Elizabeth Warren's 11 Commandments for Progressives

[LukeinNE]

 

Nah, I teach science. But I have lived through Johnson's inflation, Nixon's wage/price freeze, and Carter's hyper-inflation.

 

 

 

Total aside: I find it remarkable that just 40 years ago we had a Republican President implementing price controls. Talk about a paradigm shift since then. I doubt even a President Warren would try something like that.

[NUance]

 

Raise the minimum wage so they can collect more taxes on everyone to pay for the social programs.

Don't forget it will also fuel inflation - so with the new higher salary will eventually equate to the same position relative to the new higher poverty level.

 

Say you earn $17k and the poverty level is $20k. Your new salary jumps to $22k, but inflation makes the poverty level go up to $25k

 

 

^^ This pretty much nails it. +1

 

Minimum wage isn't necessarily a bad thing, but it does contribute to inflation. And if we increase inflation it's just going to hurt the old people on fixed incomes that don't automatically adjust and won't keep pace with inflation. So it's a balancing act as to who we want to protect. Who is more important to society, an elderly person who worked for 50 years and and now lives on a fixed income? Or some 18 year-old with no education and few marketable skills? Perhaps if we keep minimum wage at an uncomfortably low level people will be incentivized to increase their marketable skills.

[JJ Husker]

What's crazy is that these positions make her radically liberal these days.

These positions don't make her radically liberal. I'm fairly conservative and I don't think they're even basically liberal but rather just common sense. However, I am sure there are some on the far right tea party side that would complain how liberal this list is without actually being opposed to much of it.

[LukeinNE]

 

What's crazy is that these positions make her radically liberal these days.

These positions don't make her radically liberal. I'm fairly conservative and I don't think they're even basically liberal but rather just common sense. However, I am sure there are some on the far right tea party side that would complain how liberal this list is without actually being opposed to much of it.

 

 

My concern isn't that the statements themselves are radically liberal, it's that I think the means required to accomplish many of them would be unpalatable. The only one on that list that I can agree to right now is #3, because it's the only thing on her list that fights government intrusion rather than requires it.

 

Others, say #2 and #10, are ones where I agree with the statement, but almost certainly would disagree with her policy prescriptions. On #2, I can agree that basic environmental protections are necessary to make sure companies aren't utterly destroying the environment. However, because it's coming from her mouth, I hear "we're going to regulate coal, oil, and natural gas out of existence and borrow money to prop up a thousand Solyndras."

[JJ Husker]

 

 

Raise the minimum wage so they can collect more taxes on everyone to pay for the social programs.

Don't forget it will also fuel inflation - so with the new higher salary will eventually equate to the same position relative to the new higher poverty level.

 

Say you earn $17k and the poverty level is $20k. Your new salary jumps to $22k, but inflation makes the poverty level go up to $25k

 

^^ This pretty much nails it. +1

 

Minimum wage isn't necessarily a bad thing, but it does contribute to inflation. And if we increase inflation it's just going to hurt the old people on fixed incomes that don't automatically adjust and won't keep pace with inflation. So it's a balancing act as to who we want to protect. Who is more important to society, an elderly person who worked for 50 years and and now lives on a fixed income? Or some 18 year-old with no education and few marketable skills? Perhaps if we keep minimum wage at an uncomfortably low level people will be incentivized to increase their marketable skills.

 

Exactly. People tend to ignore that increasing wages causes the price of the product to increase and is passed on to the consumer, who often times is the same person that benefitted from the wage increase. But the people on fixed incomes (elderly and disabled) only experience the inflation side of the equation. Also, increasing costs and the resultant sales prices for these fast food chains will also cause them to increase their margin. They have a target margin they want to make....if they want to make 10% ($1.00) on a $10 cost and that cost goes up to $12, now they will structure it to make $1.20 etc. It won't come out of the big boys pockets, it will be passed on to the consumer, some of whom can afford it and many of whom cannot afford it.

 

There have to be some jobs in our society that just aren't suitable for raising a family or even being fully self supporting for one person. Sorry but not every job needs to keep a person above poverty level and, as stated previously, if we do raise those wages, the net result is simply that the poverty level increases. Low/No skill jobs will never put a person on easy street and they shouldn't.

 

And this is purely anecdotal but it has been quite a long time since I've experienced a fast food worker who seemed deserving of any sort of a raise. I'm sure there are some sharp ones out there but getting a burger in a drive thru really should be a lot smother process than it usually is. These aren't Rhodes scholars.

[Creighton Duke]

 

 

 

Raise the minimum wage so they can collect more taxes on everyone to pay for the social programs.

Don't forget it will also fuel inflation - so with the new higher salary will eventually equate to the same position relative to the new higher poverty level.

 

Say you earn $17k and the poverty level is $20k. Your new salary jumps to $22k, but inflation makes the poverty level go up to $25k

 

^^ This pretty much nails it. +1

 

Minimum wage isn't necessarily a bad thing, but it does contribute to inflation. And if we increase inflation it's just going to hurt the old people on fixed incomes that don't automatically adjust and won't keep pace with inflation. So it's a balancing act as to who we want to protect. Who is more important to society, an elderly person who worked for 50 years and and now lives on a fixed income? Or some 18 year-old with no education and few marketable skills? Perhaps if we keep minimum wage at an uncomfortably low level people will be incentivized to increase their marketable skills.

 

Exactly. People tend to ignore that increasing wages causes the price of the product to increase and is passed on to the consumer, who often times is the same person that benefitted from the wage increase. But the people on fixed incomes (elderly and disabled) only experience the inflation side of the equation. Also, increasing costs and the resultant sales prices for these fast food chains will also cause them to increase their margin. They have a target margin they want to make....if they want to make 10% ($1.00) on a $10 cost and that cost goes up to $12, now they will structure it to make $1.20 etc. It won't come out of the big boys pockets, it will be passed on to the consumer, some of whom can afford it and many of whom cannot afford it.

 

There have to be some jobs in our society that just aren't suitable for raising a family or even being fully self supporting for one person. Sorry but not every job needs to keep a person above poverty level and, as stated previously, if we do raise those wages, the net result is simply that the poverty level increases. Low/No skill jobs will never put a person on easy street and they shouldn't.

 

And this is purely anecdotal but it has been quite a long time since I've experienced a fast food worker who seemed deserving of any sort of a raise. I'm sure there are some sharp ones out there but getting a burger in a drive thru really should be a lot smother process than it usually is. These aren't Rhodes scholars.

 

[carlfense]

However, because it's coming from her mouth, I hear "we're going to regulate coal, oil, and natural gas out of existence and borrow money to prop up a thousand Solyndras."

Eh?

[tschu]

 

There have to be some jobs in our society that just aren't suitable for raising a family or even being fully self supporting for one person. Sorry but not every job needs to keep a person above poverty level and, as stated previously, if we do raise those wages, the net result is simply that the poverty level increases. Low/No skill jobs will never put a person on easy street and they shouldn't.

 

 

Why should a full-time job in the richest country on the planet not support one person? What is the justification here? And don't give me some "market value" bullsh#t, because market value dictates that we buy our shoes from children working for 5 cents an hour in a basement in China, which isn't right either. America is so absurdly rich that if we aren't trying to make a full-time job pay self-supporting wages, what are we even doing here.

[tschu]

Most are very broad statements that help her position herself so that if anyone even tries to debate them with an actual honest and common sense debate, she will rush out with the..."you sexist/racist/homophobe that hates poor people".

 

rofl tell me you don't truly believe this

[BigRedBuster]

 

Most are very broad statements that help her position herself so that if anyone even tries to debate them with an actual honest and common sense debate, she will rush out with the..."you sexist/racist/homophobe that hates poor people".

 

rofl tell me you don't truly believe this

 

What is there not to believe?

[knapplc]

 

 

Most are very broad statements that help her position herself so that if anyone even tries to debate them with an actual honest and common sense debate, she will rush out with the..."you sexist/racist/homophobe that hates poor people".

 

rofl tell me you don't truly believe this

 

What is there not to believe?

 

 

Do you know who Elizabeth Warren is? Have you ever heard her speak, or watched any interviews?

[LukeinNE]

 

However, because it's coming from her mouth, I hear "we're going to regulate coal, oil, and natural gas out of existence and borrow money to prop up a thousand Solyndras."

Eh?

 

 

"We're going to take care of the environment" means very different things depending on who says it. Surely you can appreciate that.

 

 

Do you know who Elizabeth Warren is? Have you ever heard her speak, or watched any interviews?

 

 

https://twitter.com/elizabethforma/statuses/483638466543357953

 

Demagogic whoppers like that one are about all I need to know about Fauxcahontas' intellectual integrity. And I disapproved of the Hobby Lobby decision.

[BigRedBuster]

 

 

 

Most are very broad statements that help her position herself so that if anyone even tries to debate them with an actual honest and common sense debate, she will rush out with the..."you sexist/racist/homophobe that hates poor people".

 

rofl tell me you don't truly believe this

 

What is there not to believe?

 

 

Do you know who Elizabeth Warren is? Have you ever heard her speak, or watched any interviews?

 

I know exactly who she is. I have read a number of articles on her....etc....etc...etc.

 

I also know how politics works and I know how the Democratic party works on these very issues. For instance, if you raise any question as to if we should raise minimum wage, it goes right to...."you hate poor people".

 

Heck, we have already seen it in this thread. Duke stated his opinion and immediately the reaction was...."so, you're not for equal pay for women"?? (i.e.....are you sexist?) It's the typical political wall that goes up.

 

I have no doubt she believes this stuff. However, I also believe that it is political positioning coming out with a "10 commandments". Anyone who even questions the commandments is going to be sexist, racist, homophobic and hate poor people.

 

But...hey.....it will get about 40% of the population on their feet praising...... something......

[tschu]

And a few basic statements that you don't even disagree with has you fuming about something that someone possibly might say. So that's interesting.

[BigRedBuster]

And a few basic statements that you don't even disagree with has you fuming about something that someone possibly might say. So that's interesting.

Ummmm....who's fuming. Rolling my eyes and yawning isn't fuming.

 

edit....and....I never said that I agree with all of them.