their respective fan bases for the Buckeyes and Wolverines to possibly move their rivalry game earlier in the season. The only reason this would happen is if the teams went in opposite divisions, creating the potential for a rematch in the Big Ten championship game. They would meet every year in a protected crossover game.

 

Brandon weighed in Friday morning on WTKA radio in Ann Arbor, and the blog MVictors has a good breakdown of theinterview.

When asked if he were making the decision, would he put Michigan and Ohio State in the same conference division, Brandon paused and then answered, "No." He continued: "We're in a situation where one of the best things that could happen in my opinion in a given season would be the opportunity to play Ohio State twice, once during the regular season and once for the championship of the Big Ten."

On the Michigan-Ohio State game, Brandon said: "I think there's a distinct possibility that that game will be a later game in the season, but not necessarily the last game of the season. And that's simply because … I don't think the coaches, or the players, or the fans, or the networks or anyone, would appreciate that matchup to happen twice within the same seven-day period."

More from Brandon: "What you're really going to want is that last game of the regular season to really determine, often times, the championship -- who's going to be the champion of that division and go to the championship game and play for all the marbles. So from a scheduling/timing perspective, it’s a new ballgame, and although I love playing Ohio State in the last game of the year, I don't think it's necessarily a slam dunk that that's going to continue.

 

Translation: Get ready for Michigan-Ohio State in late October. Probably.

 

Smith was a little less direct in his comments this week to The Columbus Dispatch.

 

"I know one thing for sure -- that we're going to play [Michigan] every year," Smith said. "We may end up playing the last game of the year, or not. I just don't know that yet."

 

Smith said his one unshakable objective at the start of the realignment discussion was to assure that Ohio State and Michigan would play every year. There is no danger of that being threatened. Beyond that, Smith said it's wise to let the process play out, step by step, without trying to insist on further requirements.

 

 

Ohio State head coach Jim Tressel added this at Big Ten media days when asked about The Game: "Where it will be in the future, I'm not sure. But I don't think it will ever change in its importance to the people that are involved in it, especially, what it means to all of them and all of us."

 

There are some obvious pros to splitting Ohio State and Michigan into two divisions.

Penn State could be paired with Ohio State or Michigan instead of Nebraska to keep a 2-2 split with the league's four biggest brands, which I believe is imperative no matter what the Big Ten decides.

There could be more of a geographical division split, which many fans seem to want. Michigan and Michigan State could go "West" and be in the same division with Wisconsin, Nebraska, Iowa and Minnesota.

An Ohio State-Michigan clash in the Big Ten championship would be huge, regardless of what happened in the first meeting.

 

The big negatives relate to tradition and the importance of the first game. Will it mean as much in mid October as it does in late November? Also, splitting Ohio State and Michigan could actually decrease the number of blockbuster games that could be enhanced through protected crossovers.

 

I'm all for being more open-minded in the Big Ten, but I'm concerned about the potential ramifications here.

 

Just be prepared for this to happen.

 

 

Surprised no one had posted this yet so I will because I want to discuss the divisions here.

 

The thing that strikes me about this artivle (article), is the writer assumes that Michigan is going to win its division and play OSU every year. If this article is correct and they have NU in the same division, then I think it will be NU vs OSU in late October for the conference championship much more often then UM vs OSU. I think it is fair to say that NU under Bo Pelini is much stronger than UM under Rich Rod. To annoint UM as a possible lock game against OSU in October for a championship is just (igknit). OSU is playing like a top ten school again but to say UM is playing like one is a very big stretch.

[gratefullred]

I think the writer believes sometime Michigan will be back. It may not be under RichRod, but Michigan will be back. The biggest matchup for the Big 10 will always be UM OSU, and to have that matchup twice would be best for the Big 10.

 

I like it, Penn St and OSU have a good rivalry. Nebraska Michigan will develop into a rivalry. The Big 12's biggest mistake may have been spliting divisions geographically. The only thing I want is to have whatever divisions are decided upon to be reviewed in around 5 to 10 years.

[huKSer]

There could be more of a geographical division split, which many fans seem to want. Michigan and Michigan State could go "West" and be in the same division with Wisconsin, Nebraska, Iowa and Minnesota.

 

Does any one else have issues with Nebraska, Iowa, Wisconsin and Michigan in one division and OS and PS in the other?

 

Here's a link to a Hawkeye board discussion

[NUance]

There could be more of a geographical division split, which many fans seem to want. Michigan and Michigan State could go "West" and be in the same division with Wisconsin, Nebraska, Iowa and Minnesota.

 

Does any one else have issues with Nebraska, Iowa, Wisconsin and Michigan in one division and OS and PS in the other?

 

Here's a link to a Hawkeye board discussion

Looking through that Hawkeye board thread, they don't seem to think it will be a big deal to split tOSU / Meechicken. I have my doubts they will be split. The rivalry ranks right up there with Army/Navy and Neuter Dame/USC.

[gratefullred]

OSU and Michigan would be a rival game played every year.

 

I heard on USC talk of Michigan, MSU, Nebraska, Iowa, Illinois, Northwestern.

 

I like it, I dont want to be in a division where the big players are Iowa and Wisconsin. They are both programs I respect, but I want to be in a division with a bigger player.

[Wolvie3758]

Word around Ann Arbor is that UM and OSU will be split and THE GAME will be moved up a few weeks to avoid

a rematch a week later in the event both qualified for the CCG..Both ADs at UM and OSU within the last 24hrs have

made statements that indicates this is going to happen..If true that likely means UM and Neb in one div and OSU and PSU

in another...Taking that one step further it likely means Iowa and Wisc will be split with ILL NW joining UM NEB and Pur IND joining OSU PSU...Minn & MSU split......soooo..heres my best guess estimate based on that...

 

Div A..Michigan, MSU, NEB,Iowa NW ILL

Div B.OSU,PSU,Wisc,Pur, IND, Minn

 

u can flip flop Iowa/Wisc and or MSU/Minn

[huKSer]

Isn't it strange and refreshing to get conference information from school ADs and not a spare bedroom blogger from orangeblood.com?

[Manhattan]

I hope this does not happen. I hope they just split the divisions geographically, East and West.

 

Penn State, Michigan State, Ohio State, M*ch*gan, Indiana, Purdue

 

Northwestern, Illinois, Iowa, Wisconsin, Nebraska, Minnesota

[irafreak]

There could be more of a geographical division split, which many fans seem to want. Michigan and Michigan State could go "West" and be in the same division with Wisconsin, Nebraska, Iowa and Minnesota.

 

Does any one else have issues with Nebraska, Iowa, Wisconsin and Michigan in one division and OS and PS in the other?

 

Here's a link to a Hawkeye board discussion

This is exactly why I started the thread. This is a huge mismatch for us. Wisconsin, Iowa are always competitive. Michigan may be down now but they'll improve after Rich. Mich State is a competitive team most years. Minnesota comes to play every once in a while.

 

So OSU gets PSU. Then who? Northwestern, Indiana, Illinois, Purdue. That's a little mismatched don't ya think?

[Manhattan]

I made this map to show how I think the divisions should be split:

 

[drewbudd]

I hope this does not happen. I hope they just split the divisions geographically, East and West.

 

Penn State, Michigan State, Ohio State, M*ch*gan, Indiana, Purdue

 

Northwestern, Illinois, Iowa, Wisconsin, Nebraska, Minnesota

 

I don't understand why I hear that this split is equal so often. It clearly isn't. You can say that Wisconsin and Iowa are good right now all you want, it doesn't matter. A simple look at the history shows that.

 

AP or Coaches National Titles (since 1945)

Nebraska 5, Minnesota 1, Iowa 0, Wisconsin 0, NW 0, Illinois 0

Ohio St 5, Michigan St 2, Penn St 2, Michigan 2, Indiana 0, Purdue 0

Total 6 vs. 11*

Yes, I count 1997 twice

 

Win % since 1945

Nebraska (.702), Wisconsin (.526), Iowa (.516), Minn (.472), Illinois (.451), NW (.364)

Ohio St (.749), Penn St (.736), Michigan (.717), Michigan St (.569), Purdue (.511), Indiana (.380)

Averages 0.505 vs. 0.610

Difference 0.105

 

Sounds super even to me...

 

Just for fun, lets look at the Big XII divisions in the same way. Everyone seems to agree that the North is weaker, let's see if the same number support this.

 

AP or Coaches National Titles (since 1945)

Nebraska 5, Colorado 1, Missouri 0, Iowa St 0, Kansas 0, Kansas St 0

Oklahoma 7, Texas 4, Texas A&M 0, Texas Tech 0, Baylor 0, Oklahoma St 0

Total 6 vs. 11

 

Win % since 1945

Nebraska (.702), Colorado (.577), Missouri (.524), Kansas (.460), Iowa St (.409), Kansas St (.383)

Oklahoma (.753), Texas (.727), Texas Tech (.546), Texas A&M (.546), Oklahoma St (.492), Baylor (.460)

Averages 0.509 vs. 0.587

Difference 0.078

 

So, historically the national championships stack up the same way. But, the difference in winning percentage is drastically larger.

 

When the Big XII division were formed, you could look and see that the North had Nebraska, Colorado and Kansas St. The South had mediocre Oklahoma and Texas teams along with Texas A&M. Now look it the conference. For the past decade, you have had two national title contenders in the South and for much of that decade you have had none in the North.

 

To top it off, when the division were formed, both Oklahoma and Texas had one less National Championship. Many of the north teams had a slightly higher winning percentage (along with Oklahoma and Texas having lower ones). The differences between divisions were much smaller than they are now. Imagine what could happen when the larger differences that exist in your divisional layout.

 

I'm sorry, but a geographical split just won't work.

 

Based mainly on winning percentage, with strong consideration to National Championships, this is how I have the divisions falling.

Nebraska, Michigan, Wisconsin, Michigan St, Minn, NW

Ohio St, Penn St, Iowa, Purdue, Illinois, Indiana

 

That puts us at:

Nat'l Champs 8* vs. 9

Winning % Average 0.558 vs. 0.557

*Yes, I count 1997 twice

 

This also nearly falls into a North-South alignment. Actually, if you switch Nebraska and Penn St around, you get a perfect North-South alignment. However, if you do that, you end up with a bigger winning percentage difference and a huge national championship difference (5 vs. 12). So, I think Nebraska is a better fit with the North teams (hope that a better division name surfaces).

 

This obviously doesn't take into account any rivalries and I'm sure 3 teams from the North (Nebraska, Minnesota, Wisconsin) would be fighting to have a protected rivalry with Iowa. I would be willing to concede that rivalry (we would play them 2 times every 3 years anyway once the 9-game conf schedule starts) and push for Penn St. OSU and Michigan would obviously be protected. I would give Iowa and Wisconsin theirs. Leaving, Illinois vs. NW, Michigan St vs. Indiana, and Minnesota vs. Purdue. I understand Nebraska and Penn St have no official rivalry and neither do Minnesota and Purdue. I also understand that Minnesota and Penn St do play for a trophy. But I think that everyone will agree that Penn St vs. Nebraska is more exciting.

[Notre Dame Joe]

lot's of big# teams play for a trinket. But this thread is on the mark. An east west geographic split allows Nebraska to punch her own ticket into the title game each year. I can't see the conference allowing that to happen.

[Wolvie3758]

It will NOT be a east-west split and Wisc and Iowa will be split..Nowhere has anyone said that

Neb. Mich. MSU Wisc and Iowa will all be in the same div..NOT going to happen...It will start

with UM and Neb in one Div..OSU and PSU in another..Wisc and Iowa split between the Two Divs and the

rest of the teams filled in

[Lil' Red]

I made this map to show how I think the divisions should be split:

 

 

I agree with this split because I think too many people are overlooking geography. I know people want to get the divisions competitively balanced but that is very hard to do. Remember when the North and South of the Big 12 were formed it appeared that the North would actually be stronger. Team's records change but their geography doesn't and geography has a big impact on all sports and is something that shouldn't be overlooked.