Any of you football heads want to explain 2 gap scheme?

[dvdcrr]

Some more points: 1 gap defense requires linebacker movement to whatever gap the lineman is not shooting. Second: 1 gap defense can be effective if you have undersized but very active DT, and finally, 1 gap is effective if the other team does a lot of pulling ( guards or tackles.)

[Hayseed]

Wouldn't it be better to play 1 gap and get our linemen into the backfield to disrupt the play, block passes, etc? 2 gap sounds like too much guessing to me and relies on linebackers too much. It also doesn't sound like a good way to generate a pass rush. Do most teams use 2 gap or what?

You could, yes, but if the backs get by those DL's, and the OL's have gotten to the LB's (which is what some of them are trying to do), then you get gashed.

 

We ran this in high school out of a 44. We didnt really call it 2gap, but that's what it was. The 4down's job was to gobble up all the blockers and let the LB's run free. We'd even have our DT's on a consistent basis just submarine the guard and center on trap plays. Read a pull, and just dive for legs. Create a pile. Guard cant get around, center cant block down. Total mayhem. If you got caught shooting a gap, you were on the bench. That program has one of if not the best defense in c-1 year after year after year. They consistently have multiple linebackers in the top 10 in the state in tackles. I played 12 years ago. Last year they only allowed 2 touchdowns the entire regular season. It's just the deal that it has to be executed right. Bo and Pap are at a loss for words right now because they dont understand why they cant get the guys to execute it in games. Something tells me they perform it well in practice.

 

I understand what they're trying to do now, I just don't believe it's the best for a couple reasons. With the current rules favoring the offense it allows our d-linemen to be held without a penalty. I understand that rushing the wrong gap might allow holes to open for the runner but with everyone starting 7 yards back I think some quick linemen like we appear to have could get a bunch of tackles for loss by shooting the gap and grabbing everything in sight. What we have now is a disadvantage for our lb's as well who don't seem to even be in on the play until 2 yards past the line, if they're lucky enough to even be there. This current D also gives us a sucky pass rush unless we're willing to sell out with a blitz and get burned that way. Maybe most importantly, this D doesn't get the guys fired up like an all out rush would. You'd think 2-gap would be a more popular style in the NFL since they have the talent at every position and the qb's are less likely to get flustered there, but I don't think it is.....I imagine because NFL linebackers are so talented that they aren't worried about linemen as much (they probably think the linemen are giant punks and dare them to come upfield and try to block them).

[Bowfin]

Let's consider the 1/2 gap, where we have two people manning every gap. We'll make the other team pinkie swear at the coin toss not to pass, so that should free up the bodies on the field.

[husker_rob]

There are pluses and minuses to any scheme.

 

Agreed. Schemes are nothing more than Xs and Os strategy, and there are no shortage of ways to draw Xs and Os to stop offenses or, conversely, to attack defenses. They all have their strengths and weaknesses.

 

The problem is that we're not coaching robots and execute Xs and Os. We're coaching human beings.

 

We've heard for the last few seasons that it's not the scheme, it's the execution (ie, players). Time and time again, collapse after defensive collapse, it's the players, not the scheme.

 

So.... what exactly are our coaches waiting for in seeing if our players might connect a little better when implementing a different Xs and Os scheme? 700 yards in a game? 80 points against us? 5 consecutive TD drives? I would argue we could have seen any of these things already at the hands of Wisconsin or Ohio St if they wanted to do so.

 

Our current mix of scheme and personnel isn't working, and hasn't worked, for quite some time. We keep waiting for the right personnel. It's getting old watching the same result.

[TheSker]

Our current mix of scheme and personnel isn't working, and hasn't worked, for quite some time. We keep waiting for the right personnel. It's getting old watching the same result.

Listen to Pelini's post game presser. You might find it beneficial.

[jmfb]

At this point the scheme SEEMS to be like putting a square peg through a round hole

That is giving credit to the scheme

If all we have is square pegs, then maybe it's time to figure out a scheme where square pegs can have some reasonable success

WIth this offense- NU DOESNT have to be perfect on defense, just average to win 10-11 games

[husker_rob]

Listen to Pelini's post game presser. You might find it beneficial.

 

Thanks. I'll do that. Saw some comments about it in other threads, and I really need to watch.

[cg_8]

Bo had brought up the point that they switched from two gap to one gap. But that requires that LB's play gaps and that a safety comes up for additional help. It pays dividends on the 3rd and long plays (where we got sacks), but as you saw on one particular 3rd and long play, where the qb just barely got out and completed a pass to a WR. He was completely wide open and was less than a yard short. It leaves holes in the defensive backfield. I know Bo says "execute" a lot, but if you play one way or the other and you don't execute. Something bad could happen. Whether executing means lining up correctly, hitting the right gaps, LB's hitting the right gap. LB's missing coverage, or simply just not getting the qb down, something bad will happen. The one gap almost got them a first down on that play, due to poor execution (not executing getting the sack).

 

When you usually play a cover two (like we do), and you take out a safety, it puts more pressure on the outsides. The CB need to stay tight in coverage. REALLY tight.

 

You should note that also, the one gap is not just simply "hit that gap and have fun". If that gap is not where the play is going, the DL needs to press the OL into the play. Also, your gap is predictable and allows for other OL's to move forward to the second level (LB's) to block them on running plays.

 

What we have to remember is that this is not simply "DLine plays one gap, fun will happen". You have to ask yourself, are you willing to play one gap and leaving free OL's to get to your second level (LB's)? Or do you want your LB's free to read the play and make a play. Unfortunately, for the two gap, no MIKE has been able to read as well as he should. That's just inexperience. I see it better in Banderas than I do in Santos. Santos takes to long to read and doesn't react quick enough, often not hitting any gap at all and catching up to the rb when he passes him. Banderas has the ability, just needs more experience. Remember, David wasn't an instant hit. It took him a few games to get his bearings too.

 

There's plus and minuses to each. I personally like two gap. It allows that second level to make more plays rather than just being blocked. I just hope that those MIKE's play better. I see it in Banderas, he just isn't quite there yet. The two gap also allows us to play a cover two, which I have always liked. More can be said, but football is extremely complex. You can draw up perfect plays to confuse the other side of the ball, only to have the ball go the other way for a TD. The difference is usually "who made the bigger mistake". Was there a missed block? Was there a missed assignment? Did someone cover the wrong guy? Did we hit the wrong gap? Was the route cut shorter than it should have? They don't call it a "game of inches" for nothing.

[Hayseed]

This is a great thread and it deserves to be on top of those other Mickey Mouse threads.

[boach_clack]

so what the hell is the reason for the D line lining up a yard off the line?...sounds like read and react tactic as opposed to attack? is there any other college team that gives up a yard on defense.

It's like conceding a whole yard before the ball is snapped. Who else runs a 2 gap?

First and 7 considering they do it for 3 plays.

 

It is done primarily when the defense is expecting a pass play when the extra yard gives some momentum to a DT pass rush to help collapse the pocket.

 

 

The one yard is to give time for the defensive lineman to read the steps of the o-lineman. Its a read step. The 1 yard allows for the time to read it.

[alwayshusking]

The two-gap has turned into the no gap scheme. Better off just attacking one gap, because our DL simply aren't capable of controlling two gaps. Haven't been for a few years.

[alwayshusking]

What does Michigan State run? They are number one in total defense this year, and were pretty good the last couple of years too.

 

Here's a pretty good breakdown from a Michigan fan of what MSU does. Love what Narduzzi does there.

 

http://mgoblog.com/d...fense-rope-sand

[NUinID]

Wouldn't it be better to play 1 gap and get our linemen into the backfield to disrupt the play, block passes, etc? 2 gap sounds like too much guessing to me and relies on linebackers too much. It also doesn't sound like a good way to generate a pass rush. Do most teams use 2 gap or what?

You could, yes, but if the backs get by those DL's, and the OL's have gotten to the LB's (which is what some of them are trying to do), then you get gashed.

 

We ran this in high school out of a 44. We didnt really call it 2gap, but that's what it was. The 4down's job was to gobble up all the blockers and let the LB's run free. We'd even have our DT's on a consistent basis just submarine the guard and center on trap plays. Read a pull, and just dive for legs. Create a pile. Guard cant get around, center cant block down. Total mayhem. If you got caught shooting a gap, you were on the bench. That program has one of if not the best defense in c-1 year after year after year. They consistently have multiple linebackers in the top 10 in the state in tackles. I played 12 years ago. Last year they only allowed 2 touchdowns the entire regular season. It's just the deal that it has to be executed right. Bo and Pap are at a loss for words right now because they dont understand why they cant get the guys to execute it in games. Something tells me they perform it well in practice.

 

When I last coached we ran a one gap 3-5-3 defense. Got it from Jenks, Ok. It was a very high risk/ reward defense. Everyman has a gap he is responsible for and that responsibility was not the same every play and could change before the snap. Our linemen's job was to get to the backfield and disrupt the play. The most important thing was to teach them to not just come straight up the field and get too much penetration, a yard and a half at the most.

 

We fully expected to give up at least 1-3 big plays every game, but we would also triple that in negative plays.

 

At its core it was a very simple defense that gave a lot of freedom to our LBs to read and make a decision. Our DC didn't like the lack of control and started putting in more called plays from the sideline. He was a control freak but it actually took more decision making out of the equation and allowed them to react more.

 

Nothing like this would work in college the passing attacks are too sophisticated, but a one gap or control gap would be preferable IMO. The Defense would give up some on the back end but that is the tradeoff

[BigRedBuster]

What does Michigan State run? They are number one in total defense this year, and were pretty good the last couple of years too.

 

 

They run a 4-3 Over Cover 4 most of the time. Though I think they also switch up to 4-3 Under at times and go man on the CB's and cover 2 zone on the Safeties.

 

 

Those schemes above are 1 gap.

 

 

For a list of teams that do run the 2gap system: Alabama runs 2 gap. Wisconsin runs the 2 gap quite a bit. Utah State runs the 2 gap. Hawaii runs the 2 gap. Texas A&M run some 2 gap. Washington plays 2-gap. Iowa runs 2 gap.

 

Something almost all of those teams have is at least 1 DT that is disruptive with massive strength. That's what the scheme needs.

 

 

 

 

Hail Varsity spoke with Charlie McBride and asked him about 2-gap. Here's the thoughts: http://hailvarsity.c...-talks-two-gap/

 

Do these teams also have two high safeties with only one LB in the box many times?

[Enhance]

The scheme isn't that much of a problem, more so the missed assignments are. We've seen this defense work but that's when the players were upholding their responsibilities. But, as Pelini commented today, we had eight guys in the box on one play and gave up a big run. Guys just flat out aren't doing what they're supposed to.

 

Some of the more unfortunate statistics I've heard today - Nebraska is giving up 8 yards per play on first down and allowing opponents to get a first down, on 1st and 10, 35% of the time.