Penn State Scandal Thread

[huKSer]

 

I'm not sure what to make of this shirt. Are there actually people who support Sandusky? Really? If it's a joke it's in very poor taste.

A couple of posters on a comment section were upset that he was convicted because there was no PHYSICAL evidence only "heresay" (their words) from the victims. Or trolls

[Excel]

 

I'm not sure what to make of this shirt. Are there actually people who support Sandusky? Really? If it's a joke it's in very poor taste.

A couple of posters on a comment section were upset that he was convicted because there was no PHYSICAL evidence only "heresay" (their words) from the victims. Or trolls

Outside of his family and close friends I can't imagine anyone would support him and even with them I'd doubt it. Is his wife still with him? Got to be a hell of a time for her.

[Hingle McCringleberry]

I've been reading a few different forums and everyone, across the country, is talking about this case. I have two random thoughts;

 

1. People seem happy to bash PSU, Paterno and State College for allowing Sandusky to cause as much damage as he did and it certainly seems like there is some blame to be had on the University's part. From that I get two questions. What will happen to Penn State? ..and..Could this happen elsewhere?

 

Lawsuits seem likely but what about other consequences? Will it impact football?

 

It's also troublesome because, at least for me, if you showed me a picture of Sandusky I wouldn't think he'd be a child molester. He doesn't exactly fit the profile that I imagine people like that to be.

 

These crimes clearly aren't restricted to swarthy, overweight, balding, candy-van-driving middle aged white males living in their mother's basements, they can be committed by anyone at any place...even universities outside of PSU. In my opinion PSU isn't worthy of contempt because they employed a sexual predator, they're contemptible because they enabled him by knowingly allowing his behavior...for the institution the problem is not the event but their reaction. Would other schools have stopped this earlier? Is PSU an anomaly? What conditions caused this?

 

2. This is a personal struggle of mine in that I find myself really wanting Sandusky to die, painfully. I have an issue with this because I'm not a big fan of capital punishment even for most murderers but his actions seem to be on the highest rung on the ladder of evil.

 

 

I'm not a lawyer but this is my gut feeling. 1. Penn State will be held accountable in some way. Crap happened on campus, was witnessed by Penn State employees, and was not followed up or properly reported (some evidence points to cover up as well). The victims have a right to damages because of this IMO. Penn State the institution shows lack of institutional control, the President declined to report anything about Jerry because it might upset him, Paterno waffled about when (or even if) he reported the info to others.

 

Once all the criminal cases are settled I think the NCAA steps in with something big, I honestly think the death penalty is the best option, allow the kids to keep the scollys if they want to stay, clean house and let the system reset in a few years. Over all PSU would be better off getting time between the scandal and the program, give it a few yeas then start again, to go forward like everything has changed is dishonest. In the end I wonder where blame will be laid, Jo Pa is dead, and lots of people are looking for an escape route.

 

As for Jerry himself, I dont know, I have a hard time wishing any man dead even though I support the death penalty. He will get his soon enough, I think his last years will be terrible, and I have no sympathy for him.

[knapplc]

[Foppa]

Interesting Knapplc. But one thing I know...

 

If my friend is accused of a heinous crime, I will back him 100%, under the condition that they consult the proper authorities and sort it out that way. Nothing to lose if there is nothing to hide and no conscience to haunt you. A true friend would understand that rationale. This may have been where the moral standard and friendship may have broken down, if only JoePa had the guts to confront and do the right thing.

[Moiraine]

Interesting Knapplc. But one thing I know...

 

If my friend is accused of a heinous crime, I will back him 100%, under the condition that they consult the proper authorities and sort it out that way. Nothing to lose if there is nothing to hide and no conscience to haunt you. A true friend would understand that rationale. This may have been where the moral standard and friendship may have broken down, if only JoePa had the guts to confront and do the right thing.

 

Here's a problem I have with that. McQueary was allowed to remain a GA and then hired as a coach at Penn State. JoePa either had to assume that there was wrongdoing or that McQueary was lying. But instead he hired McQueary as a coach and Sandusky was allowed to keep using the PSU facilities.

 

 

So if you were trying to come up with a similar situation, the person who makes the accusation is a good friend, and after nothing happens to the accused, you stay friends with both of them and act like nothing happened.

[Foppa]

Interesting Knapplc. But one thing I know...

 

If my friend is accused of a heinous crime, I will back him 100%, under the condition that they consult the proper authorities and sort it out that way. Nothing to lose if there is nothing to hide and no conscience to haunt you. A true friend would understand that rationale. This may have been where the moral standard and friendship may have broken down, if only JoePa had the guts to confront and do the right thing.

 

Here's a problem I have with that. McQueary was allowed to remain a GA and then hired as a coach at Penn State. JoePa either had to assume that there was wrongdoing or that McQueary was lying. But instead he hired McQueary as a coach and Sandusky was allowed to keep using the PSU facilities.

 

 

So if you were trying to come up with a similar situation, the person who makes the accusation is a good friend, and after nothing happens to the accused, you stay friends with both of them and act like nothing happened.

 

Good point. How long was it from the time McQueary was hired as a coach after the allegation? I guess all I meant is that 'innocent until proven guilty' is important, and I wouldn't abandon a friend. If it turned out to be true though, especially something like this, it'd be pretty hard to keep the friendship going.

[Okie 'Sker]

Wait, it gets worse.

 

Per ESPN:

 

Former Penn State officials exchanged emails in 2001 to determine how they would deal with allegations of inappropriate behavior against Jerry Sandusky, according to a CNN report.

According to the report, emails between former Penn State officials Tim Curley, Gary Schultz and Graham Spanier show the trio initially planned to tell authorities about the allegations against Sandusky, who was convicted on 45 of 48 charges against him last week.

However, the three men opted not to alert authorities after speaking with "Joe," according to the report.

"After giving it more thought and talking it over with Joe yesterday, I am uncomfortable with what we agreed were the next steps. I am having trouble with going to everyone, but the person involved," read one of the emails, according to CNN.

During the Sandusky trial, prosecutors said Schultz, a Penn State vice president, kept a secret file containing allegations of inappropriate behavior against Sandusky that directly contradicted statements Schultz made to the grand jury investigating the disgraced former defensive coordinator under longtime coach Joe Paterno.

"The commonwealth has come into possession of computer data (again, subpoenaed long ago but not received from PSU until after the charges had been filed in this case) in the form of emails between Schultz, Curley and others that contradict their testimony before the Grand Jury," the document states.

The document also states that Schultz, who also oversaw the school's police force, "created, maintained and possessed" the file.

 

 

 

Honestly, I think Penn State deserves the death penalty here. I know there are coaches, staff and players there now who had nothing to do with this, but if those coaches, staff and players are truly committed to the university and helping it recover its image, then they'll stay. If they want to head to greener pastures, I don't blame them. Because I think the hammer is going to come down. Hard.

[tschu]

I was banned so I couldn't post it, but about a week ago, a very respected poster on PSU's Scout message board posted the following message:

 

irondoc

[scout Subscriber]

Butkus Winner

7013 posts this site

Ignore this Member

Send Private Message

 

Nominate | Report

 

Posted: Today 10:00 PM

 

Absolute possible worst case scenario is true

 

Is what it is. My children, twins, and their graduation party today. a friend was one of the investigators on this case. there will be from 11 - 30 more victims coming forward. Sandusky had little asterisks behind the names of the victims.

 

Spanier, Baldwin, Curley, Schultz ,and Joe Paterno were all complicit in a cover up. Joe was mentioned in emails.

 

Sandusky was forced out and they all knew why. Bradley and Ganter perjured themselves on the stand. thank God they hired outside.

 

And my friend mentioned if he was not dead Paterno would be arrested. the BOT is right. Joyner is right, and Corbett is right.

 

It was as bad as the worst accusations. I know this fellow for fifteen years and trust him implicitly. I will answer questions from moderators in pms, but no one else. This stuff might or might not come out, but this person is privy to all the emails, evidence and such. He was actually on television last night when Sandusky came out of the courthouse.

 

 

I was at a function today where I had this conversation. I willl not respond more to this thread, only to moderators in pms with the promise of privacy.

 

Based on the emails that are now coming out, this appears to most likely all be true.

 

Honestly, I think Penn State deserves the death penalty here.

 

No. This is a legal issue. This is not an NCAA issue. This has nothing to do with the NCAA at all. They didn't get a competitive advantage on the field, which is all the NCAA is responsible for. Don't worry though, they're going to get something far worse than the death penalty: loads and loads of jail time. The university, the football program, and the fans have suffered enough as a result of these men's actions. Death Penalty would accomplish absolutely nothing.

[Moiraine]

No. This is a legal issue. This is not an NCAA issue. This has nothing to do with the NCAA at all. They didn't get a competitive advantage on the field, which is all the NCAA is responsible for. Don't worry though, they're going to get something far worse than the death penalty: loads and loads of jail time. The university, the football program, and the fans have suffered enough as a result of these men's actions. Death Penalty would accomplish absolutely nothing.

 

I don't know the actual wording of any of the NCAA rules. Is it an attempt to gain advantage or just gaining an advantage? I would say covering up nasty crap like this in order to protect your football program's good name and maintain recruiting levels is an attempt to gain an advantage over what they assumed they were going to have if this all came out.

 

I would also argue that it would accomplish something. It would be a warning to other schools to immediately report things like this instead of sweeping them under the rug.

[HUSKER FREAK]

No. This is a legal issue. This is not an NCAA issue. This has nothing to do with the NCAA at all. They didn't get a competitive advantage on the field, which is all the NCAA is responsible for. Don't worry though, they're going to get something far worse than the death penalty: loads and loads of jail time. The university, the football program, and the fans have suffered enough as a result of these men's actions. Death Penalty would accomplish absolutely nothing.

 

I don't know the actual wording of any of the NCAA rules. Is it an attempt to gain advantage or just gaining an advantage? I would say covering up nasty crap like this in order to protect your football program's good name and maintain recruiting levels is an attempt to gain an advantage over what they assumed they were going to have if this all came out.

 

I would also argue that it would accomplish something. It would be a warning to other schools to immediately report things like this instead of sweeping them under the rug.

AMEN to that Moiraine!! I just got done reading the report and watched the video on CNN that was on the other night. It IS VERY disturbing. I Can Not even imagine what could have been going through the minds of the Penn St officials. That, isn't even right to say because that's FAR FAR from Humane in any way. What they did to protect the name of the program is beyond unexcusable and there is no way to describe how bad they let down so many victoms by trying to save the face of the program. I hope they all rott in hell for what they didn't do along with Sandusky. One other person I was talking to recently had said they need to take down Joe Pa's statues the only thing I added to that was to melt it down as well.

[tschu]

No. This is a legal issue. This is not an NCAA issue. This has nothing to do with the NCAA at all. They didn't get a competitive advantage on the field, which is all the NCAA is responsible for. Don't worry though, they're going to get something far worse than the death penalty: loads and loads of jail time. The university, the football program, and the fans have suffered enough as a result of these men's actions. Death Penalty would accomplish absolutely nothing.

 

I don't know the actual wording of any of the NCAA rules. Is it an attempt to gain advantage or just gaining an advantage? I would say covering up nasty crap like this in order to protect your football program's good name and maintain recruiting levels is an attempt to gain an advantage over what they assumed they were going to have if this all came out.

 

I would also argue that it would accomplish something. It would be a warning to other schools to immediately report things like this instead of sweeping them under the rug.

I get that, and there may be some merit to this. And if they want to hit them with some penalties, fine. I just think the death penalty would accomplish absolutely nothing. We all know what they did was wrong. They're going to pay for it. The university and football program are paying for it already; their rich tradition and history has been totally shattered, their "legendary coach" as he was once called is gone. They have nothing. To kill the program completely is pretty harsh towards a lot of people who had nothing to do with the crimes committed and would not affect those who were responsible in any way. I know its the natural reaction to get angry and call for the Death Penalty, but it just doesn't make sense.

[Comish]

No. This is a legal issue. This is not an NCAA issue. This has nothing to do with the NCAA at all. They didn't get a competitive advantage on the field, which is all the NCAA is responsible for. Don't worry though, they're going to get something far worse than the death penalty: loads and loads of jail time. The university, the football program, and the fans have suffered enough as a result of these men's actions. Death Penalty would accomplish absolutely nothing.

 

I don't know the actual wording of any of the NCAA rules. Is it an attempt to gain advantage or just gaining an advantage? I would say covering up nasty crap like this in order to protect your football program's good name and maintain recruiting levels is an attempt to gain an advantage over what they assumed they were going to have if this all came out.

 

I would also argue that it would accomplish something. It would be a warning to other schools to immediately report things like this instead of sweeping them under the rug.

I get that, and there may be some merit to this. And if they want to hit them with some penalties, fine. I just think the death penalty would accomplish absolutely nothing. We all know what they did was wrong. They're going to pay for it. The university and football program are paying for it already; their rich tradition and history has been totally shattered, their "legendary coach" as he was once called is gone. They have nothing. To kill the program completely is pretty harsh towards a lot of people who had nothing to do with the crimes committed and would not affect those who were responsible in any way. I know its the natural reaction to get angry and call for the Death Penalty, but it just doesn't make sense.

Yet, right now their recruiting class is supposedly superior to ours......

[tschu]

Your point is?

[huKSer]

SMU - the only school to get the death penalty - was on probation for paying recruits when they got caught paying recruits and fairly blatantly so at that. They were thumbing their nose at the NCAA and they had no choice but to close down the program. There is no precedent here for the death penalty.

 

Now as far as sanctions and other penalties: there are only two ways for the NCAA to get involved - lack of institutional control or as Moraine said "I would say covering up nasty crap like this in order to protect your football program's good name and maintain recruiting levels is an attempt to gain an advantage over what they assumed they were going to have if this all came out." The second doesn't seem logical - if the admin the moment they found out and looked proactive and turned Jerry over to the authorities it would have the admin protecting the innocent with little repercussions for the program. The evidence shows that the admin was going to do just this, but JoePa stepped in and said it was to protect Jerry's rep, not the programs rep, to sweep it under the rug.